am i being unreasonable to beleive that real love can result from an affair.

[chatternatter9]

Affairs are wrong, I know, they cause hurt and distress to All concerned. However I am human and I had an affair , I am now with the person I had the affair with... it was not a quick decision, or a decision at all, fate brought us together again many years after the affair... I trust this man with all my heart although everything about us started as a lie, has anyone else had a similar experience and can real love and trust really exist between two people who had such a sticky start?

[fedupbutfine]

That's nice, I hope they are happy

yeah, it's lovely, isn't it? Not a shit given about the people who are betrayed, nor any consideration given to the impact it may have had on their lives in the long term...just so long as an affair lasts for months, weeks, years, it was somehow justified and great and wonderful. Bullshit. I wouldn't wish what I had to deal with on anyone - including those head in the cloud isn't love great idiots who's selfishness and self-absorption allow them to ignore the very real impact of their behaviour on very real people.

[SelectAUserName]

YANBU. My DH was married when we first met and fell in love. We've been together for over 20 years, married for 13. So far as I know he has never cheated since. He has children, they were old enough to understand enough; he still has an excellent relationship with them and I get on well with them.

It wouldn't have been the perfect choice of ways to start our relationship but we're human and flawed. Life isn't always black and white.

[Deftones]

My father married the OW, he seems happy but he sacrificed his family for his happiness, whether it's love or not, I'm not sure, trust must be a bit of a bugger too

[Bowlersarm]

Holly I'm with your uncle. I don't think he should have stayed in his loveless marriage. Regardless of the effect of that for his ex wife and children. You have one life. To a certain extent you have to live it for yourself.

[noddyholder]

I have a close friend who has done this. I stupidly allowed her to use my MN several years ago to ask questions and she got absolutely trashed as did I when people realised it was me after i cahnged name back (think they thought it was me really it wasn't!) This thread shows a different take

[HollyBrrr]

Bowlersarm - no he shouldn't have stayed with the woman he no longer loved (it wasn't loveless - she adored him, worshipped the ground he walked on, did everything for him) but looking back it was clear that he didn't love her long before the affair started. The right to do would be to leave his wife then pursue the new relationship. There was absolutely no need to overlap the two and to behave the way he did to his first wife was utterly cruel considering she'd given him everything (moved countries to be with him etc etc). This is why his children, who are lovely people in pretty much every way, are incredibly cold towards their father and very protective of their mother. They are and were mature enough to have behaved differently if their father had done the right thing.

(Didn't intend to drip feed there but I wanted to defend the first marriage after you replied)

[MrsKoala]

I was married when I met dh. It has never occurred to him that I may have an affair. He looked shocked and outraged when I suggested he may be more wary of it as I 'had form'. He (and I) feels it was very specific circumstances which are very unlikely to be repeated.

My dad was also married when he met my mum and everyone said 'ooooh once a cheater always a cheater' but they celebrated their 42nd wedding anniversary last week.

[Bodicea]

Of course a man can love the woman he had an affair with just like he probably loved his wife when they were first married. But in my experience men just go for someone younger. But there will always be someone newer, younger, shinie, with less dosmestic responsibility 5/10 years down the line to repeat the process with. So enjoy it whilst it lasts

[fedupbutfine]

they celebrated their 42nd wedding anniversary last week

which categorically means he has never cheated? Or just not got caught? Or just not cheated with anyone he considered worth leaving for?

[MrsKoala]

No, it means they are still together and love each other. The question was about true love. I doubt he has cheated. As with me, there was a very specific set of circumstances with my dad having an affair which does not fit the stereotype which everyone likes to peddle on mn.

[Viviennemary]

People can justify anything if they try hard enough.

[fedupbutfine]

ah...so people's lives, real lives, which are blown into millions of pieces by lies and deceit are just 'stereotypes' that are 'peddled'. Nice.

[LEMmingaround]

You now what they say about when a cheater leaves his wife for the mistress - it creats a vacancy. I daresay they think when they marry (unless they are utter cunts, and some of them are) that they are with the love of their life and want to grow old together, but then real life gets in the way and its not so romantic anymore - then fate intervenes and the real love of their life comes along.....oh, its all quite vomit making really isn't it

[MrsKoala]

Yes, I think there are stereotypical affairs (h leaving wife and dc for a younger women etc) and it is assumed all affairs fit into this category. What I'm saying is that my affair did not adhere to this and neither did my dads. I'm not saying those stereotypes don't exist, but I dislike the black and white view of tarring everyone with the same brush.

[NoArmaniNoPunani]

My dad is still with his girlfriend 14 years after my mum kicked him out for his affairs. He lies to her and cheats all the time though

[fedupbutfine]

I'm not saying those stereotypes don't exist, but I dislike the black and white view of tarring everyone with the same brush.

you don't think the stereotype is the fact that everyone having an affair believes that it's different for them? you know, this is really true love so somehow that makes it all OK? which is what we're discussing, isn't it? The fact that it's possible for 'true love' to result from an affair?

[MrsKoala]

I don't think true love justifies it at all actually and I'm sorry if I gave that impression. I do think other things can justify it however, and then that 'true love' can emerge from that.

[HollyBrrr]

I have to say I'm quite interested in the different reactions on here: those who've found their partners via affairs are pretty much ignoring or dismissing any emotional fallout experienced by those hurt through their actions. For me it backs up my opinion that those who cheat are perhaps more selfish and self-absorbed (even if they are nice and kind in other areas of their lives) and sheds a certain amount of light on the thread in relationships at the moment about OWs feeling any remorse.

(But that's a by the by, I understand that this thread is about finding 'true love' via an affair, and from what I've seen it is possible, although it's not a way I could envision finding long lasting and trusting love).

[MrsKoala]

I see what you are saying Holly, and i know cheating shits where the repercussions were totally secondary to their selfish happiness. but i also know the 'fallout' for some is not as bad as people are imagining on here. All situations are not the same. Length of relationship, children etc effect how destructive the affair is. Not all are leaving wreckage in their wake.

[fedupbutfine]

how destructive the affair is

I do hope you never get to find out just how destructive an affair can be. I will never be the same again. It has changed me in ways I just wouldn't have thought possible. My marriage wasn't particularly long or particularly happy but that didn't stop the impact having terrible reprecussions that have gone on for years now. My ex - and the 'ow' are oblivious as to just what they have done. They're happy. All is well.

[Housemum]

Very much depends on the reasons/the personalities. I would never have condoned an affair, and never would have thought I'd be the one doing it BUT I am also a coward. I was with exDH even though I knew we were wrong together, because I knew that if I left he held all the trump cards (earned more than me, his mum didn't work and was already looking after our DD part time while I worked). I then met someone who, like me, had married young and found that his wife wanted very different things in life from him. She was unhappy that he didn't want to "better himself" (she was higher earning/better educated) and had now decided that children were not something she wanted (he had assumed they would have a family). we ended up having an affair and are still together 16 years later. I am ashamed of how we got together, but we are absolutely right together and still very much in love. (The exes both moved on - his very swiftly moved in with someone she had known for some time, the new partner made a cryptic comment to me once about how they'd been together longer than we'd know; mine took a couple of relationships but is happy with new wife who is so absolutely unlike me visually, attitude, hobbies - everything)

[MrsKoala]

I do understand fedup, I was betrayed too. It isn't only an affair that can break your heart. I will never be the same again. A part of me has died and I have deep sadness in my soul. My exH is very happy btw, living with my best friend. My dads ex wife thanked my mum repeatedly for 'stealing' my dad. Dad and his ex are still mates and when he had a heart attack she was at the hospital before my mum.

[MaryWestmacott]

Agree Holly, although to play devils advocat, I know when I dumped my exP (no overlap with an new relationship), I hurt him badly. He took several years to get over that apparently and it effected his future relationships. And I know a man who left his wife without having an affair, but still the fall out was termendous, and 10 years on his new W is assumed to have been the OW as people can't understand the bitterness otherwise.

Basically, in many cases, it's not always the way you end a relationship that causes the emotional fallout and upset and hurt, but the fact that you ended it at all. Once a couple has been together for a long time and have DCs, ending that marriage will be messy and painful and will hurt everyone. The OW/M makes that a focus, but often if hte H/W just walked out without someone else (as everyone on here thinks should happen), it wouldn't suddenly mean that this would be a painfree and tidy relationship end. Yes, affairs can involve messing with the head of the person you are cheating on (which is unfair), but not always.

The reason I'd always advise someone to end their current relationship before starting a new one wouldn't be for the benefit of the previous partner, or even for the benefit of any DCs, but for the new relationship.

[ParkingFred]

A very good friend of ours had an affair. He behaved very badly and devastated his wife, also our great friend.

He is now married to the OW and they are very, very happy.

She is perhaps, the woman he should have been with all along. He is undoubtedly blissfully happy now.

His ex wife has moved on and remarried. I don't think she is particularly happy though and the break up changed her forever.

[Ponkypink]

YABVU to believe in 'true love' and 'fate' if you are over 12. You decide who you have relationships with, and so does the other person, and if either of you is weak or selfish enough that you would lie to the person who should be able to trust you (which is anyone you have a relationship with, not just the person you happen to be in disney style twu wuv with), then you are probably crap enough to deserve each other.

You don't learn by making mistakes, you learn by doing things right before or after making mistakes. Cheating/lying is blatantly a mistake, because it hurts people.