Not to want armed police on the streets of Scotland.

[Solopower1]

I heard on the News yesterday that Scotland Police have been increasing the number of armed officers on the streets. I get the impression that this is being spread out quite widely over the whole of Scotland.

How did this happen? How come it wasn't discussed by politicians. Why wasn't there an open debate about it? I think they said on the programme that 60% of the public wanted the police to be armed. Where do those figures come from? Does anyone know anything more about this?

If you are so concerned about the numbers, do a foi request and see if you can get the information. If there is an increase, I bet my bottom dollar it's in single figures.

I think this might be to do with the centralizing of policing into one body in Scotland. I live in the sticks but apparently armed police are available 24/7 (told this by someone so no evidence) when previously that wasn't the case, they were based elsewhere, maybe in cities or near airports.

Can't believe there are loads more armed police, it would be too expensive.

They have always been available, that hasn't changed with the implementation of Police Scotland last year. There has just been more media focus, in my opinion.

There hasn't been any increase in numbers, remember that statistics can be made to say whatever you want them too.
That information is 'restricted' should be reassuring, not a concern-everything I do at work is covered by days protection, would you rather I ignored that and blabbed everything on the internet? Of course you wouldn't. Aren't you glad to know you can contact the police and you know it will be treated confidentially?

DATA protection!

So if doctors quietly decided that they would not treat anyone between 8 and 10 on a Tuesday, or teachers decided among themselves that they would spend ten minutes of each lesson telling children about the fairies at the bottom of the garden - that would be OK?

No-one's asking anyone to talk about anything that concerns individuals. All I would like to know is: is it the policy of Police Scotland that there should be more armed police on the streets? If so, why? And why was there no public discussion of such an important change?

I don't see why that should be a secret? If this is their policy, why shouldn't we know the statistics/research/experiences/scientific facts it is based on? Even - especially - if it is just a cost-cutting exercise, we should know that this is a result of government cuts.

Do you really think the police should police us without public scrutiny, accountability and transparency? There are many countries where that happens.

And Nicknacky, that is exactly what I don't want to happen. For the police gradually to increase the number of armed officers on the streets, and then when a debate starts about whether our police force should be routinely armed, they would turn round and say 'Oh we've been armed all this time and you haven't even noticed.'

No we don't, Mrs W! It's been done (according to the BBC). I wasn't told beforehand. Were you?

C'mon OP, we all have rules and regulations round confidentiality in our jobs. If you want to know the answer to questions like these you won't find them on a chat board. Email your MSP, or the MSP responsible for the police (still Kenny McAskill???) or do a foi to Police Scotland.

My understanding of it though is that firearms officers don't just sit around waiting to be called out. They are deployed operationally, like any other officer. But at any time they can be called to an incident where they need their firearms. So the firearms travel with them, securely. Officers can then access them when authorised. And only when authorised.

Do I like the thought of a police van with a lock box of guns driving down my street? Not particularly, but it seems to be the most practical solution in an every seconds count type of situation.

Op, I think you are reading too much into this. They are ensuring all available office are conducting patrols. There is NOT more armed officer on the street. The police are NOT routinely armed and never will be.

It will, in all likelihood, be the same number of armed officers on patrol that there have ever been. It's no different to using road policing officers for the same purpose.

I don't really think the public need to be consulted. It's not a secret, but what other organisation runs it's policies by the public first.

So, Wilson, you are saying they are not armed, but they have quick and easy access to a van with their weapons in it, just in case they get called to an incident?

That seems reasonable to me - better than them walking around with guns. But it wasn't what was reported.

I hope you're right, Nicknacky. However, I think the public do need to be consulted when there is a policy change in something that affects us all.

We have to watch the police as they watch us. Doctors, teachers, we're all accountable. The police are no different.

OP, If this concerns you so much you should contact your MPs as other posters have suggested. Honestly, when I first moved to the UK I was surprised to find out that all policeman didn't carry guns.

I think we need to disagree on that point about consultation. Deployment of available officers is not a change in policy. It's probably better left to the organisation itself to decide where the best use of resources are.

Yes, I love boasting to the overseas students I teach about how calm and controlled and professional our police are. How they rely on their training, intelligence and integrity; how they talk down a crisis rather than use the gun as a mouthpiece. I do still think/hope most police officers are like this - but my faith has been horribly shaken by some of the recent - and not so recent - examples of police malpractice.

I do actually think having an unarmed police force is something to be proud of. Which is why I want it to continue, or at least only to change if they can demonstrate that it is necessary for them to bear arms, in an open debate.

Sorry, that was to EurotrashGirl.

Nicknacky, it's not the same as deploying road police or other resources. They are not armed.

It will continue, the police will never be routinely armed.

And they do rely on integrity, intelligence and training to deal with the many varied incidents. Don't be fooled by recent events which may have altered your opinion. It's a tiny snapshot of the job that is done every day.

What exactly is your concern? Do you think people are likely to be shot?

From what I read, they aren't increasing the number of armed police officers, but they are more visible now.

That's certainly my understanding solo but of course I have read conflicting reports since I saw this thread! There is a response on the police Scotland website too, which I didn't think really cleared it up, but did mention that there are a total of around 280 permanently armed officers across the whole of Scotland. That's not a lot of people.

I think this blew up through a couple of incidents in the Highlands where officers were wearing firearms while responding to incidents. Again, I hate to think of anyone walking around with a gun in a holster, but I do think the geographical nature of policing in the Highlands must be challenging for armed response.

From what I've heard they won't be armed on the streets but will have access to side arms locked in vehicles rather than go back to base.

Also there are only 75 armed response officers in Scotland out of a police force of 17000. That's less than half a percent.

Quiet news day and unionist media bashing the Scottish Government.

They always carried the weapons in vehicles, (although I'm starting to doubt myself)!!I think reading the articles it's a change in the deployment process en route to incidents. Certainly in the old strathclyde area which covered such a vast area, it wouldn't be practical to go back to base in order to attend an incident elsewhere.

But yes, it's a tiny percentage of officers on duty that carry firearms.

I'm not denying that it is a small percentage - although WF says its 280 and Growl says 75 - the number is irrelevant.

What matters to me is that the numbers should not be allowed to rise without a proper, open, public debate. If Police Scotland say they need more armed officers, they have to tell us why, and make their case.