to think DH being a spare part in parenting can't be cured?

[PeppaPug]

I have spoken to DH on several occasions about how I feel he is a 'spare part' with regard to parenting. He never disciplines the children or makes decisions, he will always just wait and wait until I take action. For example - tonight I was ironing (exciting Saturday night, hey!) and DD (2) was struggling to do something. I could see him in the mirror imploring me to do something (he was sitting watching tv) and he didn't move. DD got frustrated and was then round my ankles crying, I said I'm ironing DD, why don't you play X with daddy?', she said no and carried on crying. He ignored her for ten mins before saying 'should I try and distract her?' by which time she was bloody distraught and would go nowhere near him.

Yesterday, I was brushing my teeth and could see DD playing with a ball with her brother. It kept going near the top of the stairs which have no gate with DD chasing it hysterically. I could see DH looking concerned but he just kept looking from me to the stairs, waiting for me to say something to them.

He has never told our 2 year old off, encouraged her to eat/listen/be polite etc and his only contribution is to possibly play if she initiates it. Everything else is left to me. He'll nag the older children but not actually do anything when they don't listen to him. AIBU to think he is an incurable sap and to stop stressing myself out with resentment?

Read wife work - a bit depressing tbh but very helpful. He CAN help - he manages to be responsible for all sorts of other stuff for example at work? You need to delegate tasks to him in their entirety including the thinking bit. Have you tried responding to his questions in a kindly tone with "What do you think?"

Alternatively go away for a fortnight and go cold turkey - they and he will survive!!!

When I returned to work full time dh reduced his hours and did the afterschool pick up and tea. We tried sharing stuff for a while but it wasn't great so I delegated the whole food shopping, planning and cooking over to him (I do most of the "proper" cleaning and we share the rest). We had several ropey meals, we don't eat as healthily or as cheaply but he managed and it improved over the first few months. Best of all is the head space I gained - I do not think about food/cooking/shopping at all! If I pop to the supermarket I will jot down what I'm aware of but I ask him what we need and miraculously he looks in the fridge and cupboards and tells me...

Shock horror I even travelled away with work for up to 4 nights at a time and it all ran smoothly in my absence.

Tbf from day one I did let him have responsibility for the dc for several hours etc. and quickly learned to leave him alone to make his own mistakes! I do admit to hanging all their clothes up in "outfits" though - still dressed them back to front occasionally somehow

I agree with RandomMess. People need to let them take equal charge from day 1 - if they didn't then they need to stop giving them answers and remove themselves from the situation.
Personally I would just go away for the weekend without issuing any directions and let him get on with it. They will survive!
It will never change if you allow him to be the extra child and leave yourself as the 'expert' parent.
I laughed at your clothes comment, RandomMess, I used to itch to interfere with my DH's odd sense on which clothes went together!

I admit you have to do a lot of tongue biting! Shock horror my dh even learnt how to wash, dry and put back together our washable nappies...

Dh has learnt how to do the laundry as well, he sees it's overflowing then does it these days! He's always helped hang it out, sort it and put it away - again I had to show him and leave him to it. The girls also help with this now.

I only let him start with the dark wash (I am anal about stain removal etc.) lo and behold he took on doing other stuff and there were several "accidents" again I had to bite my tongue and explain what he had done wrong and that there are so many exceptions to the basic rules with our clothes that's why I had told him to stick to the darks only. Now he even does the more complicated stuff or manages to extract it and leave it for me (we're talking silk or delicate clothing, nasty stains etc.)

He will sort into white/dark/Pink & Purple (), check for stains (bit hit & miss but his eyesight is rubbish) treat them or leave the item and then get one with it. I did have to write on the machine which programme for which load only because I got fed up of him using a cotton cycle that leaves everything crumpled though!

My dh again is a people pleaser frightened of getting things wrong so abdicates and does nothing, the difference is I "made" him get on and do it.

DH isn't as bad as some of the examples on here by any stretch - he is perfectly capable of looking after them and disciplining and all sorts but i the early days with DS I could see how it could go that way and I actively "made" him be in charge - eg packing the changing bag. When he asked me to check it I would say "right well, what have you put in?" Once he'd listed it out loud he could usually think for himself if he'd missed anything. OP if this really is a confidence thing you'll have to build it up gradually, one task or skill at a time, eg ,meals, or bath/bedtime etc. Ask him, "what time are the kids having dinner?" just start giving over some of the tasks bit by bit.

You need to start in day1! It astounds me how. Any couples have no experience of babies and yet the woman from the first instant is the one to be the expert on everything and he has to ask! Hand him the baby and let him change the nappies, choose what to dress the baby in etc.
Too many women are 'in charge' with the new baby and they eventually wake up to the fact that they are doing it all and it is a bit late to suddenly expect equality.
You do have to let him do it his way. I do everything my way- if someone expects me to do it their way the obvious answer is to hand it to them and say 'you do it then!'.

Sorry- ended up with full stop. Should have been 'it astounds me how many couples.
It would be interesting to know how often OP's DH got sole charge of the first baby in the first 6 months. That is probably the key to his dependency.

Why do people marry or tolerate men like this?

Okay next Saturday you go out for 10 hours. Your husband has the child and the house to look after. Repeat for 10 weeks in a row. He will soon get the hang of it.

If it's the case that he really wants to help, bt feels helpless, like the "scared, watchful child that grew into a scared, watchful adult" as PasingFlatly described - then would he go to counselling? Sounds like his self-esteem and confidence are at rock bottom.

And I'd be the last to let someone off the hook if I thought they were simply being lazy.

BTW, in case I'm describing ex as the deficient one, I should add that by the end he was actually trying to do stuff and I was the problem: I was so locked into the "Oh you're so useless" belief that I was undermining him.

Even though I was acutely aware of it, it took real effort to break the mental habit.

I'm sure you won't do that, though, because you're aware and also not entrenched.

Gosh - my dad was like this - he was appalling parented himself and therefore had zero emotional intelligence and was so passive it drives you nuts. DH also struggled for a while.

Basically you have to teach him - really really baby steps and totally obvious stuff such as "if you do bath time you need to x, y,z" - my mum actually used to write instruction lists for my dad and he followed them - and still does.

Also, don't assume he knows or is confident about anything - stress the most important things are 1) he engages with his kids on some level and 2)he feels he can do something to allow you to do something else which will make you less stressed and will improve your marriage (been there).

Your DH may also feel that women are more suited to child rearing and have a built in instinct over what to do - explain this is total rubbish - you've just had loads more practice than him. Also, is he worried about doing it "wrong"? There are a lot of ways things can be done - he can find a way if he thinks about it.
Practice problem solving together - "ok we need to do X, what steps do we take to achieve this." so he has to engage with each task.

If he has low emotional ability (a lot of men do) then he will really benefit from reading "how to talk so kids listen and listen so kids will talk". This really helped my DH when he struggled to connect with DD.
Being a dad is a FUN THING - I think a lot of dads forget that. You can have fun with kids (although a lot of it isn't) and get to know them and having a kid really look up to you is a great thing. Talk to your DH so he sees child rearing as a joint project - not a spectator sport for him. Men often use different language from women and think more of goals, projects, tasks etc and don't do emotional instinct stuff (they think they can't do it, it's just they have never been taught - big difference). He needs to realise that he is where you were when the kids were born but somehow his skills didn't progress and yours did - so he just will have to learn, like you did (like we all do).

One thing my DH did was do the bath times straight from go - I was so ill I couldn't lift DD so he had to do it. The midwife taught him and I can truly say if there was a baby to be bathed right now I'd be going "um" and he'd be off happy as larry - because he learned and practised and I didn't.

See if your DH can make the leap to being a "fun" dad maybe - my DH taught himself balloon modelling in order to connect with children in a way he could cope with. I know that's a weird example but it was a task he set himself that worked and he gets a lot of fun from it and kids know he has pockets stuffed with balloons now! He's always popular at school do's and he feels great about it.

I would do that Greengrow- I refuse to teach an adult man anything- it is making him out to be the child.
Go out every Saturday for at least 6 hours without instructions- the best way to cope is to have to cope.

If someone really has no idea, they can be forced to cope by being left alone, and they can go on a parenting course.

There are plenty of mothers who have had terrible parenting themselves who have had to learn this way.

A parenting course would be a good idea but if OP was rushed off to hospital tomorrow of course he would cope! He would have no choice.

It is a vicious circle- she doesn't think he will cope- so she doesn't leave him to cope- so he never learns to cope -so she don't leave him to cope.

She could at least try it the once as an experiment. Announce she is going out after breakfast next Saturday and will be back at 9pm. See how it goes.

Could you just refuse to give him any answers/instructions?

EG. do the ironing in your bedroom with the door shut and tell him he's in charge, the kids need a bath, and let him get on with it? Tell him not to disturb you but just do whatever he feels is best?

God, he sounds tedious and like a drip.

I'm sure counselling/discussions etc would be the more mature ways to deal with it, but personally I'd take the much less mature going-away-for-the-weekend approach. And not responding to texted questions except with a blanket 'Do what you think best.'

You only need arms to care for a child so anyone who says they can't is lying. in our case from the start we had as much time with the baby as the other so no one got any better than the other. My children's father had had his own house when we met and I hadn't so he was the expert at things like how to work dishwashers, how to clean a hob. It is a great way to start. Feminism helps - if you refuse to believe even for an hour that a man is any less competent with a woman and go out for hours and leave him to get on with it he will find he can do it.

I would not micro manage. I would simply achieve an equitable division of labour rather than "help me with this job" - eg he does childcare all day alone on Saturdays and you Sundays or you do all the washing and he does all the shopping and cooking - fair splits. When he asked for helop the other way your answer could have been - iron or child? If he said child then you hand him the iron.

GreenGrow he'd always pick the jobs over childcare though which means I have the children even more so and he learns what to do with them even less. He says he doesn't know what to do in X situation and I said, well a) I didn't get an instruction manual either - I've had to work it out alone and b) he's been watching me for several years so perhaps he should've taken more of an interest.

In future, every time he asks you a silly question, I would answer "you decide". He would have to stop asking eventually!

I went on a residential course for 6 days when DS2 was 2 yrs and 1 month old. It was December. I came back to find DS2 with candy cane stuck in his hair, and filthy. Nursery staff said 'we thought you must have been away' - DS2 hadn't been in the bath at all. DHs response? 'He didn't say he wanted one' !!!!
Having said that, we weathered that one without him needing surgery to remove sharp items from his rectum - and he is awesome as a parent to teenagers. He just wasn't so hot with toddlers - we are past that stage now and harmony has returned.

I know that the knee jerk reaction is to become irritated with men who are like this. And yes, they may well be trying it on! But you could just tell him to do things, when he asks for reassurance, tell him you're easy going and he can decide. Then act as if he always takes over after. Gradually he MAY start doing things off his own back. DH does as much as I do - perhaps not as quickly - but then I have my faults too! Just take it for granted that he will help and have a few stock phrases ready "Oh do anything I'm easy going", "Its up to you", "Oh that went wrong did it, no worries."