to say something to my friend?

[reallyneedmoresleep]

My friend and I both have six year old sons in the same class at school. She's a lovely lady, but has a rather...um... different approach to parenting than I do - she rarely seems to have any boundaries for her children, and I don't think I've ever seen her discipline them beyond a bit of a sad ""Oh DS!" when they are totally disobeying her.
Her youngest son is a clever child who can sometimes be lots of fun and can sometimes be a total little monster. I've just found out that another child in the class is leaving the school because of the aggressive and bullying behaviour of my friend's son. There are a number of other mums in the year group who are starting to turn against my friend and her child - all sorts of e-mails flying round along the lines of "we should all write a letter demanding that this child is expelled" etc etc.
The thing is, I think my friend is unaware of all of this. She has been called in to school a couple of times to deal with her son's behaviour, but she just feels he's a creative, free-spirited type who struggles with being the youngest in the school year.
Should I say something to my friend? Should I let her know how the other mums are feeling before it turns into a full-blown witch-hunt? Or should I just butt out? I know she'd be devastated at some of the things the other mums are saying, but if someone had removed their child from school because of my child's behaviour I would REALLY want to know. Sorry for a long post!

Yes I do agree with Denzel that a good friend would tackle the observed poor behaviour (of the parent!) at the time. Not that it would be easy of course and it may end the friendship, but equally it may really help the child.

Morally it would be the right thing to speak to your friend.

Sorry, I slightly misread your op.

Since some of the group emails have been sent to you rather than you just having heard about them I would definitely send an email back to whoever has written them saying along the lines of "While I understand some of your concerns this parent is a friend of mine/ours and I don't want to be involved in doing anything behind her back. I would be very hurt if anyone did this to me".

OP, I have a very similar issue...

DD is a very friendly girl and she loves all the girls (and boys) in her Reception class. She is very small (and one of the youngest) and that, coupled with her friendly nature means that everyone wants to play with her. But there is one girl who is very possessive. She tells the other girls that they can't play with DD (or whichever child is in her sights that particular day) and all the other girls get upset.

I am a really friendly bubbly person and I am helping this girl's mother out because they are moving house and trying to decorate, so I'm having her DD on occasion after school. I've had to tell her off when she's here, but I will do (without guilt) when she's being naughty in my care. She always behaves impeccably afterwards and is definitely a good friend when one on one. But due to her 'manipulative' (their words not mine) nature at school the other parents have had enough.

I feel really bad for the Mother and she has no idea how her DD behaves like this and I think would be upset and would have a chat with her if she was aware of it.

But I don't know whether to let the other parents speak to the school (like they intend to do) and stay out of it... This Mum is lovely, but she's got a DH who works every night and she has three children under 5. I imagine this crap is the last thing she needs...

Sorry, also Denzel, I thought you were writing from the point of veiw of the parent of the misbehaving child. Yes, I agree with you now that I see you are writing from the pov of an aggrieved parent! Need to have a big cup of coffee and wake up I think!

KEG - perhaps have a couple of sessions with one or two other children present? This girl obviously needs to learn to play in a group.

RoadKillBunny - If I did anything it would be to tell the school that parents are ganging up on a 6 year old boy.

You obviously have NO experience of the havoc and misery one child can impose on a whole class of children, do you?

Stay out of it. If the school aren't communcating effectively that's on them, not you.

Part of me thinks you should stay well out of it, bit then the other half of me feels sorry for all the children that are terrorised by a child who is so badly behaved, and they deserve everything possible to be done for them.

If telling your friend is likely to spur her into action to stop her child upsetting so many others either by doing some parenting or leaving the school, then it's probably best that you tell her.

S'ok Gurnie, on very little sleep here myself!

We've had this recently with a little friend regularly clouting DS. We dealt with that via the school and very gently with parents. The fact that this child is routinely doing the same to others and being disruptive generally (according to DS) went unmentioned. I didn't think adding a lot of hearsay and rumour would actually get the parents to be more proactive-quite the opposite.

And anyway, in our case, the school is on it very effectively and kindly, so parents piling in would just undermine all the efforts to get this little boy on the right track.

I think it's an overreaction to call it ganging up on the child or a witchhunt. The other parents have a problem with the school and the parent of the child.

What has the school done? Why did it get so bad that a child actually left school? Obviously the school isn't handling it very well, is it? Perhaps a new target has now been set and the parents are watching another child being bullied while the school again isn't doing much.

Based on OP alone, there's a lot of assumptions being made.

The other parents are chatting (albeit nastily) and exchanging views on a situation and then... What, some of you think they are going to confront the child?! Or the parent?! No, they are going to go to the school.

From that, to me it sounds like their issue is that the school isn't handling it.

Do you think she is aware of the situation and just burying her head in the sand because she hasn't a clue how to deal with it, and if she doesn't think or talk about it she doesn't have to confront the issues?

FFS - it is the school that does the disciplining during the day. If they can't control the child, then I'm pretty certain they will have had more communication with the parents than just calling them in a couple of times.

Don't get involved, or if you feel you must, I'd speak to the HT for advice leave it in their hands.

I agree that you should keep well out of it. She won't thank you. I wish these heads in the sand parents would get a grip and start being a parent.

The thing is, if the school won't deal with it effectively enough to solve or drastically minimise the problem then parents are left feeling that they have no choice but to do something themselves.

They understandably don't want to move their child away from where they are settled, may have siblings and good friends or disrupt their chosen school run, so if the school is going to be ineffectual, then what else are parents supposed to do?

They keep going back individually and follow the bullying procedure. If they all do it for every single incident that has affected their child then the school either has to listen, or is completely ineffective anyway.

Ganging up to write a letter about a young child is inexcusable; horrible behaviour.

There is only so much schools can do though when the problem is a clear lack of discipline from parents. They can talk to the parents as much as they like, but if a parent refuses to believe that their child has a problem, then all they can do is manage the situation at school, which on its own is unlikely to put an end to the problem.

I agree that writing a group letter about a child isn't very nice behaviour, but I can well understand parents feeling like they have no other option when they've already spoken to the school individually and nothing has changed.

Keep well out of it.

Just want to say thank you so much everyone for your thoughts and wise counsel ! Sorry I haven't replied earlier. I decided not to say anything to my friend, on the grounds that it's the school's job to do so, and not sure what I could usefully say anyway.
A group of other mums are demanding a meeting with the head teacher, so we'll see what happens.