To be irritated that ds was not allowed to go to his instrument lesson today?

[SixImpossible]

Apparently they had a maths test,and "maths is more important than music". TBH I'm not sure whether those are ds's words or his teacher's. He has one 20minute violin lesson every week, which we pay for. What right do the school have to prevent him attending? The music company will not reimburse or replace missed lessons unless they themselves cancel.

Got to laugh at the comments that 1 math test wouldn't make a difference, but surely 1 violin lesson missed would make a difference also

It's less about missing the lesson and more about the parent having to pay for that lesson.

So it comes down to money.

Yes, it does. If you pay for something you should get what you pay for.

Incidentally ds goes to & dd used to go to a very academic private school & neither have ever had to miss an instrumental lesson for any reason other than a school trip.

Ican It comes down to the fact that the school offered the lesson at £8 a week or whatever and people took them up on that principle.

They did not offer them at

"The lessons technically cost £8 a week but actually we may £96 a term and your child could miss 1 or more lessons a term if they clash with SATs, a school trip or the teacher having a bad day. You won't get your money back in this case."

If you think that that is "fair selling" then I have a few things I want to sell to you......

For the person who asked who earns more - a mathematician or a musician - that (genuinely) depends on whether you are looking at the mean, the median or the mode.

I am now fondly remembering the rather lovely fractal for piano I composed in my final year of advanced mathematics in secondary when we were told to design one. It was actually a very good fractal but I'm fairly sure the maths teacher had no idea and so marking it was a challenge for them.

That said at Y2 I'd be very miffed about this situation. Music lessons at a young age are so good for cognitive development and frankly the idea of 'tests' that can't be missed when children are seven - and the idea that missing said test will somehow determine their future - is laughable. Whereas going a fortnight between short lessons rather than a week - well, as a former music teacher, you can really see the difference unless the child is very diligent about practising.

I'd go in and discuss it with the school and ask that, seeing it was the school's teacher that prevented your ds from going to his music lesson, are they going to reschedule the lesson for another day, give you a refund for the lesson or should you deduct the amount for the lesson from your payments for the next set of sessions (assuming that your ds isn't leaving school and moving on to a different school at the end of term - is it an infant school or a primary school?). DOn't give them the option of just saying 'oh sorry. hey ho, he missed it, nothing we can do.

Also make sure you clarify what should happen in the future should this situation happen again. If Sats are coming up soon then there's a good chance that (even if it's for other people) there are going to be some 'proper' sats tests and some more practice ones in the near future, you don't want to discover too late that your ds misses several because his teacher deems in class practice tests more important than his music lesson so won't let him go, particularly if it means you have to pay and you don't get the music lesson.

Aren't sats supposed to be for measuring the school rather than the individual - so the pressure is more on her for the results than for him iyswim, which might be why she is stressing about practice tests!

It's about so many things, not least the fact that the school have no right to decide whether I get what I have contracted for and paid for.

This term he misses part of a maths lesson for violin, missing part of a different lesson on alternate weeks. The day and time varies every term - one term he was missing part of his lunch break. All my dc have instrument lessons on this system in all their schools, and none have ever had this happen to them.

As to 'failing', or not meeting targets...no, not this child. Not a concern at all.

Of course all children should learn a musical instrument as part of the core curriculum. In my primary we all learned recorder. The class teacher taught us. But our dc are being educated to a curriculum that is not in any way holistic. Ohhhh don't get me started on SATs!

I don't expect musical prodigies. I don't expect scholarships. I expect well-rounded children. Music is part of that.

7yos should not be sitting formal tests IMO. Assessments can be done discreetly, in a subtle and relaxed manner. KS2 SATs do not AFAIK require formal tests any more.

I'd say that missing the music lesson at age 7 would have more impact than missing a maths test.

It's a maths test- he wasn't even learning anything during it!

At age 7, if they've arranged for music lessons in class time, then the child should go to that lesson - if there's something deemed more important like a test then the music lessons should be rearranged for them.

At secondary age, pupils who do music lessons in school time are expected to deal with any rearrangements themselves, and to catch up on classwork (including doing tests during a break) and ensure they find out if homework was set while they were out.
At my DD's school, they ensure that from yr10, music lessons are before school or during breaks - below that I don't think there was ever anything that overrode the music lessons.

frankly the idea of 'tests' that can't be missed when children are seven - and the idea that missing said test will somehow determine their future - is laughable

You should become a year 2 teacher then. You'd be laughing all day long.

Pipbin, can you elaborate on why it's critical to the child's future?

It's not critical I'll grant you but the results of this test may determine their class or group next year. It might open the door for them being given extra support. It may allow the teacher to see that there is a gap in one area of their understanding.

Really pipbin, so the kid that was off sick for that critical maths test has to spend their next year demoted to 'circles' because they too missed this critical test. Really?

I work in a school office, he should definitely have been allowed to go/time swapped etc. school needs to refund you.

No, but they would have had to do the test at another time. Which would have taken the TA out of the classroom and the child out of another lesson. It's much easier for all involved for all children to do the test at the same time.

I think the system is wrong. We shouldn't be testing so much. But schools and teachers are forced into it.
The child's music lesson should have been re schuduled.
I am getting frustrated at the prevailing attitude that education of seven year olds doesn't really matter.
Learning an instrument is hugely important and as the parent is paying for the lesson they have every right to be annoyed. But so many people seem to be thinking that year 2 is just glitter and glue. But then people think that nursery is just playing.

He's in Y2. How important can a test be in Y2?!
Key Stage 2 SATs, that's how important; Targets for Key Stage 2 SATs are based on these results. The music service constantly interrupting classes on a daily basis, as happens in my school, is extremely disruptive for the child concerned, and for the rest of the class; the violin teacher even tried to remove a child while he was sitting an end of year exam. Music is important but individual lessons should be held out of school, as are ballet, riding and sports coaching. My sympathies are entirely with the teacher.

I actually gave up learning a musical instrument at secondary school as the lesson times were non-negotiable unless actual exams (End of Year or O Levels) were involved and the History teacher threw a strop every lesson that I had to leave and delayed me by 10 minutes as she ranted how I wasn't learning in that time and the entire class was being disrupted by me slipping out at 2:20. When I returned at 2.50 she then had a further 10 minute rant.

The fact that I was consistently getting A's in my work in History as I always caught up later she totally ignored.

She made such a fuss every lesson for a year that in the end I decided to quit. And then every History lesson she would say "Revenge, don't you need to go and play with your toy now"

I had to go to the deputy Head in the end and request I was put in a different History group as she spent all her time picking on me for leaving her class for what she deemed toys! She was one hell of a nasty witch!

I think the education of kids of all ages matters, but that music is an important part of it - and that a lot of the testing done seems to be for the benefit of the school, not the child.

I actually gave up learning a musical instrument at secondary school as the lesson times were non-negotiable unless actual exams (End of Year or O Levels) were involved and the History teacher threw a strop every lesson that I had to leave and delayed me by 10 minutes as she ranted how I wasn't learning in that time and the entire class was being disrupted by me slipping out at 2:20.

Although there is nobody as bad as your history teacher at dd's secondary school some the the teachers do make a bit of a fuss about music lessons and keep making the point that they don't have to let them go etc etc. Interestingly it's always the cookery or sewing teachers that do this (or whatever they're called nowadays), never the teachers of academic subjects. If they ever stop dd going on a whim I'm going to kick up a huge fuss about it.

I'd really question the importance of that specific maths test / lesson and why it couldn't be missed. If it was SATs then the school should have rearranged the lesson that week but otherwise it couldn't have been that important.

Aside from giving a child a rounded education, at this age learning music can itself help with mathematics and understanding of patterns as well as developing aural skills which can help with listening and language skills and learning foreign languages.

Whether or not you think they should only be held after school Goblin, the fact is that the school offers them in school time, so that should be honoured.

At dds school it's the dance teachers who won't let them out of class for instrumental lessons!

Missing academic subjects is not a problem. (Yr 7)