Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think working parents don't 'do all the things SAHPs do plus work'?

603 replies

Sampanther · 19/04/2014 15:12

I've heard this response an awful lot, particularly to that awful 'being a SAHM is the hardest job in the world' advert. I have worked outside the home and been a SAHM and I do not feel that working meant I did all the parenting plus work on top. For example, as a SAHM parent I'd deal with squabbling, tantrums, discipline, naps, take them to parks/soft play etc and help them to play nicely with other children, cook with them, do painting and play doh and so on.

As a working parent I had an hour of getting them ready in the morning, dropped them off at childcare, then an hour of winding them down and putting them to bed at night. I could eat and go to the toilet in peace during the day, the house was tidy and needed little cleaning as we were rarely in it and I had very little to do with discipline etc.

I'm not trying to say working parents don't parent, because obviously they do but AIBU to think parents who work fulltime don't 'work and do all the parenting as well'? I don't get why working mums respond that way and think they're right but if a working husband came home and said to his stay at home wife that he does just as much parenting as her then I'm sure mumsnet would not agree.

OP posts:
janey68 · 22/04/2014 13:10

Surely well balanced, emotionally healthy people get their sense of identity and 'worth' from a range of experiences and achievements, including parenting, career and countless other relationships/ interests/attainments?

It seems to me that investing in any one singular achievement as your route to validation is absurd.

And just to make the point clear (not that anyone has disagreed but I feel it's an important distinction to make) I think validation comes from good parenting, not the simple act of giving birth. Anyone can give birth (or impregnate a woman) - it takes valuable qualities to raise a child well.

FourForksAche · 22/04/2014 13:13

Validation is nice, but I'd like national insurance contributions instead please.

MrsThor · 22/04/2014 13:48

I have done both ie worked full time and then for the last two years been a sahm. I did similar parenting in both situations however I felt when I was working that I had very little time for me...I was always last on the list I have enjoyed my time off however I am now becoming brain dead and starting to think about going back to work. Dh asked me today if I had remembered to buy his Yakult and all I could think was " for ffs I have a masters degree ,get your own bloody Yakult"

I think the best way to be a "good parent" is to be happy and fulfilled

redskyatnight · 22/04/2014 13:52

tingatingatale - your list is exactly why WOHP make the statements about "doing all that and working as well". Because other than the actual hands on caring and entertaining during the day (which has been acknowledged many time on this thread as the big difference), your list could have been produced by a WOHP! They still have to get up, make all the meals, read with children, tidy the house, do the washing, walk the dog, do the ironing, ...

janey68 · 22/04/2014 14:08

I expect quite a few of us avoid ironing actually...

splendide · 22/04/2014 14:12

Presumably SAHPs do more housework than WOHP because if noth parents work then the housework is more 50/50? Doesn't apply to single parents of course.

DH is going to be a SAHP when I go back to work after maternity leave (I'm pregnant now), I wouldn't expect him to do everything but I would expect it to be more than 50/50 to be honest. Am I being unfair/ unrealistic do you think? It's our first so it's all really unknown!

splendide · 22/04/2014 14:12

sorry noth = both

Rigbyroo · 22/04/2014 14:15

Boring and rage inducing! I work part time, am I a part time worker or a part time mother?! I do all the things a sahm does and work! Ridiculous and pointless argument.

FourForksAche · 22/04/2014 14:18

I don't believe parents will get any benefit from comparing a stay at home parent's day to a working parent's day. It seems to me that in the majority of cases, one parent's career is affected to a degree when children are born, even when both parents stay at work. And in the majority of cases, it seems to be women who take the hit.

I would love to see a situation in the UK where men could more easily work flexibly to share a true 50% of childcare needs.

splendide · 22/04/2014 14:20

I agree FourForksAche. In my job, it just isn't possible really to progress and be taken seriously part time which is ridiculous. If we could both have reduced hours and shared the childcare and the working I think we would.

FourForksAche · 22/04/2014 14:21

I would expect it to be more than 50/50 to be honest. Am I being unfair/ unrealistic do you think?

If I could have managed childcare of 2 babies and 50% of housework in the same hours my partner was working it would have been a miracle. Grin

I think, before the kids are in full time school, it's very difficult to get chores done. Mine would only accept being penned in the baby prison for very short periods of time.

unlucky83 · 22/04/2014 14:34

Tinga made an important point that was ignored -
(And I have also done both WOHM & SAHM)
Assuming your DCs are in childcare everyday out of the home...
When you are working -you leave a tidy (or untidy) house in the morning and come home to one - SAHP it is constant - even with just an adult in during the day the house will get messier than if it is empty (otherwise why do places of work have cleaners?) Until you have been a SAHP you really can't appreciate the difference (believe me - I was shocked...) - just everything gets grubbier...(remembers fondly working FT and a quick run round for 3 hrs on a Sunday was all it took)

And the 50:50 balance - if you are a SAHP you feel obliged to do more around the house than if you are both working FT...
And if you are WOH you want to see and spend time with your DCs - you miss them - they are a change (as good as a rest?) ...as a SAHP often you can't wait to get a break from them ...and you rarely do..
Instead of it being a competition can we just agree that both are hard work, with ups and downs ...with some people are more suited to either role...
Personally I think working FT for 3 days a week would be ideal - but maybe that is also a case of the grass being greener...

FourForksAche · 22/04/2014 14:37

Instead of it being a competition can we just agree that both are hard work, with ups and downs ...with some people are more suited to either role...

yes!

RufusTheReindeer · 22/04/2014 14:46

Just about every thread I read on this subject has the vast majority of posters agreeing that everyone is different that some people find SAHM hard and some people find WOHM hard

Some people want to SAHM but can't, some people want to WOHM but can't

Most agree that WOHM and having to juggle work and children and housework and childcare is very hard

Most agree that a WOHM mother of under 3s does not do the same amount of childcare that a SAHM of under 3s does...but they do the same parenting

But loads of threads end up with people getting defensive and feeling put upon

FWIW I have never had anyone being negative to me, I have never been negative to anyone else. It only seems to be on here

And actually I thought this thread was quite restrained

FourForksAche · 22/04/2014 14:53

Rufus, I've noticed a dramatic change in the way people spoke to me when I was an engineer compared to the way people speak to me as a "housewife". It's soul destroying. Obviously, we don't all have the same experiences though.

splendide · 22/04/2014 14:55

Oh god, I've got so much learning to do haven't I?! Poor DH.

RufusTheReindeer · 22/04/2014 14:58

four

I understand what you're saying,

I had a friend talking about teachers (we are both dinner ladies a few times a week) ignoring her. That never happens to me, either because I'm not noticing it or because I say hello to everyone so they have to say hello back!

Having said that my pre children job wasn't as impressive as engineer so there probably wasn't such a change in behaviour IYSWIMSmile

TheRealAmandaClarke · 22/04/2014 15:22

Yes janey that's sort of what I'm driving at. Well balanced ppl should get their validation from a variety of things. (assuming we need validation, which we seem to)

jasminemai · 22/04/2014 16:45

I dont think either are that bad under normal circumstances eg you and your children are in good health.

Sahming your staying at home in a place with all mod cons and no real hard graft to do as its not like the mangle days, and working whatever your doing its hardly sweatshop hard graft either. People just like to moan

TheRealAmandaClarke · 22/04/2014 16:57

people just like to moan
Yes.

jasminemai · 22/04/2014 17:01

Some of these lists always make me laugh as they hardly describe the worlds most taxing days. Imagine in real life saying Ive had such a hard day I ironed, washed up and took the kids out. People would literally think you were crazy.

fidelineish · 22/04/2014 17:09

people just like to moan

Maybe but, equally, people don't like to feel denigrated and naturally try to defend themselves when they are.

Until everyone keeps their remarks to themselves the issue will persist, won't it?

Unlucky is right, I think, to draw attention to Tinga's overlooked point about SAHPing generating more work. It helps to explain the gap between the two perspectives.

jasminemai · 22/04/2014 17:15

A lit is hardly hard work though people just write it like thst to make it sound like a momentous task.

I say that as someone who actually gets paid to do most of those things but its not really hard work or real hard graft most of the time.

fidelineish · 22/04/2014 17:26

Actually Rufus just summarised everything perfectly at 14,46

Retropear · 22/04/2014 17:28

Hardly hard work,seriously.Hmm

I must be really weak then as I did find it hard work when the dc's were tiny and I speak as a former teacher who has taught in some challenging schools.It was also mundane and incredibly tiresome at times.

To be honest I suspect many office jobs are the latter and probably a lot easier than caring for 3 pre- schoolers at times.

However hard it was the point was I was there and that was why I did it not for a pat on the back by anybody.It's easier now but I never stop,finding it hard to fit in job hunting tbh.

Swipe left for the next trending thread