To think London is an ok place to bring up dcs?

[longestlurkerever]

I live in London. I am lucky enough to own a house with a small garden near a big park in zone 2 and have enough flex in the budget to cover tube tickets, regular cheap days out and the occasional more expensive one as a treat. Lots of my friends and colleagues are looking to leave London, saying they wouldn't want to bring up children in London, in a tone that makes it sound like it would be borderline neglectful to stay. I guess if we were going to move (either further out to somewhere more rural but with a commute in for work or to properly delicate) then now while dd is still small would be the best time to do so (she is turning 3) but I am not sure I want to.

There is so much to do with young dcs here, often free or cheap. This week we have been to the South Bank to play in the fountains, on the temporary slides and at the fake beach, to a free toddler cycling club and associated awards ceremony with free drinks and goodie bags, to three separate parks with big paddling pools, sand pits and zip wires, to an nct event with free face painting and taster classes of dancing and theatre, to the woods for play camping with tents and hammocks (that was with nursery) and we are just about to go to an abandoned railway line for Blackberry picking followed by the city farm. Over the last few weeks we have been to four museums and two puppet shows not to mention lots of birthday parties in parks and on the heath. Neighbours and I are building a communal play area on the railway land behind our houses nd have applied for the road to be closed off once a month for a 'play street'.

Admittedly all of these activities are a bit 'urban'. The toddler cycling is on an unlovely estate with boarded up flats and the blackberry picking is along a nature reserve interspersed with graffitied railway arches. I sometimes worry about all the pollution in London but overall I think dd is having fun, making friends and experiencing lots of different things that she maybe wouldn't do in a village. Is it ok that she isn't drinking in beautiful scenery and bounding through fields? I love the seaside and we are off to Wales on holiday next week. Sometimes I dream of living by the sea but tbh feel a bit lost in the countryside, esp in bad weather, and put dd in a field without other children and a playground and she looks a bit bemused.

So aibu to bring dd up in London? Am I being hopelessly naive to think I can steer her away from gangs and crime as she gets older, or to think that the countryside has its problems too? She will be going to state schools - they are fairly decent where we live. I grew up in a town but a much smaller one.

[NickiFury]

I live in zone 2. Ten minutes walk from the Thames. I am not rich. I am lucky though that I have a HA flat in a concerted house. That's why I can afford to live here.

To be honest I think we would find it very difficult to live anywhere else. Just so much to do here. Of course it has it's rough pockets but so does every other town. Those places are no more scary or dangerous just because they are located in London.

There's lots of good schools here too, I have never had problems getting my children into schools. I live with walking distance of four good primaries. I suppose we will find out about secondaries in due course.

I don't think we are "living" in a bubble as an earlier poster put it, i think lots of people have an idea of London that doesn't actually match the reality.

[limitedperiodonly]

Thanks PedlarsSpanner. I loved my dad too.

Not sure where you grew up but DH grew up in very handsome West Country seaside town which has the most wild and romantic country adjoining it.

I enjoy going there for a short time but he's conflicted. Even though he loves his mother and liked to show me places, after a couple of days he cannot wait to get away.

I think it's because the mentality there and what-might-have-been scares him.

[beijaflor]

It's an amazing place to bring up kids. We love it!

[Solasum]

I work fulltime and am a single mum to a baby DS. We live in a one bedroom flat in zone one. Unless circumstances radically change, to live in a two bed flat we would need to move far far out. I vusut family outside of London and wonder if I am selfish to keep us in the city, with no garden. But then all my friends and support network is in London now. And there is so much going on which is free. It seems to me that we have a lot to lose by leaving, and if I commuted I would have even less time with DS. Even fresh air is not worth that. Will see how things go though. I know once I leave London I would never be able to afford to return, which is definitely a factor. It would be nice to have a garden though.

[shakethetree]

YANBU- I grew up in London & moved to the outskirts when I got married ( only because I couldn't afford to live in the part of London I grew up in ) London is a fantastic place to live, & I honestly wouldn't live anywhere else - & I agree with the above poster, the opportunity to try drugs is probably greater in small rural areas.

[purits]

All this talk of living in 'zones' - says it all really. My friend in London says a trip to anywhere else in the city takes him at least an hour.
I live in a small town and can get to the city centre or deepest countryside in half that time.

[writtenguarantee]

if you look at London crime statistics, except for some hotspots, they are pretty damn good. There are many reasons not to live in London, but I don't think crime is one of them. I have never felt unsafe here.

We have two dcs and living in zone 2. Of course, it isn't always peachy, but I do like it quite a bit. My work commute door-to-door is under 20 mins, and DPs is 45. and of course there is tons to do. we are happy, though not thrilled with dcs school. I think it's great they will have plenty to do. The teens we have met here seem really with it, but of course that's likely because they are part of our social circle.

I sometimes do wish about 80% of the people would just fuck off, but that's rare. the crowds can get to me sometime, but I think the good outweighs the bad.

laza222 in north islington (your husband commutes north?), 750 will get you a 3 bed house. you won't have your pick of 3 bed houses, but you will be able to get something.

[writtenguarantee]

All this talk of living in 'zones' - says it all really. My friend in London says a trip to anywhere else in the city takes him at least an hour.
I live in a small town and can get to the city centre or deepest countryside in half that time.

it obviously depends on where you live and where you are going. for us it's an hour maximum anywhere, and that would be clear across the city. everything else is much closer.

[katese11]

London is brilliant for kids! We did move further out to be able to buy a bigger house (were on the edge of zone 1 til v recently, now in zone 4) but if we'd be able to stay central we so would have. So much free stuff to do!

[WorraLiberty]

I live on the East London/Essex boarder

My 15yr old DS is in London now...sight seeing with his friend. They set off with a packed lunch this morning and for just £1.40 they get all day travel on the trains/tube/buses.

I don't expect to see him until this evening and I don't expect to see much of him during the Summer holidays.

There's always so much to do that's free or very very cheap.

[thecuntureshow]

'All this talk of living in zones - says it all really'

Sorry, what does it say?

You might be able to get into a town in 30 mins but you can in London, and more too. Not everything is central zone 1. My nearest town, 10 mins walk, has shops, restaurants, a theatre, parks, festivals on, live music, stuff for kids, art and culture. There's a villagy type road even nearer with independent cafés, a huge park and a church that shows films in the evening. There's clubs for kids and a local shop that does wine tasting.

If I got 10 minutes further I get all of that and more somewhere else. If I go 20 minutes in a different direction I get somewhere on the river, with farmers markets and a rowing club if I want one! If I go half an hour in another direction I get a royal park. Another direction I get a 100 museums and art galleries. Ten minutes drive is a national trust house and grounds

Twenty minutes drive out of town and I'm basically in the countryside with long walks and country pubs.

As I said earlier I loooove where we live inlondon. Am crossing fingers for a lottery win so we can stay!
Or maybe we'll have to go somewhere else in London

[OnlyLovers]

Course you're not BU. Cities are wonderful for children; look at all the amazing things you list just in your first post!

I was bored shitless and very frustrated living in the country/suburbs as a kid. I also hardly ever saw people who weren't white like me until I moved to a city, or realised there was so much diversity of culture and lifestyles. Being exposed to people of all cultures, colours etc can only be a good thing IMO.

ReallyTired, your posts sound like you have a chip on your shoulder about other people's money. The OP isn't necessarily 'rich' and, even if she was, so what?

I don't think the OP lives in a 'bubble' either; no more than anyone else lives in, anyway. IME there is plenty of 'bubble' living in small towns and villages and suburbia, probably more so than in cities. I've never known people go in for so much petty territorialism, one-upmanship and criticism of other people's houses/gardens/cars etc than in small places. I can't imagine anyone I know in a smaller place wanting to be involved in building a communal play area like the OP is.

[OnlyLovers]

purits, 'All this talk of living in 'zones' - says it all really. ' Says what? What does that mean?

[longestlurkerever]

Yes travel can take a while that is true but dd likes the tube and bus - it's part of the outing for her, and we often stay fairly local and still there is plenty going on - I suppose because of the population density. As much as it would be nice to have a bit more open space, take away the crowds and you would take away a lot of the stuff that goes on.

It's comments like sola's that make me feel I am not alone in experiencing disparaging remarks though. It doesn't sound selfish to me to want to stay where you know and enjoy living. A garden is nice I admit, especially as dd gets bigger, but tbh if I had to choose between it or the park the park would win every time.

I agree the house prices are shocking. I couldn't afford to buy our house now even though it has a sodding great train line whizzing past. Think dd considers the trains an advantage though! Certainly visiting toddlers do.

[limitedperiodonly]

All this talk of living in 'zones' - says it all really

Really, purits. What does it say to you?

I live in Zone 1 but I used to live in what what now is Zone 6. It's just an area described by TFL for their charging purposes and that's what people who live in London are saying because we understand ourselves. We're not getting at you.

My former Zone 6 area is very desirable. I wouldn't want to live there any more because it doesn't suit my current circumstances.

[Iownathreeinchferrari]

I think it's all about life style and what you want for your kids. London is great for kids I'm sure but its not what is want for my family

[purits]

It's just an area described by TFL for their charging purposes and that's what people who live in London are saying because we understand ourselves.

That's a bit patronising. We country bumpkins understand zoning all right. It's London's way of describing itself by its defining factor - the cost and difficulty of getting around.

[thecuntureshow]

Nah

You can live in zone 6 and get to a station in zone 1 quicker than you can from zone 3 in another area of London.

[Dolcelatte]

I think London is actually a series of villages, for the most part, with their own identity and communities.

We moved from zone 1 to zone 3 when DC1 was expected, from a small flat to a house with a garden, but the commuting to zone 1 was probably worse than where we are now - similar length of journey and no seat on the tube - and the lack of off street parking began to become a pain. You don't necessarily need a car in London, but it is desirable if you are not in the centre - buggies, supermarket shopping, general baby stuff etc.

I think we now have the best of both worlds - near enough to London to get into the theatre, museums, smart restaurants when we want them, although there are plenty of 'ordinary' restaurants, plus country pubs, nice countryside, and the DC have grown up with lots of space, ponies, dogs, cats etc. The pollution wasn't something I noticed until I left, when suddenly there were stars in the sky. My late father used to say that the birds don't sing in London, they cough! But I do love London and I understand why some people wouldn't choose to live anywhere else.

When the DC have left, my ideal will be to have a 'shoe box' in theatre land and a cottage by the sea. As many have said, it's all about lifestyle choices and priorities, within what works for you as an individual or family and what is affordable.

[thecuntureshow]

Sadly those shoeboxes are a million quid Dolce

Where do you live now?

[unlucky83]

Someone mentioned crime ....
I found a site which had how many crimes reported for a post code per month...was actually seeing what effect moving a mile away would have on my insurance...
I put in different postcodes for the same month.
I put in my current postcode and the postcode of where I'm moving to - 1 mile away - for both of them - zero!!

Parent's -where I grew up (northern small town) no of crimes - 28

I put in my London Postcode - 1590

A bit of a difference ...

I would say that where I live now might just have a teeny tiny bit less crime than where I lived in London ....

[VioletHare]

I've never lived in London...the nearest I've got was staying with a friend for a few days.

I enjoyed it, as a novelty...but I wouldn't live there, and definitely wouldn't want to bring the dc up there.

Visiting and doing the sightseeing thing is great. But there was lots of pushing through crowds of people who don't look you in the eye, never mind interact. Countless stinky tube rides and buses, concrete everywhere and a permanent smog in the air.

I couldn't live right in the country in the middle of nowhere. I like people, I like activities, museums, groups, etc. I like having neighbours. I live just outside a decent sized town, but it's ten minutes to the beach and ten to the Countryside, and ten to the town centre.

I don't get the appeal of Central London at all. I'm pretty sure my kids would hate it tbh.

[NewtRipley]

Violet

You were pushing through crowds in central london. That's like me saying I wouldn't want to live on Queen St in Edinburgh, or Broadway in New York. Granted, I don't have to travel on the tube to work. I don't think I'd like that.

Where the OP lives in zone 2is like her own town, or dare I say, village. Not noticed smog here. Shops, cafes, schools, parks, Victorian and postwar houses. It is a community, with people who talk to each other in shops, children who play together.

[NewtRipley]

Dolcelatte.

Me too. Shoe box in the centre, cottage by the sea (we can dream)

[longestlurkerever]

Another example of why I like it here - just had a look on my local Council's website to see what childcare might be available in the holidays next year when dd's nursery is shut. There's a holiday club for her age but also for older dcs there is a week-long sailing course, theatre course and circus skills course, each with a weekly fee of less than one day at nursery. Granted that's not within the reach of everybody but it's not just the preserve of the very wealthy either. Turns out you can do horse riding a bit North of here in Trent Park too though I don't know what it costs. Think we'll be staying . Agree that people's perceptions can be a bit skewed. Actually people do talk to you in London - especially if you have dcs - it's just that there are so many people you don't necessarily bump into people you know all the time. I rather like that!