To think that the redundancies at KCL are just the start of the landslide?

[NCForVObviousReasons]

I work at KCL. I've changed my username as I don't want to out myself. KCL is currently making compulsory redundancies. Their own staff and students are outraged and have gone to the press (read the comments below these two articles). There is likely to be strike action. The timing absolutely stinks and the methodology seems questionable.

I know from my own experience that KCL has many fantastic academics and admin staff but it is not well run at a more senior level. I don't know if it's worse than others. But is this the tip of the iceberg? Are other universities heading in the same direction?

FE colleges like the one i worked at need to find ways of commercially exploiting the land and facilities they have for public hire or events when the college is standing empty. the problem is that they are so used to do pricing and organising in a very red tape education type style and seem unable to shake it off to say right well the hall is standing there empty, the security staff are here ANYWAY and we'd be paying rent/tax/whatever it is regardless of whether it stands empty or is in use SO we don't include those things in a 'price' to hire it out and we make ourselves financially competitive.

sorry that probably didn't make sense but will for anyone who has ever had to price something up or write a budget within education. they are used to doing it to include everything and come up with the highest price possible to secure 'funding'. to be commercially viable and produce a price for customers you cannot do it that way. also you have to be less pedantic and rigid about daft things like whether food and drinks can be served in venue a or not - silly things and i'm not thinking of good examples.

potentially there are ways to diversify income but they require a huge mentality shift and to be managed by people who aren't totally engulfed in the red tape culture of education.

a simple example - the college is sitting empty over summer. there is a massive shortage of things to do with older children during school hours over the summer holidays. snap! run enrichment weeks with your hourly paid staff who would want the extra work and some of whom would be great at working with younger kids introducing them to their subject areas. you charge money and make money AND you are boosting your student recruitment. run sports weeks for kids in your massive purpose built wonderful sports facilities that are lying dormant for 8 weeks.

you'd try to suggest something like this and there would be brick walls of yes buts rather than any faith that doing something different could be incredibly low outlay and high profit and feed into their wider goals of boosting the image of the college and improving student recruitment by showcasing your facilities.

hard work getting certain mentalities to change.

Sorry AnnaL - it's all a bit Kafkaesque.

My dealings with Met is via furniture conservation/restoration - or not now as the case maybe. As per Bucks New Uni/Manchester/Portsmouth etc etc etc... we are just not a cash cow viable course :-(

Seagull, if I had my time again I would be asking about number of hours for lectures (large group sessions), smaller tuition groups (more opportunity to chat to other students/tutor re subject and personal tutor. Basically the types and duration of contact time.

I had a few friends who did English and did very well post degree. KCL is still very well regarded by employers. Do they still do Old Icelandic? Nearly as useful as my first degree - ho ho ho.

The University where I work is also going through round after round of restructures. I hope everyone is in a union, I know it can make a difference.

The University where I work is also going through round after round of restructures. I hope everyone is in a union, I know it can make a difference.

Thank you ceralmum x

It just seems so incredibly short-sighted to cut back on the one true asset that the College has - it's staff.

So they want to invest more in bricks and mortar to attract the higher paying overseas students. What happens a few years down the line though when these students start to question the quality of teaching that they are paying through the nose for?

They want to run the institution more like a 'business'? Any decent business knows that it is nothing without it's staff!

I work in HE - lecture at a University in the south with a good reputation. I would describe the culture as brutal. It is awful and quite heartbreaking, I'm glad I'm nearing the end of my career.

Honeybadger, if there are any FE colleges out there who don't use their facilities over the holidays, they deserve to close.

Ours is jam packed with other stuff running every day. We barely leave or rooms before someone else claims them. Staff rooms and teaching rooms alike - all are up for sale over summer. We pack and unpack with monotonous regularity - so much so that we have official Box Days, when everyone is on moving duty. You go in jeans and pack/store until every 'sold' room is done and dusted.

I don't know of any college or university that isn't fully used in similar ways. There just aren't any facilities lying empty over summer. Even those being refurbished get some use.

V. much agree with the poster who said about being in the union. I know UCU are feeble on a national level, but they have been brilliant at my institution (RG) at working with staff who were either threatened with redundancy or were being 'managed out'.

Seagull, I'm sure your daughter will have a great time and I hope I haven't created too much anxiety. The current round of cuts is in the health schools, not Humanities, although who knows what's in store in the future.

It must be baffling for most people to understand what's going on in the university sector at the moment. Students are being asked to take out huge loans to pay £9k fees when it used to be £3k. The natural assumption is that this must mean that the universities are rolling in it. What is not widely understood is that the fees were kept lower before because the government subsidised them and that's all stopped.

not around here nomama. i don't think they deserve to close but they do need to wake up.

Wow, Honeybadger. That is ridiculous.

There is so much revenue to be had... so much need for summer stuff. It really doesn't make good business sense not to use the facilities all year round.

Madness, and I am sorry, but the business managers need sacking at the very least! The board of governors needs a good rattle too!

i know! its complete and utter madness.

Thats ok cereal . I wish I could say more but it could cost me my job.

The unions at my place are utterly useless and ineffective. Like the rest of us they're too afraid about their jobs to really stick their necks out.

Its true that any building work is being done to attract the cash cow of foreign students since thats where the big bucks in fees are. Home grown students are not as important, sadly.

As said above, support staff are not employed on mega salaries either - the sector wages are low. I dont see any academics on high wages either although vice chancellors are doing very well for themselves.

I expect to see the numbers of unis/FE colleges decreasing over the years to come. Which is what the government is aiming for.

Bugger!
read this as KFC

I can kind of see why international students are so appealing -- you can make a mint off them, and King's is lucky in that they are incredibly well located to attract that crowd (literally on the Thames in central London).

But it's also possibly shortsighted to pursue this market too much given that immigration guidelines are constantly getting tighter and it's not really a dependable market long-term, I think.

the FE bit doesn't make any sense though given they want kids to stay in education till 18 and schools cannot cope with the academically disaffected under 16 let alone over. besides which they want to start opening up courses in FE to kids at 14 which could help schools no end if everybody didn't see it as a competition for bums on seats no matter how ill equipped you are to cater to or retain them safely.

The University I work at is replacing most of its existing halls of residence over the next few years. But it's not so much for overseas students as domestic. The existing housing stock is getting a bit tatty and has shared bathrooms. The new halls are much nicer and each room has an en-suite. That's what students are demanding now and they have a lot of universities to choose from; good quality halls does make a difference.

But while it's an enormous construction project it's not costing the university itself much in terms of capital outlay. The majority of the money is coming from a third-party construction consortium who will build (on loaned university land) and run the site in return for the rent revenue.

I've heard of other universities building new conferencing centres on similar lines although then the university often gets a cut of the revenue as, otherwise, there's less in it for the university to gain.

FE is in the pits at the moment, too. Gov't cuts to funding and an half arsed panic attempt at pushing the new skills agenda have ruined some great institutions.

Good, I think their food is really unhealthy !

Name change. Yes I've worked in university and in industry. What you're saying is my point entirely. Any senior manager worth their salt (ie a reader, senior lecturer or a professor) should have a grasp about the financial status of the department they're in. Not just a disdainful, "I do research/teaching/ivory tower approach".

I've seen academics sneer at admin organisation and refuse to engage in stuff that's normal in industry (keeping to deadlines, accessing centralised support through the correct channels) all with a huffy puffy " I'm above this" attitude.

I think universities and research are incredibly important but they also have to be financially viable too.

I know that those buying health related CPD and non degree courses have for some time been comparing the "market" in terms of cost and outcome, and looking to get value for money, per placement.