"Stealing" free things from work

[FickleUsernameChooser]

WIBU to pocket about 6-8 sachets of the free sugar that comes with the free tea and coffee at work for when I go camping next week?

It feels wrong although I'd argue if I was here I'd be using them anyway (and possibly more) and it is offered free anyway. Seems a bit pointless to have to pack a bigger container of sugar.

I quote -

I think the point is that in legal terms you could get sacked for it.
That is fact.
It can, and does, happen.
Do as you will, but at least be armed with that fact, and don't cry about it, if it happens.
And don't mock people pointing the fact out to you.

Now, if she actually doesn't mean that but means something completely different then it's up to her to write more accurately - the rest of us don't have the time to interpret her words and think about what she might mean - because that is tiresome.

No, you're right - a good debate is backed up by reasoned argument and evidence as opposed to spurious and empty claims of non-events.

is it even stealing anyway if it's free?

Of course it's not stealing. Free tea and coffee that comes with sugar - therefore the sugar is free to those who want it, regardless of what they want it for.

It's like saying that if I go to a work-related conference, pick up some post-its at one of the stalls, but choose to use them for non-work related purposes then I'm stealing. Which is bollocks, obv.

At work (NHS Hospital) we make teas & coffees for our breaktimes.

Now, we were originally allowed to use the same milk that we use for the patients, the same tea bags and coffee, and the same sugar.

Suddenly Management decided that it was 'wasting money' and staff have to bring in their own milk, tea, coffee & sugar from home. To use the hospital's items would be a disciplinary offence.

Soon the ward fridge was overflowing with about 30 people's different milks, and the ward office was packed with tea bags and coffees.
The Clinical Leader (Sister) got so fed up with the mess that she said we could all use the hospital's milk and tea etc again and not to bring in milk from home.

So we've all gone back to using the hospital's teabags, coffee, milk & sugar sachets.

Technically we could all get disciplinary warnings for using the hospital's stuff... but none of us care that much because we work bloody hard and don't get any thanks for it.

So there is an example of being able to be punished for using the workplace's sugar sachets!

(The thought of hundreds of people including the Sisters being on disciplinary for 'stealing' tea and sugar and milk is laughable but could really happen if Management wanted to have a clamp down!)

Punished but not sacked.

I would like to see my NHS Board trying to sack a member of staff who took home 6-8 sachets that come with the free coffee and tea for their camping trip - a)it's a waste of manager's time and a complete waste of resources and b)the Unions would have a field day.

Sloppy sloppy sloppy thinking op.

Over several weeks you just take 2 sachets. Use 1, pocket 1. Nice bundle, nothing missed.

You will never make a criminal mastermind. Mwah ha ha ha!

It does make a difference. BA stopped serving martinis when it worked out it saved over £25k a year in the olives for them.

If a firms in trouble two things go first, biscuits at meetings and real flowers in reception.

But SirChenjin we don't ever get 'free tea or coffee' and we don't get camping trips either! That's because we're 'just' nurses and HCAs.

That's the point I'm trying to make - if someone wanted to be pedantic they could be and discipline a nurse for taking tea, milk and sugar.

If that nurse already had a disciplinary on their record for something eg. sickness or lateness then yes, technically they can be sacked for having another disciplinary!

Pickle - do you have something your would like to confess in the MN confessional box?

And as I said earlier, people I know have been disciplined for eating unwanted food from the trolley.

Any disciplinary warnings go on record and can make it very hard to get another job.

I'm sure that in some places taking unwanted food from patients trolleys, or using milk which has been purchased for use by patients is a disciplinary matter - absolutely agree. In fact, I'm surprised that you are allowed to use it now, but that's for your managers to decide.
This is not the case with the OP though. She is given free tea and coffee at work, and with that comes free sugar. There is nothing in her T&Cs that states that taking the free sugar for use outside of work is a disciplinary matter - which is why I was making the earlier comparison to taking post-its (or pens, or whatever, that we get at conferences, or that the pharma reps leave in the NHS) and then choosing to use those pens outwith the work setting.

And now, talking of work and the NHS, I'd better go and do some for it

OP! I have the solution! I am an unreserved and unrepentent sugarer of hot drinks. I grab sweaty fistfuls, FISTFULS, of sachets EVERY TIME I am given a hot drink to take away. Sometimes, I don't even use all of them and just bin them unused. Sometimes they end up in my bag if there's no bin around.

Just be me, OP. Just be me. You'll have loads in no time.

Oh but what you really want are Italian or Spanish sachets. They're at least double the size of our useless, paper-wasteful UK ones. goes misty eyed

ugh that wasn't supposed to be bold

Sir

Then it is a terrible shame that you were not our manager when this happened. Because he was a total cunt.

Sir

do you really fucking think I an going to out my colleague on Mumsnet because you personally would not do anything about it?

Nope. If you think this is an acceptable thing to do to my colleague to back up my post to a total random off the internet claiming to be anNHS manager then I have my doubts that you indeed are.

the catering supplies at your work are free-for-all, but they are not free for your employer to buy. So they are no more free to take than a pencil, a pad of paper, a pack of staples, a stapler, a desk fan, a mouse....

Where do you draw the line?

Take your big bag of sugar and put some in a little bag for travelling.

I want to work for the Trust that gives away camping trips to its staff.

Nearly thirty years at senior level and I am still waiting for my free camping trip (although days in a tent with colleagues is NOT my idea of winding down from work!). That might explain your obtuse and might I add disingenuous comments Sir- too much time in a tent, not enough time at work. Addles the brain

Why don't you just ask your boss. They will almost certainly say 'yes, of course you can'.

You will find it is VERY clear in your contract that taking property for use at work IS considered theft. Or might I start taking home my office chair, my Mac, my table, the tray my food comes in? Or how about the bag of bread left in the office for people to make toast with for patients and themselves? We are authorised to dispense paracetamol to ourselves from the trolleys if we have pain. Maybe we should take that home too?

These are all provided 'free' for use at work.

Sir your moral compass is whacked because it relies upon what you perceive as being freely provided at work = free to take home, espeically if you deem it to be inconsequential, like sugar sachets. Do you think the NHS is there to subsidise YOUR sugar habits? It all adds up and as a 'manager' you should know that.

When you have that level of moral whackness you get subjectivity and there are always people who will take that to another level. When they require disciplining because they have escalated their 'help themselves' attitude or taken something a little more costly or indiscreet and bleat at you that they have seen you help yourself to 'free food' and turn a blind eye to others doing it, that is when you end up with not one shred of credibility.

My dd had a Saturday job in a large retail company. They'd put sweets out on the counter for the customers and were told the staff weren't allowed to have any.

Another 18 year old took 2 sweets, the manager saw her and she was taken through the whole company disiplinary procedure and sacked!

I didn't believe it atthe time and thought she must have done something else, more serious, but apparently it was the only thing the girl had ever done wrong.

So no, I wouldn't ever take anything from work, without asking a manager- you just never know!

www.xperthr.co.uk/resources/LawReports/IntheemploymenttribunalsNov2012/Kaczor%20v%20Booker%20Ltd.pdf tribunal case where a dismissal for possibly stealing a 39p yoghurt was held to be fair.

And not all determinations are reported.

Sir just out of curiosity, would you have a problem if one of your staff was taking theatre scrubs (which are freely provided for staff use at work) home to use as PJs?