To actually quite like paying tax

[SEmyarse]

I just find it baffling that all these super rich people seem to try to avoid paying into the system, and little old me is fine with it.

I'm self employed, and earn under 30k a year. i work as a driver. I do my own accounts and only really tax deduct for car costs (mileage system) and phone/internet. Other drivers are always going on about subtracting for things like suncream, sandwiches, coats and shoes which is fine but seems a bit nitpicky to me. The actual amounts on yearly accounts are very small on the odd occasions you have to buy these things.

But the biggie, is that on top of my regular courier contract, I do 3 evenings a week delivering takeaways which brings in about £100 a week. Literally everyone I've mentioned this to has made some kind of comment about being paid cash in hand (nudge wink), and are then totally astonished when I say I declare the earnings for tax. This includes dh, who wants me to pocket the money, but I refuse and get quite cross. In fact I'm increasingly uneasy with the fact that he would tax dodge if he could. He points to the fact that all the rich sorts do it, but that's not the point!

18 years ago I was homeless, pregnant, penniless, and my child's father was terminally ill. I have had a COLOSSAL amount out of the system. It was not perfect, I have been cross and frustrated many times. It took years to get appropriate housing and a care package for my first husband who managed to live an extra 10 years in the end (unexpected). But there was a system, with people working very hard within it, why would I not pay in? I accept there is always mismanagement of money under whatever administration but where would we be without any taxes at all?

It's not always easy to pay my tax bill, but when I do it always feels great to have done my thing. Having been so dependant in the past, it feels great that my life has improved and I can now contribute although I doubt I'm anywhere near being a net contributor.

I've desperately tried not to make this post sound smug, but I think I've failed and will probably be flamed. I'm not smug, one life change, and I could be back at the bottom, and then I hope others continue to pay their taxes so I may be helped again. So why is it so common and open for people to try all sort of tax dodges? Not just the super rich, I have heard all different classes talk of trying to keep their money from the tax man. Why? It's not for him, it's for all of us!

I second what a PP said upthread.
If I trusted the government I would be happier paying tax.
But I don't.

I don't trust their judgement and I don't trust them not to pocket as much as they can get their filthy little hands on.

I get what you mean Op - I work for a multinational so moving abroad would be relatively easy. There are many countries where I would be better off due to lower taxes.

But I find the idea of living in a country where there is no NHS equivalent morally repugnant so am happier in the UK.

Excluding my two years of mat leave I have been a hrt since I was 25.

Having said that, if DC could find a magic money tree in the garden of No 10 so none of us needed to pay tax I would be even happier still.....

Aga

The VAT threshold is on turnover though and not profit, also some businesses have to swallow the so called VAT they should be charging customers to keep competitive with businesses which don't charge VAT.

I love my tax free salary. I also think this is a bit goody goody. Pay it by all means but don't expect the majority of people to think it is such marvelous fun.

If you love it so much please donate to HMRC!

YANBU, I like paying tax too, mine is only at standard rate but dh pays higher rate and agrees.

I've heard both Ian Hislop and JK Rowling say that they appreciate paying tax and will not avoid paying it.

I love the Elizabeth Warren quote:

“There is nobody in this country who got rich on their own. Nobody. You built a factory out there - good for you. But I want to be clear. You moved your goods to market on roads the rest of us paid for. You hired workers the rest of us paid to educate. You were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for. You didn't have to worry that marauding bands would come and seize everything at your factory... Now look. You built a factory and it turned into something terrific or a great idea - God bless! Keep a hunk of it. But part of the underlying social contract is you take a hunk of that and pay forward for the next kid who comes along.”

I pay 40% tax and I agree with you OP.

Why would I object to paying 40% if I was earning loads? I'd still have more left than I do now, so could definitely live comfortably.

My earnings fluctuate, and over the last 5 years have gone up each year. I accept I get a fair bit tax free, but each time I earn more my % of tax goes up. I am genuinely happy about that. Apart from not being able to afford a house, i have everything I need, anything i earn more will be for luxuries, so I'm quite happy to give a proportion to the state.

I think YANBU. I have recently set up a business and feel the same

I pay tax at 40%. I hate it and wish I didn't have to pay so much. So much is wasted in random governance and so very little actually gets anywhere. I don't really take out anything from the system either such as education, healthcare even maternity services I went private. What do I get for my crazy work hours and input. Crazy house prices and supporting people in subsidised housing that I would like myself!

I totally understand what you mean OP. I'm sure most people don't actually like parting with money to be paid in tax, but I for one am glad of the public services taxes pay for.

I can see why it stings to have some of your earnings taxed at 40% if you earn more. I also think it's a bit unfair to make glib comments along the lines of 'well you still have more than me'. The person earning more is doing a job that's worth more money, that's how it goes.

In a fair world, everyone's pay would be taxed at the same flat rate. Since a lot of lower earners aren't making a living wage, this isn't doable.

There are of course flaws with the current system. I can't think of a fairer way to do it though.

Even those of us (myself included) on a low wage have it pretty good. We have free education and healthcare and to me paying tax is worth that!

But even those paying at forty percent aren't paying at forty percent over their income, only on income over 40k, they're on the same 20% tax rate up until that point, and still get the personal allowance up to 100k.

On balance, given what we get back for what we pay in comparison to over countries, it isn't too bad.

I wouldn't say I 'liked' paying it though...

If the OP likes it so much, can she pay some of mine please?

as far as HMRC giving people money back, only if they take the effort to chase them up. But you can bet your life that the moment you pay a penny less than you're supposed to they'll be right there branding you a a tax avoider.

HMRC have paid me back unasked for overpayments several times.

I'm with you OP. "like" isn't quite the word I would use though!

However I do agree with others that I am sometimes not happy with the way the tax is spent.

YANBU. And lovely post.

Last time I lived in a tax-free country we had to carry wads of dollars in case we needed ambulances or policemen.

YANBU. People who pay 40% tax still have more left over than people in lower rate tax bands, too, so they should STFU or move to Dubai if they really think they work so much harder than everyone else- they like to think the country would collapse without them but it wouldn't, any more than it has when nurses and police officers are made redudant- no one is indispensible and it would make room for all the more socially responsible graduates who are out of work to take up their positions.

YANBU. I'd much rather live somewhere with high taxes and fantastic care, health, education, transport etc for everyone than somewhere where everyone was responsible for their own little bit.

Nice quote oddboots

"it would make room for all the more socially responsible graduates who are out of work to take up their positions."
Not in many cases, the person would just do their job from Dubai instead of here.

"I'd much rather live somewhere with high taxes and fantastic care, health, education, transport etc"
Do we really have fantastic care, health, education and transport though? I wouldn't say so. Better than many, even most countries? Yes, but "fantastic"? I wouldn't say so at all.

YANBU, it pays for excellent things and whilst many posters are complaining they don't trust the government or don't agree with what some of it is spent on that's not how democracy works. You have your chance to say how it's spent at the election, if you don't like it vote for someone else.

I don't have an issue with paying tax but being self employed I will ensure that I minimise my tax burden as much as is feasible.

I don't avoid like some of the high profile companies (as this just isn't possible) but it is foolish to pay more than is due.

Given the. Current climate you could be better off avoiding as much tax as possible i.e. By claiming for as many legitimate expenses as possible, and then donating money to a food bankroll other charity. At least you know the money is going directly to those that are needy.

Sorry for the poor post. Bloody iPad!

YANBU. I paid the 50% rate and now the 45% rate and don't even have a tax free allowance. I don't mind paying tax, and don't bother with any tax loopholes - the only thing I do is pay extra into a pension which everyone is entitled to do - I'm def not a Gary Barlow!

I do get annoyed how taxes are sometimes used by the government but I would get annoyed even if I was on the lowest rate tax band. I also get annoyed when people make judgements against higher rate tax payers as we all are not out there to screw the tax system as much as we can!

If I'm paying high British taxes, I would rather get in return high fantastic care, health, education and transport!

When compared with other European countries, most of these are pretty dire. The Dutch and German healthcare systems are far superior and I've paid for my own physio, osteopath, plastic surgery and dental treatment following a road traffic accident. Last time I looked my parents paid for my education and I paid for uni. The transport's shit - I have a car because its not feasible to use public transport (i.e. there isn't any) and the roads are full of potholes and queues.

I wouldn't go so far as to say I like paying tax, but, like you, I certainly don't mind.

I appreciated it just a little bit more when I was cared for by the NHS each time I had a baby, and when my ds got hit by a car, and when my dd fractured her arm, and when more lovely parents were suffering and needed care, and when they diagnosed and treated my cancer - all regardless of our ability to pay.

Then there's the fact that all of my dc receive an education, I'm protected by a police force and justice system. Hopefully I'll never need an ambulance or fire engine, but it's reassuring to know they are there. Then there's the roads, the armed forces, the prison system, the intelligence forces, and so the list goes on and on and on. All things that you don't tend to think about every day, but you'd soon miss if they weren't there.