To think "politically correct" is one of the most over-used and misused terms around?

[Nennypops]

I keep seeing the term 'politically correct' being used all over the place as a catch-all terms of abuse by people who clearly have no idea what the term means but want to convey that whatever it is that they disapprove is in some way unnecessary, wet, lentil-knitting, left-wing, or even positively harmful.

For the sake of convenience, I'll adopt the definition of political correctness given in Wikipedia - "a term that refers to language, ideas, or policies that address perceived or actual discrimination against or alienation of politically, socially or economically disadvantaged groups. The term usually implies that these social considerations are excessive or of a purely "political" nature. These groups most prominently include those defined by gender, race, religion, ethnicity, sexual orientation and disability."

I accept that it can be valid to criticise over-sensitive concerns about discrimination, but I've seen the term used in defence when someone is called out for blatant racism/sexism/homophobia etc and richly deserves it. It usually signals to me, frankly, that the person in question is even more of an a*hole than their original conduct suggested - they are trying to suggest that they are in some way justified and that complaining is ludicrously over-sensitive.

If I see the term incorrectly used in support of what otherwise might be a valid argument, it instantly annoys me and changes the way I view the person using the term. It tends to be used in relation to things which seem to me to be self-evidently beneficial - e.g. breastfeeding, the right to a fair trial, the right of children not to be left with abusive parents, etc. It is also quite often used for things that have no conceivable element of political correctness at all; I once saw it used in relation to the suggestion that it would be an idea to take an umbrella out when it's raining.

Seems to me that it's time to make the term completely redundant. If you find yourself about to use the term "politically correct" just stop, and find some other way of expressing your views.

'describing her own views on the death penalty and climate change as 'not politically correct'.'

I linked to a published book called 'The Politically Incorrect Guide to Global Warming and Environmentalism'

I linked to quotes from environmentalists and professors who said that global warming sceptics should be treated as traitors and be thrown in jail.

I linked to an article that explained the leader of the Green party's statement that “every senior adviser who refuses to accept the scientific consensus on climate change shouldn’t be in their posts”.

This is political correctness. It is about the consequences of not following the political orthodoxy.

I think it is similar over the death penalty but I haven't got time to google to back it up. We know the EU is against the death penalty and that no country can join the EU if it has a death penalty. The death penalty is against the political orthodoxy but it has never been put to the people in a referendum.

"political correctness gorn mad."
An example, please?

That was a joke.

'You seem to be mixing political correctness with liberal views on the death penalty and crime.'

No, political correctness is about being 'correct' in following the political orthodoxy and not deviating from the party line as Doris Lessing explained in her quote.

' death penalty was "not politically correct". I said that there was nothing politically incorrect in your statement- but you chose not to respond. Could you respond now, please?'

As I said above I believe that anti-death penalty is the political orthodoxy. It is the EU orthodoxy and it is a human rights agenda orthodoxy. No country would be allowed to join the EU if it had a death penalty. It would fail on the human rights orthodoxy. There can be no debate on that, no compromise on that, no referendum on that, no people's voice on that.

I didn't know that UKIP backed the death penalty. As it stands they will not get into power, so there is no real challenge to the political orthodoxy, but if it ever changed and it looked like UKIP would run the country, then we would see how politically incorrect that notion is.

'What about your views on gay marriage, immigration, benefits, asylum seekers, foreign aid?'

The only one of those on which I take a view is on foreign aid. I would scrap most of it as I believe much of it goes into teh pockets of people who don't need it and it could be better spent here in hospitals and for the homeless.

well I know no PC people then as I know one who doesn't deviate from the 'party line' (or indeed follows one verbatum) and most of my liberal lefty mates have differing views and opinions

I think the 'right' imagines PC to be far more pervasive and widespread than it is in reality - rather like it's views on immigration and multiculturalism - big on hyperbole - less so on facts

"As I said above I believe that anti-death penalty is the political orthodoxy."

It may well be, I don't know. But the fact remains that there was nothing politically incorrect about your stated opinion on the subject, or the way you stated it. It is a view held by many of all political colours.

'That's the EU laws. '

The EU elite set the political orthodoxy.UKIP are "fruitcakes" compared to the orthodoxy. I believe that political correctness is about being "correct2 in following the orthodoxy and not challenging it.

"The Green party are likely to believe in climate change and are likely to say such things. People who believe passionately about such things are likely to say things like "sceptics should be thrown in jail".

they are not politically correct. They are effectively saying that if you don't agree with them then you are politically incorrect. That is how political correctness works. It creates an "in club" (them) and and "out club" (heretics and others).

It is not acceptable to call for other people to be sent to jail or be treated as traitors for disagreeing with a party line (a politically correct line).

I would not do it. They can believe what they like but they should not try to intimidate others from disagreeing with them.

'So if I joined UKIP and then said - actually immigration is a good thing, would they say that's fine or kick me out for not towing the party line?'

That is a good point. You would probably be kicked out for not toeing the party line because they are a politically incorrect party who don't agree with political correctness.

But they don't define political correctness, we are really talking about the political correctness in society defined by the powerful,the EU elite and the media, not teh "fruitcakes" in UKIP.

'But the fact remains that there was nothing politically incorrect about your stated opinion on the subject'

I felt there was, I was even a bit scared to admit it in case I was howled down. But no one has howled me down. So I was wrong about the reaction I would get on that.

'Isn't that how politics works? Look at George Bush and the war on terror. You''re with us or against us.'

Excellent point. You are exactly right. But it this type of pressure that as a free people we must resist. We must not be intimidated to speak up and express opposing views because we are under threat of being ostracised or treated as an enemy in the them and us paradigm.

There is no them and us in our nation. There is just us and we all have differing views and they should be respected and no one should be fearful to dissent from global warming or anything else under threats of going to jail or being treated as traitors for doing so.

'Did you really think that expressing your view on the death penalty would get you howled down?'

I really did. I was a bit scared. That is how the fear of opprobrium works, that is how holding "incorrect" thoughts deter people from saying what they believe.

"'But the fact remains that there was nothing politically incorrect about your stated opinion on the subject'

I felt there was,"

You were wrong. Because you don't understand what "political correctness" means. Surely you can now see that?

I have no politically incorrect thoughts about transgendered people.

I think they have a tough time in society and are very brave people and true to themselves.

it would have been politically incorrect if you had mentioned Bongo Bongo land - hth

'You were wrong. Because you don't understand what "political correctness" means. Surely you can now see that?'

I was only wrong in the reaction that my views received. But I felt that I held an "incorrect" view and that made me fearful of expressing it. That is how I felt. Now that I have done it, maybe I will do it again. But that is how people feel when they are scared to express their views in case of opprobrium. That is what people mean by "political correctness". And that is why as Lord Ashcroft said that people are moving to UKIP from the Tories - in order to be liberated from the fear of not being politically correct. It is a larger factor than Europe in their decision.

That is why political correctness will fail eventually - because people want to be free to say what they think without opprobrium.

'it would have been politically incorrect if you had mentioned Bongo Bongo land - hth'

That's just offensive. It has nothing to do with political opinions.

'Now if someone said - they're just men with their willies cut off and they don't deserve NHS funding for their lifestyle choice - would you have an issue with that or would it be ok to say such a thing?'

I would disagree with that. It is a nasty and hurtful thing to say.