to tell my friend paying cash in hand for a builder is immoral

[twistedsista]

My friend is having some building work done, was kind of showing off that she gets it for 120 a day rather than 150 as its cash in hand.

I couldn't help but say I thought it was a bit immoral. As he won't be paying any tax on it that's over 40k a year sallary equilivent and being in London with kids it's possible working tax credits and housing benefit could also be tens of thousands a year.

Should I have just shut up? She took it really personally

Paying with cash is perfectly legal. Not paying tax is illegal.

Your friend is doing nothing wrong (although she doesn't sound the brightest sort if she's bragging about it, maybe he just over quoted her by 25% in the first place!) and frankly it's really noyb.

My husband was self employed and he gave a cash discount for payment on completion of 10%. The invoice was sent out afterwards and it did go through the books.

To those of you saying I'm nosey and a bad friend.

I'm a very good friend I think, but if one of my friends is helping someone knowingly evading tax then I have issues as that affects society as a whole.

If my friend ever complanes about the wait to see her gp I will remind her of it.

I was more offended of her likinging me claiming JSA for a few weeks as immoral as her helping someone evade tax.

If he was invoicing or any paperwork I wouldn't have an issue and would leave well alone.

Of course he isn't paying tax. There's only one reason builders ask for cash in hand

^ This

She better hope he is not a cowboy builder, with there being no invoices. I would be more worried about that than any tax being paid or not paid.

I wonder if there is a class thing too?

You always hear "builders want paqying in cash so they can fiddle tax". Does anyone ever apply this to private tutors or yoga classes? I pay 100 per month in private tuition fees. The tutor asks for cash as it is "easier".

Once the money is handed over, it is the recipient's duty to pay tax etc.

If you want to be a good friend do remind her to ask for all relevant building regs certificates.

Her not having the relevant paperwork is far more important than worrying about when or whether the income has been declared for tax purposes.

As if it isn't bad enough with the cashier at the bank asking what I will be spending my money on, now I have to contend with neighbours and friends too!

We will be paying cash in hand to a number of builders, roofers, plumbers over the next few months. We get the job done quicker, they can buy the bits more quickly, pay off subbies immediately, cover contingencies immediately.... I only suspect one of aiming to dodge the tax, and, to be absolutely honest, as he is only getting a couple of hundred out of me, parts included, I couldn't care enough to get angry (having worked out that he will be evading tax on about £40 or about 2 hours work).

My dad gave discount for cash as it made life easier, he always paid tax.

Those who leap to the stereotypical conclusion about builders probably also believe the UK has been swamped by immigrants stealing our jobs and that Mr Gove has a point!

Our local nail bar has a "cash only please" sign in their window. They must be on the fiddle
or don't want to pay loads of bank charges or risk bounced payments

Then I'm a 'judgy pants' too and I don't give a shit. I would think 'tax dodger' and I would probably report them to HMRC. People give those on benefits a tough time but its those who are lucky enough to have jobs dodging tax that irk me. Greedy twats who would happily call the police or go to hospital when they need it, but don't want to contribute. The whistle should be blown!
The big companies avoiding corporation tax using loopholes should be sorted first. I can see how people might be disillusioned when THEY avoid paying... Doesn't mean it's right to copy though.

To give a perspective on this from the other side of the coin....
I have been involved in the building trade for nearly 30 years and in my experience it is the customer who wants to pay cash,
as in: "Oh, and if we pay cash, can we just forget the VAT?"... expecting 20% knocked off. This used to be just on the little jobs, but now people spending tens of thousands on complete re-builds ask.
Well errr no.
For example, on a job of £10,000 plus vat the customer should pay £12,000 [£2000 vat].
That job breaks down to £5000 materials [plus £1000 vat] and £5000 labour [plus £1000 vat] so to just knock off the vat leaves us £1000 out of pocket.

We HAVE to be vat registered, as our turnover is over the threshold, we don't have a choice. Any builder/plumber/ and the like soon hits the threshold when they supply materials. Smaller, "odd job" types might avoid it but we can't.

I can see why they ask, an extra 20% to the government is a hell of a lot, but it is illegal not to charge it and yes, HMRC DO come and check the books and there are huge penalties if you are found out.

Mostly people pay by bank transfer...it's quick and easy. And if they "forget" then it's part of my job to remind them..

After all, Tesco's don't let you off the VAT if you pay cash.

If someone is accepting cash and not giving receipts, I think you need to ask what would happen if something went wrong, have they publicand employers liability insurance, have they a waste transfer licence, are they a bona fide trader at all?

Do any of the people who would shop someone purely for accepting cash payments really not know anyone who accepts cash AND pays tax? Most of my friends are self employed, many of them accept cash due to the nature of their business, and all pay tax, myself included.

It's not necessarily to avoid paying tax, it may be to avoid having to pay ridiculous bank charges- our plumber has to pay £3 for every cheque into his account.

Ah, op avoids all salient points to only notice the words "bad friend".

Trip trap trip trap whose this under the bridge...?

I am astonished that some posters on here automatically assuming any builder who takes cash is operating a tax fiddle, even when other posters have explained genuine valid reasons for preferring cashing in many cases.

Presumably this must also apply to every single person who ever accepts cash for any job. Like cleaners who might only do two hours per week at the house down the road and get paid cash because it's simpler and easier to leave out £20 than to write a cheque or do a bank transfer.

I almost never pay cash in hand and have paid all builders, plumbers decorators etc by bank transfer. It's the easiest and safest way to pay. I a don't agree with tax avoidance and have never asked for a discount for cash. Funnily enough anyone of my builders etc have ever asked me for cash. I must look honest.

However... I pay my cleaner cash .

I suppose I a hypocrite

Nearly everyone uses bank transfers these days so there is no real reason to ask for cash. If the tradesman doesn't trust the customer he can ask for a receipt of the transfer. It's more convenient than money.

I almost never pay cash in hand and have paid all builders, plumbers decorators etc by bank transfer. It's the easiest and safest way to pay. I a don't agree with tax avoidance and have never asked for a discount for cash.

Failing to declare a sum simply because you are paid in cash isn't tax avoidance - it's tax evasion and it's illegal, in the same way that failing to declare a cheque or bank transfer would be illegal.

Apart from that, are you suggesting that your cleaner must be breaking the law because they are paid in cash? Because if you don't trust them, you probably shouldn't allow them access to your house.

And no - 'nearly everyone' doesn't ask for bank transfers and it's not more convenient than money in a lot of cases.

Oddly, I hadn't thought of bank transfer. The last time we had to pay for work to be done was almost 2 decades ago, it wasn't possible back then. Ah the joys of internet banking .

I suspect that I will be using it... the first builder bod is due in a couple of weeks!

Quite apart from the tax implications I wouldn't pay a large sum in cash because I'd be terrified of walking home with it from the bank.

Really? People go around giving a shit about this kind of thing day to day.

Blimey!

it is not right BUT i suspect many of us have done it,i have,get the work done cheaper for cash

what gets my goat is when the self employed swear blind that they dont under pay tax and claim for things they shouldnt though,another thread though