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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to resent well off 60+ people that get free unlimited bus travel

345 replies

SuzzieScotland · 15/04/2014 15:21

I can't afford a car, so I walk, cycle or bus everywhere.

The bus costs almost a pound a mile so it is seen as a treat for me.

A yearly ticket is 1000 or if your a student you can buy a £12 bus I'd card every year and get a yearly ticket that costs 750. This seams far too expensive.

Yet I see many pensioners who run two cars using the bus to get into town or to the airport totally free despite being well off. I think their would be uproar if a 20 pound admin fee a year was applied to these bus passes. In London a year ticket is 3k but anyone over 60 gets unlimited tube and bus despite 100000s of them still in full time work.

Just seams like the young and poor are getting a very raw deal to win grey votes.

OP posts:
ICanSeeTheSun · 15/04/2014 17:54

I think the bus passes should be the same age as retirement, same for winter fuel payments.

bustraintram · 15/04/2014 17:54

BeastOfBurden

Bus operators are paid per journey. Either the pass is scanned or the driver presses a button on the ticket machine, and the bus operator gets a set amount of money per journey based on the average single fare for that route. That means any passes not used are not costing the government anything. In addition, it's not compulsory to request a pass so many people who will never ever use them just won't ask for one.

NurseyWursey

Why does it concern you that disabled people have to travel at off-peak times? It seems only fair that they don't travel for free but take up space a fare paying passenger needs, just like elderly people. If they want to travel at peak time they can pay the fare as normal. In fact, it makes sense for people in wheelchairs to avoid peak buses as they are the ones where it will be hardest for them to get access to the wheelchair bay as the buses are busy.

NurseyWursey · 15/04/2014 18:01

bustraintram

Because disabled people work too, and need to be able to travel at the same times non disabled people do Hmm they can't avoid peak times, and why the hell should they. You're acting as though they're a burden to busses.

Partly the reason why disabled people need free bus passes is because they rely on them much more. They can't just have a quick walk like able bodied people do. They can't get that far.

NurseyWursey · 15/04/2014 18:02

and as for 'taking up a space a fare paying passenger needs' Confused instead of blaming those who are travelling just like anyone else blame the bus companies for not having enough buses maybe.

bustraintram · 15/04/2014 18:05

NurseyWursey

But nobody is stopping them from travelling to work, only saying they have to pay (often half fare). Wasn't the whole point of free bus passes to maintain mobility for those who didn't work due to age or disability, so if they work they ought to be able to afford the fare and travel in peak.

I don't see them as a burden to buses at all, however in my work for a bus company as a customer assistant (hence the nickname), the opinion the majority of wheelchair users have expressed is that they prefer a quiet bus. Many would rather wait for twenty minutes and get a slow bus they know will be empty rather than take a fast bus that was full.

Nennypops · 15/04/2014 18:06

YABU. The cost is pretty minimal, and it helps the economy in other ways - elderly people using the passes may well be going to shops, exhibitions, shows etc that they would otherwise not go to, and indeed it may keep them in work where they would otherwise stop. If they're well off, the chances are that (a) they hardly ever actually use the passes, (b) they've been paying taxes for 40 years plus, and (c) they're still paying taxes.

Handsoff7 · 15/04/2014 18:07

OP YANBU. Subsiding one the richest groups in our society with free travel is a really odd use of taxes.

I'd be in favour of free bus passes to low earners / the unemployed.

candycoatedwaterdrops · 15/04/2014 18:08

The older people who are 'well off' are more likely to be asset rich, so means testing would be a waste of time.

NurseyWursey · 15/04/2014 18:11

bustraintram

It is about creating equality for people with disabilities. Their disability may mean they need public transport more than the average person. As we all know bus fares are ridiculous, so it puts disabled people at a disadvantage. We have a choice, we can walk. A disabled person doesn't have that choice. The least we can do is give them a free bus pass to enable them the freedom of travel - no matter if they're going to work or for a day out.

SouthernComforts · 15/04/2014 18:19

I agree that the cost of public transport needs to come down.

I live in a northern town, very cheap rent etc but if there are two people waiting for the same bus it is cheaper to get a taxi. I'm a 'young driver' and it's cheaper to insure a car than pay bus fare.

Scoffalotachocfortea · 15/04/2014 18:19

How many of you that are complaining about bus passes for elderly are happy to accept child benefit, child tax credits, free school meals, housing benefit etc which is being paid for in part from the tax these well off pensioners are still paying?

Next you will be recommending euthanasia for over 60's FFs!

NurseyWursey · 15/04/2014 18:22

Agree scoff

ScrambledEggAndToast · 15/04/2014 18:27

I never knew that the government just "bought" them I always assumed that they paid for each individual journey. You learn so many new things on Mumsnet. I have a free bus pass as I am disabled (I would give it back freely if it meant I didn't have epilepsy but that's another story). What I do think is unfair is that it can't be used before 9am as it is no good for going to work and with my condition I get very tired so it would help me being able to get the bus for free.

Rooble · 15/04/2014 18:33

Interesting how many people assume that disabled people can't walk. I'm a disabled person who can't drive (have epilepsy), however am perfectly capable of walking :-)
Our LA has recently changed its rules so we can't travel before 09.30 or after 23.00 (????? Presumably if you can afford to be out late you can afford a bus ticket?), which as I'm a SAHM isn't a massive issue - and if I'd still been working my job was well enough paid for me to be able to pay full fare.
However, for those disabled people living where I do who are unemployed and need to get into town (7 miles - closed DWP office) for an appointment with a benefits advisor before 10.30am it's really expensive.
But the free fares as they stand are unsustainable. It's unhelpful to gripe at individual groups who people think are less deserving - as a PP said the best way to go would be a fully integrated, well- subsidised public transport system such as you'd find in, eg, Switzerland

Rooble · 15/04/2014 18:35

Sorry - closest DWP office I meant

ABeautifulLie · 15/04/2014 18:41

I live near a bus stop that takes people to the two nearest cities. Many pensioners park their cars near the bus stop then use the free bus pass to go out for the day.
I don't think it would be a bad idea for pensioners to give up their driving license in order to receive a bus pass. I don't think they need both.

PavlovtheCat · 15/04/2014 18:45

But nobody is stopping them from travelling to work, only saying they have to pay (often half fare). Wasn't the whole point of free bus passes to maintain mobility for those who didn't work due to age or disability, so if they work they ought to be able to afford the fare and travel in peak

You are joking right? you presume that people who work must have more money than if they were on benefits? So many people work, with disabilities (and often additional costs as a result of working with a disability) when they would potentially be better off financially on benefits but they drag themselves into work day after day, in order to continue to achieve something for themselves, maybe if they were to stop working they would lose not only their mobility, ability to care for themselves fully, ability to parent as they want, loss of friends, hobbies and their identity outside of work, but then they would lose their career, their identity as a person, their self esteem, their confidence. Perhaps in the hope that one day their disability might not affect them as badly as it currently does, perhaps while waiting for the added pressures of being a parent oh, wait, but, perhaps some people agree that disabled people to subside as their children grow and managing a disability as a parent becomes easier.

And in order to do that, to keep working, perhaps free bus passes make that possible when they cannot drive a car or walk to work.

bustraintram · 15/04/2014 18:46

ScrambledEgg

They do pay for each individual journey, the poster up thread was wrong. I work for a bus company-we get paid per journey based on the average single fare for that route and the driver presses a button on the ticket machine every time he sees the pass, to log the journey.

NurseyWursey · 15/04/2014 18:51

rooble obviously I meant disabled people who can't walk very well. I'm fully aware there are different types of disability..

ICanSeeTheSun · 15/04/2014 18:52

Hospital appointment can start at 9am, what the point in free bus/tube if people who need it if they can't get to appointments.

NurseyWursey · 15/04/2014 18:52

Exactly.

WitchWay · 15/04/2014 18:54

I think everyone ought to pay something, even if subsidised for unemployed & elderly etc.

expatinscotland · 15/04/2014 18:56

Means test it and raise the age to 67. 60 is way too young.

expatinscotland · 15/04/2014 18:58

'How many of you that are complaining about bus passes for elderly are happy to accept child benefit, child tax credits, free school meals, housing benefit etc which is being paid for in part from the tax these well off pensioners are still paying?'

All means tested. And many are not eligible for them at all.

5ofus · 15/04/2014 19:00

Universal free bus passes - everyone travels free all the time everywhere. Paid for entirely by taxes.

Would be fab - cut down on traffic queues and pollution. And would create a demand for buses and drivers.

I'm starting to think I've leant to the left a little...