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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Thinking of taking plumber to the small claims court

26 replies

MissWing · 25/09/2014 13:14

We're building an extension on our house. The builder asked his plumber friend to do the relevant plumbing. Once on site the plumber told me that our hot water tank was a major H&S risk and needed replacing, I say, 'go ahead and do it'. He said, 'if you like I can put the new tank in the loft, it'll give you better pressure and free up your airing cuplboard', I said, 'ooh, great yes please' he said, 'I'll have to board some of the loft', I said, 'that's fine go ahead' (my FIL boarded the last loft in a saturday morning- it's not a big deal, I thought)

Yes, this was entirely stupid on my part, I should have asked for a quote. I accept that. I was expecting the work to cost, well I don't know, maybe a few hundred pounds. The plumber presented it all pretty casually so it felt like simple, necessary work. He offered no cost estimate. I stupidly didn't ask. (I was signed off work sick with anxiety post-miscarriages x 4 so not feeling 100%)

The plumber then spent a couple of weeks replumbing the entire house. He built a massive construction in the loft to support the hot water tank, he then led individual pipes to every tap/appliance in the house. He then invoiced us £4,700. His invoices were done by week and the work was mixed in with the extension work, so it was initially not obvious how costly my mistake was. We paid him in full (mistake number 2, I realise now that we should have paid his materials, complained and negotiated on the labour costs, but my husband did not want to upset the plumber or the builder)

I know any action now is closing up the stable door after the horse has galloped away over the hill and back whence he came, but I really don't want to leave this situation as is.

I plan to write a very even-handed letter explaining that by effectively concealing the scale of the work and the costs, then invoicing this sum, this amounts to professional misconduct. No-one could be expected to commission nearly £5k of plumbing without getting several quotes and a detailed discussion of our needs. I think he has behaved very unethically. The repercussion for us is that I'll be going to our lender tomorrow to seek more funds to finish the build.

Ironically, the new plumbing doesn't actually suit our plans for the house as it all goes down the middle of a separate bathroom/toilet that we plan to knock into two, so it will all have to be moved again in due course. If he had spoken to us about the work, this would have become apparent.

Final point in this sorry story. One day I returned home and he proudly told me that he had gifted the old hot water tank to the labourers (scrap metal), 'so the boys could have a well-deserved night on the pop'. This further makes me think he just saw us as juicy mugs that could be squeezed for everything to suit himself.

In fact he's a perfectly aimiable guy and probably doesn't feel he cheated us at all.

I really want to send him this letter, I'm using all the guidance on the citizens advice website. Sometimes I just think posting the letter will be sufficient. Others I think 'hell, I'm prepared to go as far as the no claims court to claim some of this money back.'

Very grateful for your thoughts, but please be gentle, I've cried enough over this one as it is.

OP posts:
DwellsUndertheSink · 25/09/2014 13:17

Im afraid you accepted the work without a quote and you paid it...I cant see that you have any claim.

OliviaBenson · 25/09/2014 13:23

I also think you don't have a claim, sorry OP. I feel for you - we had an issue with our plumber. We just had to draw a line under it for the sake of our sanity, I think you need to try and do the same. By all means write the letter and let rip- just don't send it as I think it will cause you more heartbreak.

I'm very sorry for your loss by the way x

babykonitsway · 25/09/2014 13:23

You must have realised the amount of work that was going on especially as you were signed off work and could see what was going into it?

You say he "by effectively concealing the scale of the work and the costs, then invoicing this sum" - he didn't conceal anything, you didn't ask for it so from a legal point of view the onus is on you.

Sorry to say but I'm 99.9% sure you don't have a leg to stand on. Accept what has happened and take it as something to learn from. Sorry, can only imagine how frustrating this is for you.

crossandcrosser · 25/09/2014 13:25

It's awful for you but I don't see how you could lodge a claim.
I once took a car in for it's MOT & said 'do what you have to to get it through'. They did, for £3.5K. Chalk in down to experience.

cailindana · 25/09/2014 13:26

He was totally unethical. But you don't have a leg to stand on, legally. He told you what he was going to do, you didn't request a quote, you paid him and the work was done to a reasonable standard (I presume?). He did take advantage of you, but no in an illegal way. Sorry.

H2OWoe · 25/09/2014 13:26

I do feel sorry for you but: (1) when we got a quote for the same scope it was £4,500 so we did not go ahead so I do not feel you were ripped off, and (2) you were extraordinarily casual in your commissioning and overseeing of the work and unfortunately, as Dwells says, you accepted the work without a quote. As for the piping being in the wrong place, you should have made the work conditional on a detailed scope description as well as a price and you did none of that.

I think you need to chalk this up as a lesson learned and in future, use a project manager or building advisor for big jobs. Remember, prior planning prevents .....

NorwaySpruce · 25/09/2014 13:27

I'm not sure that you'd get anywhere.

£5000 for the amount of work that was done sounds pretty reasonable to me.

You effectively gave the plumber a free hand. The work has been done, and isn't faulty, and you paid.

For all he knew, you had quotes coming out of your ears.

daddyorchipsdaddyorchips · 25/09/2014 13:30

Without being too harsh, you made the mistake and you wouldn't have a leg to stand on in court, IMO. Put this down to very bitter experience, learn from it and don't make the same mistake again.

I'm sorry about the MCs.

ellenjames · 25/09/2014 13:36

Sorry but as soon as you paid you accepted it really. Am shocked you didn't ask more etc, but understand these things happen when suffering mental health issues.
I think you have to lump it I am afraid, but would be interested if anyone legal knows otherwise?

londonrach · 25/09/2014 16:16

Really sorry op but unless you have a quote before and so you know the cost breakdown and what you paying for and what he was doing i dont think you can claim anything back. Consider posting this in legal or popping to cab to discuss it with them. However i would concentrate on getting yourself better. Really sorry about the mcs. Xxx

sanfairyanne · 25/09/2014 16:28

you made out that price didn't bother you and then you paid up. i don't see much room to complain later on. 4 weeks work sounds a lot of labour costs as well tbh

combust22 · 25/09/2014 16:28

Sorry this has happened. Chalk it up as a life lesson.

wonkylegs · 25/09/2014 16:44

I'm sorry I don't see a case here.
You have been naive & it's given you a nasty shock but the plumber did what he was told to do, the work was of satisfactory quality (not flooding your house, heats etc) and therefore has technically done nothing wrong.
You would have had a case if you had specified something and he had done something else, he had quoted one thing and charged something completely different (without warning), the work had been faulty.
I think unfortunately you will need to chalk it up to an expensive lesson.

Tabby1963 · 25/09/2014 16:48

Oh OP, what a mess Sad.

This is an expensive lesson, isn't it? Next time get three quotes detailing all aspects of the work and time scale, materials used etc.

You will waste even more money taking him to court. He didn't do anything wrong, you did by not taking the matter seriously at the time, and, like other posters have said, it doesn't sound an excessive amount.

UncleT · 25/09/2014 16:57

Sorry, but no chance. You told him to go ahead. You also paid up fully. I know you regret that and I'm not saying this to be nasty, but I'm afraid the only hope you have if at all is to appeal to his better nature for a reduction. You have no basis to bring a claim.

Groovee · 25/09/2014 17:03

He should have provided you with a quote but you didn't ask for one either then you've paid it in full.

I think it would be a waste of your time and money to take him to court.

A very expensive way to learn a lesson.

ghostland · 25/09/2014 17:08

The moral of the story: always get a quote (or 3) first!

Andrewofgg · 25/09/2014 17:10

Even if you succeed - have you any idea how difficult it would be to collect your debt?

atticusclaw · 25/09/2014 17:23

I would agree I'm afraid and have some knowledge in this field. You have given him consent to go ahead and do the work. He asked if you wanted him to do it, you said yes. There is no law regulating the rates he charges.

Scholes34 · 25/09/2014 17:41

it might seem a lot, but the differential between a cheaper plumber for the same work and what you paid is probably minimal.

When our builder knocked down an original wall in our house, the bricks, in the contract, became his. What would we have done with a pile of bricks covered in mortar? What would you have done with an old water tank? He was probably trying to point out that he'd been generous to his labourers, rather than taking the scrap metal cash himself.

Chalk it up to experience and in the meantime enjoy your spacious airing cupboard.

atticusclaw · 25/09/2014 17:52

Actually it was your tank not his but you didn't say anything at the time and so again you'd be hard pushed to do anything about it.

EhricLovesTheBhrothers · 25/09/2014 18:59

How could you think it would be ok to force him to pay you back for work and materials he carried out/bought in good faith? He's done the work you told him to do, he's bought a lot of building materials that have gone in to your home, and you paid him. It's a horrible idea that you could the. Take him to court and make him pay you back, thereby making him work for weeks for free on your house and losing £££ on the materials that are in your house.
Thankfully you won't have a chance of doing this since this is all on you.

EhricLovesTheBhrothers · 25/09/2014 18:59

However he did essentially steal your old water tank so I suppose you could try to get him to pay you for that. Not really worth it though for scrap value...

MrsCumbersnatch · 25/09/2014 19:06

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ajandjjmum · 25/09/2014 19:23

Rookie error. Sorry OP. Always get a quote, even if it is for what seems like small works.

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