To be bloody annoyed at family for facilitating this

[Hoppinggreen]

Disclaimer - not a benefits bash thread, only referring to THIS particular case!!
A family member is 20 and has never worked. She has very mild SN but is mainly very lazy and spoilt. She has a baby at 16 and stayed at her mums, who does everything for this child while the mum buys crap with her child benefit. When she was told that after September when her child starts school she would have to go onto JSA and start looking for work she has now deliberately got pg - not speculating here she freely admits it.
Her mum has decided she doesn't want her and 2 children living there so has told her she has to move out. Another family member has bought a small house for her to rent. Rent will be paid by housing benefit. Apparently family member gets somewhere to live for free and other family member will end up owning a house where her mortgage is covered by benefits!!
I appreciate this doesn't really affect me but I am avoiding these people now as when asked what I think I will have to tell them and here will be falling out ( which may be a good thing??)

From your op I get:

Young voulnerable woman with mild SN, who is going to have two young children, moving into a private rented property that will have as long a lease as she needs, and help from her family to make best of a bad situation.

Maybe she is making light of her new pregnancy, maybe she is embarrassed about getting pregnant and due to her SN she thinks she is being clever.

Well my OP is obviously giving totally the wrong impression then.
As I said earlier there is a lot more to it but I can't give any more details.
Anyway, I suppose people can only judge my post on the info I have given

Wheres the Daddy? gggrrrrrrrrr!!!!!!!!!

The way the benefits system is going she's likely to find herself cut off completely before she's done raising those kids. Or have you missed the talk about coming UK bank bail ins, hardening social attitudes towards welfare, increased targets for councils to take kids into care etc, etc.

You should pity, not envy her. Tbh I think her well meaning family are setting her up in the long term to suffer and fail miserably. I know you find their enabling behavior irritating - I find it dangerous.

Anyone who still assumes benefits are a safe long term lifestyle choice at this point in time is at best utterly deluded.

I don't get the point of your thread at all, other than moaning about someone who is a lot worse off than you getting something you don't think she should have. As for the family "facilitating" it, what other choice do they have? Are you advocating some kind of "tough love" where they leave her and her children to fend for themselves when they could easily help her out as they are doing?

Maybe you expected a lot of support for your viewpoint and are having a hard time accepting that people don't agree with you.

If your point is that she's having another child specifically to avoid working then I kind of get your gripe, but only for the sake of the unborn child, nothing else.

Scraping by on benefits is a miserable existence.

I just can't get angry about any type of benefit fraud.

I just feel pity for the people who have such low expectations they think it's something to aspire to.

Daddy pops in and out when he can be bothered. He works a bit but contributes nothing financially. To be fair he's not a bad person but just a bit useless and he is also getting used to the family handouts meaning he doesn't have to contribute much.
Doubt he will move in officially but he will stay when he wants.
I am currently trying to get her mum to set up a trust as there will be some money when she dies ( in mid 60's now) and it would be a disaster if her daughter got it all in one go - not speculating here its experience.

Who can be fucked being jealous of a 20 year old with 2 kids, no job, and a house she will never own.

Presumably nobody.

But I imagine a lot of people would have a problem with her relative exploiting the situation to get a house bought with public money.

That number would include me.

Lazy hound, nowhere have I said I am having a hard time accepting people have a different viewpoint.
It's a public forum, people have different opinions, especially since I can't give all the details on here.
It's more the system that annoys me and that one day this person WILL have to stand on her own feet and won't be able to.
I am also concerned about the children. Child she has now is looked after mostly by grandma who she currently lives with.
Also the fact that another family member can get her mortgage paid via HB on a buy to let house annoys me slightly.

You have to declare on your application form if the LL is related to you. A sibling is far too close for there to be any uncertainty about whether it counts as related so unless she intends to lie then HB will know.

I used to get twinges of this about DSS's mum - in her 40's, 3 bed house, never worked (really, not a single day and she is now in her 40's) has constant use of her mum's car, holidays paid for by family etc etc. And she has MH issues that could well be made worse by her family enabling her all the time.

BUT - living with OCD must be utterly shit. The 3 bed house is so full of hoarded stuff that she and her DC regularly have to move back in with her mum (and that is 4 of them in a 2 bed house). The only thing she has that is worthwhile in her life are the 2 DC's (her words, BTW, not mine) and one is just about to go off to Uni and DSS says is planning on never coming back and DSS has 3 weekends out of 4 with us and half the holidays and loves it (and was so determined to spend more time with us that he told the CAFCASS officer so) and that must be very hard to deal with.

I'd rather have my life, no question.

I think the key Mrs D is that the house is being purchased specifically for this reason. It's being presented as a win win situation. X gets her large 4 bed house all to herself, Y gets a house to live in paid for by the state and Z owns a property with the mortgage paid for by the state!
We are all supposed to applaud this situation.

Z wont have her house paid for by the state. The rules will tighten, the young mum will get older and eventually will have to work, or possibly meet someone and marry/move out/combine incomes. Z is being naive if she thinks she has 25 years of mortgage payments heading her way. That's if the HB even covers the mortgage amount each month. My rent is cheap for my town and even then the HB doesnt cover it all. Never has.

Fwiw im a LP of two dcs currently on benefits and i wouldnt wish it on anyone. It's grim. It's extremely stressful worrying about having enough for electric or food (no heat to worry about as cant afford that anyway). There really is nothing to be jealous of.

Well, I used to rent my house out to a single mum with a child. The only difference is that I didn't know her. Your family member has got to live somewhere. Better a landlord who has her best interests at heart and won't end her tenancy, thus creating stability for this vulnerable little family. Dontcha think?

I think X is the granny in the 4 bed house. mrsD

X is her mum, sorry if I'm not being clear.

I think that the reason they don't allow the rental from relatives is because everybody then could charge rent for a room to family members. I.e. if your child is 18 and out of work you charge him rent and get the rent from HB? But in this case your child would live in his room anyway.
This girl's case is different. She would rent somewhere anyway. The council would pay her rent anyway. Her sister would rent the house to someone anyway to pay the mortgage. So what difference does it make? Even if you see it from 'our taxes' bs point of view it is still the same. No extra taxes from you.
My guess is that her sister was buying a house to rent anyway.

No, she wasn't. How could you possibly guess that when I have repeatedly said that the house is being purchased specifically for this purpose?

Also, if her sister wasn't buying a house FOR THIS purpose she would be staying at her mums.
I'm not guessing or making this up - this is what those involved are telling me

Well then her sister is very generous because she'll be taking on a good amount of the mortgage and associated costs to provide her vulnerable sister with a permanent home.

HB will nowhere near pay for the house.

So what if she wasn't? Your family member still needs to live somewhere. Why do you begrudge the sister being the landlord and getting a profit instead of a stranger? And she will provide more stability because she is the sister. Why do you have an issue with that? Isn't that better for your family member? To have stability for herself and her children. You sound bitter. And jealous. Which looks ugly.

You said her mum told her she has to move out and doesnt want two grandchildren there. So she would be renting somewhere else.

I suspect that this " solution" won't actually work out as everyone hopes.
I guess the worst case scenario is everyone ends up back at her mums, so at least they will be safe.
Potential for huge family fallouts though