to give my DD an ultimatum

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DD has just turned 18. For the last 2 years she has been pushing to live elsewhere, either with her Dad, grandparents or boyfriend. She has never actually made the decision to leave home for good but has spent a lot of time sleeping away from home IYSWIM. Recently she has found a friend who owns a flat and has taken to dossing down on her floor. She spent practically all of the summer there. Now that college has started again we had an agreement that she would spend weekdays at home and then she could do what she wanted on a Friday and Saturday. However, she has not stuck to this at all.

The problem with all of this is that not being here means she doesn't contribute in our family life at all, comes and goes as she pleases, it is very disruptive for me and my younger DS and I never know what her plans are. She leaves her bedroom in a complete mess when she's not here so wet towels are left to go mouldy, clothes are left lying in dirty heaps and I end up looking after her guinea pigs because she is not here to do it.

I am angry that she only thinks of herself, cares little for the home I am struggling to pay for and walks all over me when I try to bring some certainty to the situation. So do I make her choose just to bring an end to the extreme frustration and anxiety I feel or should I continue to put up with this?

I think communication has broken down here and I can understand why. Teenagers are hard to talk to, they get so angry and loud so quickly! Try putting your expectations in writing and say they are a starting point for negotiations so you can work together? This gives her time to read and digest on her own, her anger will not be directed at you, and she has time to think. Then she can come to you with some changes she wants to make.
I would definitely aim to get rid of the guinea pigs, but not suggest it at first, let her come to the idea by saying you can't keep looking after them as they are her responsibility. She will need to find a way, and if she can't she needs to think about a new home for them.
Most older siblings can find their younger siblings very annoying and hard to tolerate at all. But she should have basic standards of politeness that all adults have to love by!

Well actually I think she is doing a lot of growing up at the moment. She is looking after herself at her friend, does all her washing and ironing. She is paying her way too re bills and food.
But when she is at home, she is reverting to be a child to you, her mum. So leaves stuff in pile in the room, expects you to pick up behind her, incl looking after the animals.
Start treating her as an adult. Close her bedroom door and leave her stuff there. It's not getting washed. And if towels are mouldy and needs replacing, she will have to but some new ones. Give the animals to her brother (or you, or a friend).
And most importantly stop pandering to her. She hasn't told you if she is here? Assume she isn't. If there is no food cooked for her when she comes in, she'll have to cook her own meal. Or she might find the house empty. Keep to your routine that works for you and your ds and accept that it's her that needs to fit in rather than the other way around.

And before all that , have a word with her, explain how impressed you are at her independence. And she is welcome in your house as long as she wants. But that she needs to have the same respect for your house than she has for her friend (remember, their agreement probably means that she doesn't have to tell her friend where she is all the time, etc).

Well that's what I mean.m sometimes the family dynamics are so entrenched that it's not really possible for the child to fully become an adult within that environment.

I agree, make it about all the positives.

kick her out

Ouch, Branleuse, that's a bit harsh IMO before giving the poor DD a chance to sort out her act! Hey we were all 18 yo. My DSS has suddenly "become" self centred and it does hit hard when it seems they don't care, turn their nose up at you, all that crap. But despite wanting to punch a wall or do the icebucket challenge on them over-reacting isn't constructive.

Agreed - if, after a constructive conversation, DD completely ignores the warning signs and doesn't get the hint (eg Im rapidly running out of patience!), then isn't that the time to ramp it up some more? Saying get out and stay out (the implication of "kick her out" I presume?) is premature just yet.

Loads of suggestions here. Priority is the guinea pigs. You right little cafe natural place. Dont raise voice. If the guineas are neglected again they are rehomed. As for the rest i think she needs to have some rent charge. If she agreed to move out agree make her bedroom a guest bedroom she can return to if needed. Oh to be 18 and so knowledgable! Good luck op x

Accept that she can move out and don't put up any resistance to it.

Rehome pets.

Let her be a child some of the time while she does her A levels, if that is what she needs. But id say she should review her tidiness every weekend and spend time tidying up before she leaves, or the night before. It is a good habit to get into and will take her far in life, maybe furthwr than her A levels! As long as she speaks to you in a friendly tone and lets you know when she will be home for meals, let her be your child and lower her standards during times of stress. Beginnings of school year/revision/exam times and when ill. I agree with the poster that says she is doing a lot of growing up. This sometimes means they forget other things that they are not concentrating on. That's alright. There is far worse she could be doing.

It's only for another year, and then she will be gone. She could go before that, it is up to her. Once she leaves though, you can redecorate her room and it is then your spare room. If she wants to stay at home, she'll need to ask in advance in case you have YOUR friends staying over.

Sew a coloured border to towels/allocate certain colours to each person and keep asking that they hang them up to dry.

She pays her kid brother in advance to look after the guinea pigs or they go for rehoming/PTS on the first day she doesn't come home to feed, clean and water them. I believe a veterinary nurse would charge 8-10 per home visit.

Open a window to ventilate and then close the door on her room

Otherwise - everything CaptainFracasse said assuming she is not being destructive or disruptive when she is around. Tell her that you would love to see more of her but you won't continue to waste food and so she needs to agree which evenings she will be in, or buy and cook her own food. Then she needs to let you know by X day before you do the weekly shop if she's planning to be out on a planned evening in. There will be college events etc.

Then I would give it a month or two. Keep things friendly, then rethink if necessary.

Alternatively, have a huge row, kick her out or give her an allowance and tell her to move in with her friend.

Why kill the guinea pigs? It's not their fault! OP's DD is behaving badly but killing her pets could permanently damage their relationship. If she is unable to look after them they should be carefully rehomed.

PTS was aimed at being a more motivational threat for the OP's DD than a real one. Not all animals can be rehomed easily and many animal charities operate a policy of PTS after a period of time.

Personally, if my adult child was neglecting pets left in my home [which is a criminal act for which I would be responsible for as the home-owner], if I couldn't or wouldn't take on their care [which I would be within my rights to] then I would operate on a 3 strikes and they're out basis.

I'm actually fairly pissed off at the attitude of the OP as much as the daughter regarding the GPs.

How old are the GPs because its pretty relevant to the argument. If they are older than 2 years then the daughter could not legally get them, and they would have to be the responsibility of the OP too. And in all honesty, even if they are younger than two years then why did the OP allow the daughter to get, when the daughter's long term future was questionable regarding her accommodation. I do feel in this regard the OP needs to take responsibility for the pets even if the daughter does not.

The OP should have considered the long term implications for those animals; if it wasn't the Dad or the Grandparents, what would happen if the daughter decided to go to university?

Would there be talk of rehoming them in this situation? It sounds like the daughter leaving the home was a realistic prospect for some time.

I hope those poor animals do not end up in a rescue as a result of this and the need to 'rehome'. If they need to go, then please please find new owners to look after them and actually give a shit about them, rather than arguing about who should be responsible for their well being as you both should share it.

My mum (after losing her rag at the state of my room - admittedly rank with dirty clothes/towels - am so mortified looking back ) simply bagged everything up on the floor and cast over the bed in a bin liner and threw it out my bedroom window

She them said it only come back in the house via the washing machine which at 17 I was surely capable of using and any other rank items would be disposed of in the same fashion.

Bags left in the garden beyond 3 days would go in the bin.

Worked a treat when I realised id be naked in about 2 weeks if I didn't get my act together!

The guineas will not be neglected and I would take responsibility for them if they had to be rehomed. I tread a fine line making sure they are cared for whilst trying to get my DD to take responsibility. They are hers but she was a child when she got them.

They are hers but she was a child when she got them.

No, you got them for your daughter who wasn't deemed legally able to take on that responsibility at that age...

Sorry, but I do think you did not think of the animals welfare if your idea of taking responsibility is to rehome them when your daughter can't be arsed with them anymore.

I agree with everything CaptainFracasse says.

And I think your DD is getting a hard time on here. She is growing up. She wants to spend more time with her friends than she does at home. And she's obviously capable of washing her own clothes at her friend's house.

So let her be a grown-up at home too. She's an adult now. If her clothes are in a pile on her bedroom floor then that's where they stay. She'll soon wash her clothes when she needs something to wear! And if she's out, then she's out.

Even at 21 when I briefly came back to live at home for a few months, my mum had some obsession with dinner. From Day 1 I told her not to cook me anything, I would either cook myself something or eat something when I was out. But she would still cook me dinner, then moan that I wasn't at home to eat it

I moved out pretty quick!

Rehoming guinea pigs isn't the same as killing them!

Betty, my children will probably say I have an obsession with dinner, too, but it's because if I don't cook for them and then they come in, they use up food that I was going to use later in the week, leading to my having to go shopping/pay for extra food. It's hard to budget when people are coming and going.

Imperial, that makes sense. But I would always get food if I was out. So would never come home having not eaten anything. And if I wasn't sure what my plans were then I would buy something for dinner on my lunch break at work and cook it when I got home or save it for another time if I did end up going out. I also gave my parents £120 every month to contribute.

So I never quite understood what my DM's dinner obsession was when me eating at home or not wouldn't affect her at all.

To be fair, my DM didn't want to cut the apron strings in most aspects but I wanted freedom. DM now babies my 30yr old DB who has no intention of moving out or learning how to use the washing machine