I really need some perspective here

[3stripesandout]

DD 4 had her first day at school today, her sister and brother also attend here.

When I picked her up she was upset and quiet in the car. I left it a while to ask her how her day had been. She said she was told off and had to sit on her own for 5 minutes until she stopped crying. I presumed she was embellishing whatever had happened and made a note to speak to the teacher tomorrow (thinking that would be ridiculous on her first day at school!)

DD(9) came out of school and launched into an almighty tirade about DD4 getting in trouble and being shouted at. Her story is that DD4 had spotted DD9 through the foundation gate and called her over, they were hugging through the gate and DD4s TA came over and told DD9 to move back into her bit of the playground and told DD4 to move away from the gate. DD9 and DD moved off but DD4 went to the other gate (foundation playground is in the big playground but fenced off) and called her sister again. DD9 says that at this point the TA shouted at DD4 to move away from the gate, got hold of her by her arm and pulled her towards her. DD4 starts crying and runs off, TA then grabs her again and puts her on the bench on her own for 5 minutes (crying) until playtime is over.

After this story I'm at DD9 thinking there is major embellishment going on. There were no staff in foundation when I asked at the office but the head came out to speak to me. She had already been informed by DD4s teacher what had happened and backed up DD9s version....except she said she wasn't aware if DD had been grabbed and didn't think she would've been left alone on the bench crying (DD9 swears blind she was as does DD4). The head was also surprised I hadn't been told at pick up.

I have asked the head to get clarification as to what happened exactly and I will go in tomorrow to discuss.

AIBU to think you don't shout or grab a 4yr old on their first day of school? The head said Dd4 was having a tantrum and that's why she was put in time out. She also said DD4 was climbing the gate (it's a waist height u bend one, there's no where to climb it!) and that if DD was grabbed it was because the TA didn't want her to fall.

I'm fucking upset that DD has had such a crappy first day at school! Is this normal crowd control with foundation kids?

Small bump

Well, I don't think there's much you can do about it until you have the full story, but a couple of things do stand out:

1. It is certainly possible to attempt to climb waist-height u bend fences (as my 2.5 year old will gladly prove!) so could it have been that she was messing around in a way that looked dangerous and the TA did grab her to ensure she didn't fall?

1. Shouting is another subjective thing, so whilst I believe that your kids probably thought of it as shouting, a TA trying to make herself heard over the rabble of a playground is a different type of shouting to an angry tirade. (Also, could she have been directing her shouting towards your older daughter as someone who 'should know better' rather than your youngest?).

1. It does sound as though the TA didn't do anything until your daughter repeated the behaviour that she had already been told not to do so I can see how some form of discipline would have been appropriate, but you would have thought that they would be a bit more lenient on kids who were just starting and wouldn't know the rules or possibly be able to remember them straight off!

The TA might have been completely in the wrong, your kids might have completely misinterpreted things, but I suspect the truth is somewhere in between and hopefully things will be a lot clearer tomorrow!

Oh sounds really sad. They should have taken the time to get down on her level and explain she can't be hugging through the gate. Even if she was having a tantrum, it's her first day at school, you expect emotions to be high.

Did the head accept this was inappropriate? Certainly the TA seems to have over-reacted and shouldn't have been manhandling DD4 over something which seems to have been relatively innocuous. If the Head doesn't have a satisfactory explanation it could be worth asking for the school's restraint policy and any written records of the incident.

Ok - so what is so wrong about hugging your sister through a gate?

I was just about to say the same thing as Funky
Why on earth can't they hug through the gate for goodness sake?! Does it break some bonkers health and safety rule?

Funky, the head had no answer for that other than "this kind of thing happens every year with siblings".

No she didn't think it was inappropriate, but was surprised I hadn't been told at pick up as she had already been informed!

I also don't understand why it's a problem for siblings to talk to or hug one another.

If they are climbing, then fair enough, get them down, but how is anyone at all harmed in any way by kids talking to each other?

It's like some weird form of segregation what's the point?

Oh that's really sad :(

My littlest pre school is also in school grounds and playground is in the school playground but fenced off.

I know dd often sees her big brothers and they hug and chat through the fence and the ore school have no problem with this. Sometimes they are taken into the main playground and dd will find her brothers and play with them or sit with them.

Presumably the areas are separated to give the little ones a safe space to play without the rough and tumble of the bigger kids games. We had a similar arrangement at my primary school (although the gate was made of dinosaur bones in those days!) and people weren't allowed to stick any body parts through the bars because there was a lot of children trying to lift each other over, grabbing each other's arms and yanking them etc, so I assumed that it wasn't specifically hugging that was banned so much as the poking of body parts through the bars.

Well this is ridiculous. DD2 has just started secondary, and has shared a few hugs there with DD1 (13). wtf is wrong with that???

Did you get the full story today OP?

Poor little dd4. Ideally older siblings should be allowed to be around, especially for the first few weeks.

Sorry, I guess I just froze on DD9 ... Are you a cat?

Oh, never mind, that's their age!

Sounds horrible. The TA immediately went to punish your DD with a time out rather than just being kind to a very young child adjusting to her first day at school. I could imagine that being quite terrifying for a 4 year old on her first day at school!

Even if she was tantrumming, 4 year olds aren't being 'bad' when they tantrum, they're usually just stressed or struggling with an emotion they can't express. Surely anyone with childcare or even just parenting experience knows that.

What kind of qualifications does this TA have to work with children? I would definitely question this with the head. At 4, your DD should feel she can trust the school staff, not be scared of them punishing her.

Yup. That TA was out of order and lacking in the basic empathy needed.

Even if your DD was utterly wigging out temper tanty screaming, a time out alone on a bench isn't how any kid needs to start her school years.

Go and tell the head that you feel that your DDs school experience MUST get better and that you hold her responsible for making sure this happens.