To think that whilst I was worrying about being seen as sexist, more laddish types were out there getting girlfriends

[fishdishwish]

I spent years, especially as a student (and still do to an extent), worrying about asking girls out or even complementing them for fear of being thought of as sleazy or pervy. Meanwhile, all the 'cheeky charmers' were out there having a whale of time.

I went wrong somewhere, didn't I?

Well some like the cocky jack the lads, but while they have a way with the ladies, I am not so sure about their staying power or committment. I perferred the shy quiet type, and dh is one of those.

Fuck, no. Top of my list of men (people in general, actually) to dislike and avoid are a) arrogant, cocky bastards and b) people who are not just themselves...

dh is a reliable, decent gentleman who has never cheated or given me cause to cheat

My "100% fuck no" check list indeed includes the sexist 'jack the lad' type. Generally if they're a stereotypical man into stereotypical 'man stuff' I'm not interested.

Much prefer an intellect that can offer up an interesting conversation, way sexier.

'Cheeky charmers' are only good for one thing.

Well maybe the fact that they actually asked girls out in the first place explains it? You won't have got anywhere if you didn't even ask them. Flirting and asking women out isn't necessarily disrespectful or sleazy in itself.

Not sure. Looking back, I spent most of my student days getting off with men who coached my sports team. Usually this involved waiting until we were both extremely drunk at an after-event party, and I would then lean against them until something happened. They may well have been 'cheeky charmers' and indeed sexist, but tbh mostly they were doing something that brought them into my life.

I don't know whether they had a 'whale of a time', most of them complained quite a bit of being taken advantage of by predatory women.

Do you now have a partner?

you could just chalk those years down to experience and now is the time to get out there and go and chat up some laydeez.

Well if you want honest answers mine is that yes you went wrong.

Worrying about how you are seen is not very attractive whether you are a man or a woman.
You see, you dont even say that you just want to respect your woman. You are saying that you want to be seen as you do. Thats a put off to me.
But i m sure that many posters will tell you welldone etc.

What is wrong with asking someone out?

Just be yourself.

Perhaps all the 'cheeky charmers' weren't sleazy or pervy, and perhaps you had other features beyond not being sleazy or pervy that put them off.

'Nice guys' always seem to think not being a bastard means they should automatically be attractive to women, whereas not being a bastard is a baseline level of normal human being and not something to be rewarded in itself.

Not a fan of 'cheeky charmers' at all. But, equally, there's nothing very attractive about someone who overthinks everything. Or who can't have a conversation without constantly clarifying each comment or overanalyzing it afterwards, as if women are these mysteriously volatile creatures who must be handled vairy vairy carefully.

Not saying that's you. I'm watching Peep Show, though. Jeremy or Mark? Neither.

Some men actively cultivate the cheeky charmer image to fit in with their mates. DH was one of these.

dh is a reliable, decent gentleman who has never cheated or given me cause to cheat

Er...cause to cheat?

Not a fan of chheky charmers or players either but when i was younger and i supose bettr looking i fooloishly allowed myself to be used.

Fake feminism to pull women wouldnt work. Either u r an equalist or u r not. So be a decent man if u r a decent man!!

I don't think you went wrong.

But some women find the 'I'm a nice guy, gimme a cookie because I didn't objectify you' thing equally off-putting. Not saying you were consciously doing that, but it's one to watch for.

as if women are these mysteriously volatile creatures who must be handled vairy vairy carefully

Yes indeed. If you're constantly worried about offending people by saying the wrong thing, you either believe women over react to inoffensive statements, or you hold various offensive opinions which you are trying hard not to reveal.

Outgoing, confident, cheeky even...none of this necessarily means sexist or sleazy.

Don't make the mistake mistake of thinking a lack of experience/success with women is because 'good guys come last' or women only want bad guys.

It's silly, self-pitying nonsense usually spouted by bitter men. The types who actually think the friend zone is an actual thing.

Usually this involved waiting until we were both extremely drunk at an after-event party, and I would then lean against them until something happened.

This was my method too, Joan. Always worked.

Well, sometimes!

YY to. #Poddling#.

joanofarchitrave - nope, I'm still single (38 now)

Poddling - I suspect it might have had something to do with having the 'sleazy' thing levelled at me a few times when I was 16 or 17. In some ways, I probably over-reacted to that (FWIW, non-one has called me sleazy since then!).

im not sure i see the issue. you wouldn't have necessarily have got girlfriends if youd have gone around acting like a cock either.
sounds like you spend too much time worrying about the impression you give , which might look like lack of confidence. You dont need to act like a jack the lad to have successful relationships, in fact it puts many off

I'm a nice guy, gimme a cookie I got offered a cookie once, it may have been in FWR. I said "no thanks, I have cake. And beer." :o I don't hold feminist views to 'get cookies' but because it chimes with what I believe is right and fair.

In my experience men who say they are nice guys never actually are, they have an entitlement complex and think that being "nice" automatically guarantees them entrance to a woman's knickers, then spam the internet with misogynistic drivel about how nice guys always finish last.

The cheeky chappies you mention in your OP are just confident and confidence is attractive. I know a lad like the one you mention in the OP and he has women chucking themselves at him because he's flirtatious and charming with ALL women not just the ones he fancies. Young, old, fat, thin and everything in between. Little old ladies adore him.

You sound bitter OP and bitterness is horribly unattractive.

Confidence is sexy. If you're afraid of offending a woman with a compliment you're not exactly exuding confidence.

If what you're doing with women doesn't come across as gay if you do it to a man, you're doing it wrong. You can't just act "nice" around women. We expect you to be a decent human being regardless, you don't get a prize for that. You need to be clear that you're attracted to them, and you can do that without being sleazy or weird.

Women aren't rejecting you because you're too "nice". They're rejecting you because you're too insecure and afraid to make the first move.