To raise concerns to SS re: family member

[OldCatLady]

Changed a few details to not be recognisable. Sorry for the long post.

But background: family member 'Emma' has two children. She had her first fairly young, didn't know what she was doing, SS got involved, but family stepped in and all was fine. DS1 is disabled due to early neglect (I don't know specifically what's wrong with him but is statemented, is 7 and is more like a 3 year old). Therefore they get disability living allowance and carers allowance etc. DS2 is 3 and although not developing as he should, is not disabled, just a little slow. Neither parent works, live in council flat. You get the picture.

I have a few concerns and I'm not sure if I should report them or just keep my nose out. I know that dad hits the kids, and that they are scared of him, not as in punches or kicks them, but enough to hurt and scare them, and is verbally aggressive too. They get a lot of benefits for DS1 though none of it is being spent on him. They give a lot to Emma's mum who is also on benefits but a lot less than them. A lot seems to be spent on clothes, video games, nights out for parents. The kids are left to their own devices most of the time, no stimulation, no days out, no beneficial toys, they eat so badly (junk food 24/7), no bed times, no discipline, always wearing dirty clothes etc.

I feel so sorry for the kids but I feel like I'm being really pathetic in reporting this? What do you think?

[adviceforme]

report

The OP maynot have worded certain aspects of her post in a very PC manner but she does paint a picture of neglect - it is up to SS to determine if it is serious or not.

There was a study done that proved vulnerable parents who were given support through attendance at a childcare setting and given free vitamins for the babies thrived against a control group. The effects of a poor diet alone can impure cognitive development.

It's impossible to say from info OP has provided to begin to understand the link in this childs case between the neglect and subsequent developement.

The parents at best sound selfish and uninterested in their children.

[MrsWinnibago]

Selks how would that be managed? By the mind police?

[Selks]

Well it wouldn't be 'managed' of course. But there are clear cases sometimes where people know of neglect or abuse and don't report it. For example (I'm a social worker, by the way) I came across a neighbour who had known for months that a child was being hit and prevented from attending school. In the end, months later, the child was removed when the school saw bruises. That child's suffering might have stopped sooner if the neighbour had reported it, and they might have felt more compulsion to report it if they knew it was an offence not to.

[MiscellaneousAssortment]

Do report it, the children need you to put them first.

[ADHDNoodles]

Yes, report to SS.

How they treat their children IS your business, it should be everyone's business. If they are not getting essentials they need: food, clothes that fit, basic toys, they are being neglected. Children have every right to a safe and healthy home life.

Is it possible for you to take the kids in if the courts take them away? It would be better for them to stay with family, then in a foster home.

[MrsWinnibago]

Selks I see...people in positions of authority should be sanctioned if they fail to safeguard perhaps but not neighbours..you can't prosecute that kind of thing as it would potentially lead to false claims and all kinds of bother.

[Owllady]

It does beg the question why so many of us are robbed off by ss though when we contact the children's with disabilities team. Maybe a call yo safe guarding will help them get more support in place (as its often impossible)

[bottlecat]

Unfortunately, children being 'hit' by their parents is legal in this country.

Unless that law is changed or made clearer, it would be extremely difficult to sanction neighbours for not reporting.

[CerealMom]

I do feel sorry for posters sometimes. Perhaps the language they use to describe people/events are not acceptable to others. Does this take away from their concerns or do we just use it as a stick to prevent them from coming back to the thread?

I'm not assuming the OP is making negative judgements about benefits/housing/disabilities. Only that in isolation these things are usually nothing to be concerned about however, if more are evident within a family it does give cause for concern. It can show an overall picture of neglect.

So OP, yes I would report to SS. All your concerns are valid.

[Selks]

MrsW, I can't see how it would lead to false claims (there are already plenty of those), but perhaps this is for another thread

[MrsWinnibago]

Well anyone could claim "X knew all about the neglect"

How could it be proved?

[OldCatLady]

Wow some people have definitely missed the point.

I am in no way saying anything bad about council flats or people that live in them. The "you get the picture" was a seperate sentence at the end of a paragraph. As in "here's the background, blah blah blah, you get the picture", and was not in reference to the the fact they live in a council flat.

I think the fact that both parents do not work is very relevant here. They should have time to wash clothes, play with the kids, interact with then, and yet they don't.

The fact that they live in a council flat and receive benefits is also very relevant since a huge amount of their benefits are due to DS1s disability yet none of it is being used to support him.


And yes I am sure about disability caused by neglect. I didn't realise this was such an important part of my question. But for those interested, he was massively neglected, not interacted with, not fed, changed or nurtured as a baby. At around 4 months he was hospitalised, SS were called, he was literally starving to death, limp and lifeless, did not respond to people, faces, noises or anything, he just lay there. He was in hospital a few weeks, in which time SS were carrying out investigations. 'Emma' has learning difficulties herself and had simply not been shown how to look after a child, she was clueless, had 'accidentally missed' HV appointments etc and had very little contact from family (very small family anyway) since she was living far away and notoriously hard to get hold of.

DS1 came out of hospital into the care of another relative, and remained there for 3 months with visits from Emma and Emma taking parebting classes and watching this relative with the baby. DS1 was put on the 'at risk register' but eventually returned to Emma with lots of visits and supervision. She did okay. When he was approximately 2 years, SS removed him from at risk register and she has had little/no contact from them since. In the last year or so these issues have started to arise again.

Due to severe early neglect, DS1's brain did not form correctly. Hence causing this disability.



So my original question was..are these small things enough to warrant a report or am I just overreacting? It's very hard when it's a family member. I don't have much contact with them due to distance but when I do it's always the same.

[OldCatLady]

Sorry that was a bit ranty.

It took me a long time to come back to this thread simply because I have a lot going on, I did read some posts before but I really wasn't looking for a fight, just some opinions and I took them on board.

I think after thoroughly reading posts I probably should report what I know, it's just very difficult as I really care about this family. And DD1 even if taken into care is very unlikely to ever be adopted, and that's difficult too.




I believe SS massively f*** up this case. But that's not really the point of this. They should never have stopped their involvement but did. And while each hearing and case review went on I looked after DS1 and had a full lowdown afterward. Emma is very open about her mistakes and DS1's disability.

[JamNan]

You mean you HAVEN'T reported your concerns?

[ColdTeaAgain]

As I said when you started this thread, it sounds like the whole family need a lot of support which they aren't getting.

Yes it does sound like they have slipped through the net from what you have described.

Neglect comes in many forms and it doesn't have to be intentional to warrant reporting it.

Understand that it's difficult if it's family but the children must come first....you need to do something.

[nocoolnamesleft]

Based on the update, my opinion has changed. From call social services, to definitely call social services. With help, this could still be turned around. Without help...I would be very very worried.

[tearsofrobertsmith]

Why do you have to ask? You have concerns- does it even matter what strangers on the net think? If we all said "nah, sounds fine." Would you honestly not report this family?

[FloatIsRechargedNow]

As you care so much about this family and have even considered that ds1 might be taken into care, if this eventuality arises might it be possible that you could step in to care for him? You might even get some 'benefits' to help you to do this. SS appear overwhelmed with needy cases and such a shortage of paid foster carers might it be something you would do? Or is it just the state's problem?

[FloatIsRechargedNow]

Thought as much -so many posters easily suggest reporting to SS but won't consider stepping in themselves. Even when it's their own family.

If anything, with the amount of 'Reporters' suggested on here, you would think SS would be overwhelmed by offers from families wanting to help.

Easy to appear to 'care' without really caring at all.

[FloatIsRechargedNow]

Bump waiting for those "Report OP" MNers who can also describe their caring role in society......Ooooh you've all gone now.

Report to SS=Care=Foster Family=Someone Else not You.

And they wonder why the State hands out money? It's because there aren't enough people who actually give a shit.

[tethersend]

Float, I'm not sure what your point is here.

Are you saying that nobody should report concerns about children unless they are prepared to take in the child themselves?

Or have I got that wrong?

[FloatIsRechargedNow]

Hi tethers my point is that so many people are happy to suggest 'Report' without thinking through the consequences. It doesn't often happen that being taken into care means a better upbringing, and it can often mean worse. Much worse.

I'm also balancing that point out with the fact that there's a huge shortage of foster carers out there. So if a child is taken into care it doesn't mean that he/she will go to a 'caring' family and even if so the child can/most likely will be moved on.

So if you say "Report" with a view that the child would receive better care elsewhere, then consider too where this elsewhere might be.

From a point of view concerned with a close relative, I would step in rather than the child enter the care system. It would be difficult but it would be preferable for all. I would do the same for a close friend.

I wish I could do it for all children.

[ilovechristmas1]

report op

after the last few horrific cases of children dying at their parents hands it has really made me realise that some do slip through the net,please dont turn a blind eye like some do

it dosent sound great at all

if all is ok then all fine,if there is not you have saved 2 children living a miserable and possibly dangerous future

i know i may sound im being OTT but i feel this needs reporting especially the past issues

[Lagoonablue]

The child won't necessarily be taken into care though. There is other stuff to be done. I cannot help but wonder though WHY OP has not yet told childrens services about her concerns.

Poor bloody kids.

[FloatIsRechargedNow]

Because OP doesn't live nearby - just drops in to the 'picture' occasionally. So if she does "Report" then the local SS are hardly likely to take her seriously anyway. Try that 'reporting conversation' in your head if you're unsure.

I'm sure there's some "poor bloody kids" near you if you're that worried.