To think that introverts are given a hard time by recruiters/potential employers?

[Rhine]

I've been looking for another job for a while now and I feel like I'm hitting my head against a brick wall. The modern recruitment process seems to be designed to favour extroverted people, placing introverts into situations that they will naturally struggle and feel uncomfortable in.

Gone are the days where you just popped off a CV or application form and if you were lucky then got a one to one interview with the manager, now before you even get to one one one you have these group interviews with bloody "role play" situations and "ice breakers" where you have to stand up and "sell yourself". FFS I'm an introvert, It's just not in my nature to sell myself and I find the role playing stuff stupid and awkward.

If it was a sales job I was going for I'd say fair enough, but you even have to do these silly "recruitment centres" for a job stacking the shelves in Tesco now, and that's only if you get past those awful aptitude tests that they make you do online which are always the kiss of death for introverts! It's like being on the fucking Krypton Factor!

I just wish employers would give introverts a chance and go back to the old methods of a face to face interviews. I know I've lost out on jobs that I KNOW I can do.

It's not fair, is it?

You cannot force an introvert to change the core of their personality

This.
Sadly it's true. I've tried.

Surely if you employ an outstanding candidate for shelf stacking job in Tesco then they will leave as soon as they get something better. Not all jobs require high level of skills or even shock! Horror!

Often the person with weak communication skill, but incredibly reliable is better in a low end job. Sometimes people with learning difficulties do well in simple jobs.

What an offensive post ReallyTired. Introverts do NOT have weak communication skill, and it's also unwise to sneer at people who work in supermarkets.

Rhine, that is a massive over reaction to ReallyTireds post.

She hasn't said anything offensive there at all.

I agree with the OP here. In my last job even going for internal positions, it was all based on how much rubbish you could talk during a 40 min interview. Years of reports from managers, end of year reviews, actual results etc where all thrown out the window.

A lot of larger companies especially are caught in a vicious circle with this because the rubbish staff have been over promoted to middle management and are now hiring people like themselves.

I think that saying people with weak communication skills should be in lower end jobs is offensive. But then but inferring that introverts have weak communication skills is insulting most of the posters on this thread.

I don't have weak communication skills, actually I can communicate well with most people. It's myth that introverts are socially inept in some way.

I think you're reading too much into it.

I don't think I am. It was a nasty comment written by someone who clearly doesn't know what they are talking about.

There seems to be an assumption on this thread that extroverts relish group interview roleplay situations and I think that's just balls.

And I'm a major introvert but don't identify with a lot of assertions on this thread either. I have coped fine in interview situations. I can sell myself if necessary. And I'm a teacher so clearly don't have a problem standing in front of a group!

I am an introvert and it has not stopped me getting jobs that I was suited to. When I failed to get a job it was often because there was a better candidate.

Rhine Plenty of people who are introverts have strong communication skills. They often do well in jobs like engineering or computing where communication skills are less of an issue. There are all kinds of careers and all kinds of companies.

I think you have to accept that 50% of people have below average intelligence. Maybe 5% have such low intelligence that it is hard for them to find work. In a healthy ecomony there should be a job for every adult of working age that wants to work. Instead we are in a stupid situtation where there is competition from poorer european countries for even the most menial of jobs.

It is crazy that there is so much competion for lowly paid and boring jobs. I know someone who had a group interview for the job of cleaning portaloos on the minimum wage.

Introvert & extrovert doesn't mean shy & non shy. If you are more of the extrovert persuasion you get an energy boost from being with others whilst us more introvert types need space & time to reflect. I am more of this persuasion yet a large part of my working life involves standing up in front of others. Many great actors are introverts. I know this sounds harsh & you can either let being more of one thing or the other define you ( or be a victim of it & blame the system or others) or you can
get over yourself & work out how you are going to develop the flexibility and skills to get what you want.

recruitment practices can be cruel - does anyone remember this? m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-23972952

it describes how (without warning) pc world made people DANCE at an assessment day and there was an older man who had been made redundant there and was worried about feeding his family.

so sad/humiliating if you're not a bouyant 20n something with a parental safety net. and the more serious you take the interview the worse it will be when they ask you to dance! who can dance in a suit anyway ffs!

also i used to go out with a car salesman and this is the sort of thing they were subjected to in the 90s but because they were in high pressure sales they were expected to put up with it. now these cruel techniques have filtered through to many sectors, especially low paid ones.

I forgot about that.

I think we have to flip it though. Some people aren't the best at writing and would much rather do these sorts of things and can really sell themselves that way.

Standing in front of a class doesn't make you an extrovert. I know of a teacher who is very introvert (and shy) yes I know they are two different things but this person is BOTH and when I asked how she manages it, she says it's because you put on a 'hat'.

I suppose actor are the same - they hide behind the act.

I'm an introvert. I am not shy, neither am I quiet in group situations. I am a senior teacher, and perform well (presumably anyway!!) in a variety of selection procedures. I also perform well in the classroom.

DH works in industry. Pretty much every time he goes for a job or a promotion, he has some kind of psychometric. He always comes out as an introvert (and he is...) but again, it's not an issue. And he's done the all singing all dancing selection extravaganzas.

I'm not sure how these processes discriminate against confident introverts with good communication skills

Good recruitment practices select people who will be happy in a particular job. I did half a PGCE and frankly teaching wasn't for me because I am a perfectionist. I wish that selection for teacher training had paid more attention to personality rather than qualifications. If an employer or govement wants to invest lots of money in a person then it makes sense to pick someone who will be happy doing a particular job.

Introverts might well be better suited to computing or engineering but that ignores that even computing or engineering jobs might ask you to do a presentation at the interview.

And saying that someone should just get over themselves and stop blaming other people is plain horrible. It's not about people being unable to do a particular job, it's about struggling to prove that they can. My dh's communication skills are just fine, in his job and his everyday life, but he can't do it in an artificial setting. Not won't do it, but can't do it. Have you never been so nervous in an interview that you have opened your mouth to answer a question and no words have come out? It has happened to me, and it was horrific.

And do people really think that introverts have learning difficulties?

But saying 'I can't do interviews because I'm an introvert' is just nonsense.

"Introverts might well be better suited to computing or engineering but that ignores that even computing or engineering jobs might ask you to do a presentation at the interview. "

Computer programmers are asked to a presentation at interview as computer programmers have to explain their ideas. Being a computer programmer is a graduate job and I'm afraid that it requires reasonable communication skills. Its vital that an employee can control nerves and give a reasonable presentation in most graduate jobs.

In the job that I had before children I had to give presentations on my research to a packed auditorium. Sometimes contract/ research grants depends on the ablity to give a good presentation under stress.

I do not think that introverts have learning difficulties. In fact many introverts have extremely high IQs. There are extrovets who have severe learning difficutlies. I feel that some people on this thread do not know what the word "introvert" means. Plenty of introverts have excellent communication skills and are highly intelligent people.

Its depressing that there is such competition for minimum wage jobs. Good communication skills are not essential for stacking shelves at Tesco. I would even argue that someone with Downs can stack shelves as well as someone with a degree.

FGS confidence is nothing to do with being an extrovert. Being scared of doing a presentation has nothing to do with being an introvert.

I'm a classic introvert but I can stand up and do a presentation, it's just practice, and confidence that I can do it.

I think we are not all using the correct same definition of introvert...

I'm totally not explaining myself properly here.

In my dh's case (I keep using him as an example just because he seems like a good example) it is nothing to do with not being able to explain ideas, or do a presentation, or do his job. His communication skills are fine, good even. He has two degrees, a graduate level job and a decent salary.

But he could have more than this if he was a 'take commmand of the room' type of person.

He can't do stuff like that in an artificial group situation. He can do an interview, with an interview panel, but if you go to an assessment centre and are told 'here is a computer, you have 20 mins to research and put together a power point presentation on ice hockey in Russia' or something equally random, and then present it to all the people present, you'll never get to actually attend an interview.

I realise that you can't just opt out of interviews because you are introverted, and I don't know what the answer is, but what I'm trying to say is that an inability to master the recruitment process is not the same as being a poor employee, or a poor prospect for a particular role.

And he could do a presentation about his actual area of knowledge, easily, and has had to do so many times. It's just the fake stuff that he would struggle with.

But Treacle the inability to master a room or do a ppt presentation has nothing to do with the fact he is an introvert.