Wifi Worries.

[Jill9999]

Hi guys,

Just wanted some feedback/feelings from other ladies in a similar position, I've got a one year old boy and am becoming increasingly concerned about wifi around him and my iphone, I have some friends with older children who have got their own tablets and are hooked up to the house wifi all the time, but some things that my husbands friends have been hinting at recently have really worried me (one of them works in the wireless industry) so I started googling and found this study and web page:

generationzapped.com/trailer/

stopsmartmeters.org.uk/9th-grade-student-cress-wifi-experiment-attracts-international-attention/

My husbands friend used the tobacco industry as an analogy, apparently smoking used to been seen as healthy, doctors recommending it to people!!! Fact! It was a huge industry making billions (much bigger than it is now) the manufacturers suppressed studies that showed it was bad for health for ages until they couldn't hide it anymore but by then the health of many had been ruined beyond repair.

Wireless is a new technology, the industry makes trillions and apparently studies into the bad effects are being kept quiet, I love my iphone, would have it surgically implanted into my right hand if I could, but I waited so long for Charlie I just don't want to take any risks with him, am I being paranoid or healthily cautious? (first post so be kind )

I thought it was the receiver that was being looked at, rather than wifi in the air.
Like the aerial of a mobile (they're built in now, which is apparently worse than when we used to pull them out away from our heads). And it not being recommended to have a laptop actually on your lap etc.

Why is everyone ignoring peggyundercrackers, maybe address some of her points! Thank you peggy for adding some balance to the debate...

@NoIamAngelaHernandez. Yes wifi signals are out there all the time, those signals are called the beacon signal, but they have a limited range much less than the device that is searching to tether with the beacon signal, you searching with your device says more about the range of your device than about the constant presence of your neighbours wifi beacon signal... One more thing, what all concurring wifi provider covers the world from Mongolia to Alaska as shown in your map, I'm genuinely interested to hear this?

I've learnt so much since I started this discussion, the infos out there just google!

Op have you ever had mental health problems? Or do you think you might have pnd?

Jill, you're probably right, but we live in the modern world and there's nothing you can do about it.

If you start researching the effects of the additives in food, pesticides in the environment etc then you will have a whole lot more to worry about.

When your child reaches school, there will be other children who influence him in ways you don't like. Some of this could be damaging to his mental health.

Enjoy your baby! !!! You are doing the best you can for him, but social inclusion is as important as being protected from possible effects of modern living. We are all in this together, and you can't protect your child from the modern world. Love him, nurture him, give him confidence, self esteem and a good education, and he will be as equipped as he can be to deal with what life throws at him.

Please chill out a bit. Babies are only little for a short amount of time, and you should be enjoying the cuddles, not worrying about things you can't change.

(Ignore the bit about mental health I was just trying to make the point that we can't protect our children from everything, no matter how much we are desperate to keep them safe)

We used to live in Mid Wales next door to an otherwise delightful and charming couple who were convinced that wifi and various other electrical waves were causing illness in the wife of the couple. They had actually deliberately moved to Mid Wales as they believed it was less likely to poison them there. They took elaborate precautions including wearing crystal necklaces, and lining their house extension with foil. They had spent a fortune on various dodgy "meters", "cleansing devices" "protective necklaces" etc (ironically mainly from the internet), none of which had any basis in scientific fact. Our local GP was apparently sceptical, but they were also convinced htat there is an official "coverup" on this issue. All I know is that someone was making an absolute fortune out of two elderly and very gullible people.

The smoking analogy is ridiculous. I just don't think you can live your life being panicked about wifi, it is everywhere.

OP I could take a field strength meter to your house and demonstrate that you have a greater density from the electricity mains wiring that completely surrounds you.
Perhaps you should revert to gas lighting?

OP, I would suggest reading up about actual vs. perceived risk. Statistically your DS is significantly more likely to be hurt crossing the road than get cancer from Wifi.

you know WiFi and mobile phone signals are different types of signal right? AFAIK any hint of carcinogenic effect has been suggested about mobile phone signals, not WiFi

Jill are you the same Jill posting about salmonella in eggs but under a new name? Just wondered as you seem to be on the same kind of campaign trail against something not particularly worrying as the other OP. Seems a bit odd two posters called Jill both having the same kind of threads at once. .. call me a cynic and all that...

@CorusKate, that's not the case at all, when I started this thread did it look like that? The fact that I received mostly mockery and scorn made me rather argumentative but I'm not here to harangue anyone...

@OddFodd, I've not been disingenuous at all, haven't been using my brain much recently and this discussion has given me something to get my grey matter teeth into, plus like I said I know someone that works in the industry so that's always helpful. What do I intend to do with Charlie? Well I'm going to stop using wifi in the house, cables although not as convenient are faster and more reliable anyway, I'm going to get an electrosmog detector and try and ensure that Charile's bedroom is free of any frequency etc (good uninterrupted sleep is so important for healing etc...), I know frequency is everywhere, but if I can make the home, where he spends most of his time "safer" then that should reduce the risks...

@FloozeyLoozey No not got any mental health problems or depression, but if I did would I be the right person to ask?

@greenbananas, thank you for your input, I was expecting more people like you on this forum, more caring than judgmental...

@candycoatedwaterdrops Why is the smoking analogy ridiculous, it was a huge money making industry that was thought to be safe, endorsed by doctors! If electromagnetic radiation proves to be harmful then I think the analogy is totally fair, but there are other examples of humans getting it wrong, asbestos and Thalidomide for example, both thought to be safe, asbestos was used for thousands of years before it was worked out how lethal it is!

@Scuttlebutter I really do feel for your neighbours in Wales, I imagine it's totally possible for people to be allergic to Electromagnetic radiation, people are allergic to dust, if you're exposed to lots of dust you're just very dusty, but lots of radiation and it will burn you to a crisp! If a humans immune system starts flagging wifi or phone signals as a threat it's not hard to believe that could produce an allergic reaction. If your neighbours were subject to ridicule similar to what I've received on here then it's a very sad story...

@Scuttlebutter Mobiles and wifi are different frequencies but they're both non ionizing radiation, just like your microwave if you have one...

@Wonderous No not the Egg Jill, why would I create a different account to talk about eggs? If I had concerns I just voice them, we only eat organic eggs, anyone worried about eggs safety should probably do the same!

Mobiles and wifi are different frequencies but they're both non ionizing radiation, just like your microwave if you have one...

Mobiles and wifi are only "just like your microwave" if you consider the effects of someone flicking a drop of water at you as "just like" being hit by a firehose.

Wifi generates, at most, 100mW (0.1 watt). My microwave oven does 950W. In other words, my microwave oven generates around ten thousand times more energy than the wifi chip in my laptop. And yet you are trying to imply that they're just the same. Do you not understand the difference?

I want articles that say "Wireless is 100% safe without a doubt and we have no links with the industry whatsoever"

Well you'll have to wait a long time. Just as you'd have to wait a long time for anyone to write an article saying "Bananas are 100% safe without a doubt" or "The paint on your walls is 100% safe without a doubt". Science doesn't work like that.

Jill, no reputable scientist will ever say that something is 100% safe, even if they believe it is safe, and even if it has never been shown to do any harm, because science does not deal in absolutes.

The most a scientist can say is something has not been shown to cause harm, so you will never hear a reliable statement that anything is 100% safe. Of course, there is also the issue that nothing is 100% safe - drink too much water and you will die, for example.

There has been a lot of interesting work done on conspiracy theories, like the one you are putting forward on this thread. You may find it a better use of your time and grey matter to read some of the serious psychological research, rather than the stuff you have been spending your time on.

And I think you would also benefit from reading some work on risk - I have heard some good things about these:

www.amazon.co.uk/Reckoning-Risk-Learning-Live-Uncertainty/dp/0140297863/ref=sr_1_4?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1400496860&sr=1-4&keywords=gerd+gigerenzer
www.amazon.co.uk/Risk-Science-Politics-Dan-Gardner/dp/0753515539/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1400496800&sr=1-1&keywords=risk

Oh, and YABU.

Jill - you asked a question on possibly the most intense forum on the entire website. You asked whether you were being paranoid or healthily cautious. It was pretty unanimous that you were being paranoid but you have not taken any advice given and decided what to do regardless of the evidence pointing in the other direction. There is nothing else that anybody can tell you that will change your mind. Go ahead and try and wave-proof your home for the sake of your little boy.

I imagine it's totally possible for people to be allergic to Electromagnetic radiation

There's a big difference between what you might imagine is possible and what has actually been demonstrated. There have been a number of studies of people who claim "electro-sensitivity" or similar. Every time they are double-blind tested under controlled conditions it turns out that there is no correlation whatsoever between the appearance of their symptoms and their actual exposure to electrical fields. There is merely a correlation between when they think they're being exposed and the appearance of their symptoms. In other words it's a psychosomatic disorder not an actual sensitivity to electrical fields.

Just to add if you are worried about wifi and microwaves as they are "the same thing" - How worried are you about light? As that is the "sam thing" too - electromagnetic radiation, and has been proved to be linked to cancer.

'to ensure Charile's bedroom is free of any frequency'

what, you aren't even going to talk to him??? Sound waves have a frequency.

This is your problem - a little knowledge is a very dangerous thing. With your reasoning, you need to get rid of all e-fields in the house, which means no electricity. Back to candles and gas. You can't run your computer from those.

I'm all for using your brain, but you don't seem aware that the internet is a totally unregulated medium and any old bollocks can be posted there.

if you want to find out about science (and I'm all for that) start with an OU course, learn facts and how to do research, and then you will be better informed. But you will probably need electricity for internet access to do it.

No, no, no, specialsubject. Candles and gas will produce visible light - a type of electromagnetic wave. Blackout curtains and darkness at all times.

OP. I have suffered from anxiety in the past. I can't lie, this was one of my 'fears'. We have a dear friend who lectures in HE in a sort of public explaining field of science and he explained the scale of risk to me. In layperson's terms.

It's not much of a risk. His wifi apparatus is right in the centre of the house, right near where the children play, sleep, everything.

He is very careful with his DCs in the sun though. A professional scientist with a PhD and parent whose job it is to read research, distil it and, to a certain extent, take a view on it.

He's not bothered about wifi. So I'm not.

This is exactly the kind of thing that I was worried about when I was on the downward slide with my MH. It turned into full blown psychosis with extreme paranoia, mainly revolving around the health and risks of my children. (DS1 did have very real health problems, but my brain took this and I started worrying about everything around us affecting him)

I would have sworn until I was blue in the face that I was not ill, but I was a hair's width from being sectioned.

I am not saying you are mentally ill OP, but that I recognise from my experience that your anxieties about this are higher than what would be considered "normal" or "healthy"