Riding a push-bike through red lights

[rachelmonday1]

AIBU for calling out to a woman and politely telling her that riding her push-bike through a red light is not only illegal but also very dangerous. She very impolitely told be where to go, but being a motorist who is always trying to second-guess cyclists actions I felt it only right to make my point. I also cycle, so am not a selfish motorist or anything, just someone that knows that a cyclist will get physically hurt far more than the motorist, but the motorist will still suffer with having been involved in an accident. Views......

KidLorneRoll I don't agree. As well as the increased risk of encountering cars from other directions (maybe jumping red lights) I would rather I dictated the acceleration of the car behind me whilst I get up to speed instead of giving them space to accelerate and overtake me at a greater speed differential.

Yes cyclist, shouldn't have done it, but it still baffles me why we have so many threads about cyclists compared to other forms of traffic. Cyclists doing something wrong seem to enrage people far more than drivers. If I was to get annoyed about a driver doing something illegal (speeding, on phone, pulling out dangerously) I'd spend my whole commute in a rage.

People often seem to think that cyclists are sticking up for one another and making excuses for bad cycling, but the majority of the time we're not. We just don't understand why people get so disproportionately annoyed! As it happens, if I'm out on my bike and there is a fellow cyclist doing something dangerous/illegal I will say something to them, because I don't want drivers having any excuse to behave dangerously towards me.

On the jumping the lights thing, it does depend on the junction layout and how well you know the light sequence. There are one or two places where I will 'anticipate' the lights turning but I have a very clear view of cars coming the other way. It means I can get to the cycle lane on the other side of the junction before cars start overtaking.

DS2 gets terribly embarrassed when I do this on the way to school.

Yesterday, I knocked on the car window and pointed out to a driver that she was sat in stationary traffic blocking a pelican crossing next to a school.
She did look a bit shamefaced, but nowhere as badly embarrassed as poor DS2.

whatsthatcoming exactly - that's what I was trying to get at (not as articulately as you).

I am also not clear to what extent shouting at people is minor vigilantism that should be left to the police, or whether it is all part of the Big Society. The danger with people appointing themselves traffic police is that they may not actually know the law eg they may think that cyclists should be cycling in the gutter, and hoot them when in the primary position (thinking they are helpfully teaching the cyclist road manners). Or they may object to someone driving in the bus lane when it is outside the hours of operation etc Jumping a red light is different though, I concede - clearly illegal in all circumstances.

OP do you call people who edge into the cycle box at lights? If not, why not? Youngsters watching might also follow suit when they grow up and drive....

Well! What a huge response, and so many questions!

In answer to what seems to be the most prominent question, no I don't make a habit of this. I'm not even totally sure why I even said anything this time and that's the reason that I actually started this thread...to see what others thought.

I was always brought up to respect the law (I know that's going to provoke some responses) and am fully aware that we all see very minor infringements every day, but on this occasion something inside me made me say something. Do I do similar things when I see people drop litter for example....no. Will I comment to other people in the future, I don't know.

I don't profess to be perfect myself either as some people may disagree with my lifestyle, I was simply trying to gauge opinion on whether people should at least try to improve behaviours generally and I'm pleased to see that the general view is that yes we should.

that's a very interesting comparison you make about litter - I would be far more likely (and indeed have done, when a woman in a parked car chucked something out on to the pavement in front of me and DD - I gave her an absolute earful - there was a litter bin not 10 yards from her!) to say something to someone dropping litter - it is a disgusting, filthy, lazy habit I may have used some or all of those words and makes our public spaces so much grimmer to be in. Whereas with a cyclist I wouldn't know whether or not he or she had made the right call in jumping the lights.

I do wonder how many of our traffic and road laws are made with cyclists in mind.

Well quite.

But the law is one thing. Attitudes are another. And a refusal to understand another road user's situation.

There is a red light I always ride through, carefully. To not do so means I am entering a very squeezed, dangerous rush of traffic, on a narrow-laned road that is just full of holes. The surface should be an embarassment to the council. So I go through the light to be able to claim the primary road position for this next stretch of road, which is a Health and Safety hazard.
Someone like the OP would/could be wishing to tut at me....with little or no understanding of the bigger picture.

As for 'always having to anticipate cyclists next move'.....is this a joke? What the hell do you think cyclist have to do ALL of the time with drivers, just to remain alive??

I don't get why you've posted this. You've done it. Clearly you feel you were in the right. So why do you want to know if you were being unreasonable? It's a moot point. You feel you were right. What are you looking for here?

I have been hit by a cyclist running a red light and just missed by 2.

YaNBU at all and I shout at cyclists who do it too now.

I strongly suspect then Fanjo that I would be happy to 'shout' back at you, and it would be something rather unpleasant.

East - you say A disproportionate number of pedestrian injuries/deaths are caused by cyclists.. I'm not even sure what that means. Can you explain and produce evidence please? Esp for the bit of 'deaths caused by cyclists'. Otherwise posters could be forgiven for thinking you are merely shit stirring.

Derail. Well that would be immensely rude.

Especially since I only shout "that's a red light".

Oh and also since I have right of way and you shouldn't be jumping the light.

HTH.

Derail..

But..I am not talking about cyclists who go carefully through a red light as you described.

But ones who just totally ignore it and sail on through at high speed. .and hit or almost hit me.

derailleur.

times article

I see pedestrians crossing when the lights are red all the time!

You know, they get up to the lights, check to see if there's any traffic, and then cross, even if the lights are red!

They are allowed to and they aren't going to injure someone doing it.

It's also v rude to shout anyway. You would also appear to be one of the many incompetent pedestrian for stepping out without looking first.
East, that article doesn't in any way provide evidence of 'disproportionality' does it? In fact it underlines that the carnage on pavements and roads are still provided by cars.

Sorry derailleur you are right, I shouldn't have used the word disproportionate. Apologies, shouldn't post 1st thing. Will report my posts.

Deraileur..your attitude stinks.

Looking didn't help as the guy appeared from behind traffic and hit me

Nothing like victim blaming though.

It's also interesting (to me anyway as I have to negotiate it every day) that the lights I referred to in my example as to why I go through on 'red' is that there is also a 'bike box' there, the Advanced Stop Line, at those lights. This is usually occupied by cars. Probably driven by someone who likes to complain about cyclists ignoring the rules of the road?

I don't think my attitude stinks at all Fanjo. I have to account for driver fuckwittery all the time I am on the road to survive. Peds stepping off pavements without looking, at lights or anywhere else, is an additional concern.

Well I dont think anyone can say that the pedestrian is in the wrong if they step out having seen a green light and a cyclist ploughs through the red light they have and hits them.

But that seems to be what you are saying.

Which seems rather arrogant and entitled.

I am not defending red light jumpers per se. I always stop on red (with that one defensible exception) and others ride through. I don't blame them for doing so at all though.

I usually only lurk on these threads, and one of the clear messages is that car drivers who don't ride have v little idea of what it's like to ride in heavy traffic especially, and really don't want to understand. OTOH, the majority of adult biking commuters (incl me) are also car owners/drivers, and see it from both sides.

eg in traffic I ride with fingers over the brake levers in prep. for some driver fuckwittery. Do car drivers feel the need to hover a foot over the brake pedal? Well, no.