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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to be angry about attendance charge from school

562 replies

HidingInTheBathroom · 07/02/2014 15:36

I am very upset at the minute. Received my fine today for taking my children out of school four days before they break up for Christmas.

Me and my husband have received a £60 fine for each child for each parent.

We are being charged more for being a couple. Which I think is wrong. The last week of school they only watch films and went to a pantomime. Oh and had a school disco. The holiday was far more educational than watching films and family time is hard to come by with work.

When I have requested a meeting with the head teacher I have just got a mouthful of abusive from the receptionist.

OP posts:
Argawarga · 07/02/2014 19:37

Ha! Hoist with his own petard. :o

Misspixietrix · 07/02/2014 19:48

Very sensible posts chocolate.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 07/02/2014 19:50

Can I say a big thank you for your excellent posts, Wombat - as you correctly identify, personal responsibility is at the very core of this

Of course the "educational holiday" has been dragged in, and yes, there may be some who genuinely focus on this aspect of the break. Trouble is there are FAR more for whom it's a lame attempt to justify what they want - including those who demand work to take away but leave it in the suitcase and scrawl a few words when they get home for appearance's sake. The next excuse then follows: "It's not faaaiirrrrrr, they needed a complete break and work hard enough in school" - and this on what was probably just a beach holiday

Like I said, it may not be perfect but it's the law - protest about it by all means but don't teach children that they can ignore what doesn't happen to suit them

2kidslotsofmess · 07/02/2014 19:56

My wife left the laptop open on this page so these are the views of her husband.

Point 1 ... the fine would often be less than the potential saving from taking the holiday during the school holiday

Point 2 ... do the crime, pay the price.. it's worth it

Point 3 ... they can expect a letter from me with a request for £60 per child to cover emergency child care when teachers strike next month... children should be in school being taught you know!!

ClockWatchingLady · 07/02/2014 19:58

OP, I don't know about the "per parent" bit, but I am totally with you on the basic principles - the ridiculous level of control the powers that be are increasingly exerting.

The idea that parents can't make decisions about their children's wellbeing is what I find outrageous. This country's emphasis on academic learning, early on, is narrow-minded and doesn't work. Sending grey-looking little children in to sit and do what they're told for hours a day without giving parents - the people who are most likely to understand what is best for their children - any choice is scandalous. I am shocked whenever I see anyone (on here or anywhere else) endorse it. "Nanny state" doesn't even come close.

jacks365 · 07/02/2014 20:04

Parents have a choice about taking holidays in term times and that is to find a way of educating the children in a setting that does have set terms that the state system has. If you are not prepared to accept the conditions then don't sign up for them the choice is yours.

IneedAsockamnesty · 07/02/2014 20:05

I stand corrected sock. That is useful to know! Maybe I'll record conversations I have with pupils' parents, then they can't claim I haven't told them something or that I was impolite at a later date

There are differences if you are the agent of a business,I'm not sure if a school is a business or not or if they would be considered as agents for the LA which is certainly a business. So you could be scuppered with that plan

clam · 07/02/2014 20:05

The teachers' strike is totally irrelevant to this issue, as the fines are nothing to do with them, but administered by the LA under direction by the Government.
And anyway, schools are responsible for your childcare issues. Sorry.

Frogbyanothername · 07/02/2014 20:05

The law requires all parents to ensure that their DCs are educated within certain parameters.

The state provides a free-at-point-of-delivery education service, which meets those parameters, for those parents who wish to take advantage of that. The service, like all services, comes with terms and conditions - which parents sign up to when they enrol their DC via the local authority application process.

State education is not the only option. If a parent doesn't want to abide by the terms of the provision, there are alternatives. It's not a 'pick and mix'. Parents can't pick the bits of the state education service they wish to benefit from and opt out of the bits they don't like.

TheGruffalo2 · 07/02/2014 20:09

Sorry Sock are you saying agents of a business can't record, but private individuals can? Still think the OP is on shaky ground recording a phonecall made from a business (even if she was making a personal call) and not disclosing she was recording it. In my case then maybe I'll stick to only speaking to a number of parents face-to-face then, with a witness.

Argawarga · 07/02/2014 20:10

I don't think many parented "signed up" to the system of fines. The goalposts have been moved.

Argawarga · 07/02/2014 20:11

Parented?? Damn you, fat fingered autocorrecty thing.

JugglingFromHereToThere · 07/02/2014 20:11

If I signed up to it when I enrolled my children then how come the government/LEA/school can change the rules after that point without consulting me/parents Frog?

Fairenuff · 07/02/2014 20:13

the school would have to inform the authority? And if the authority were not informed, no fine would be demanded?

School registers are computerised and all information can be accessed directly by the LEA. The computer records absences and all sorts of statistics.

The head does not need to pass anything on. Codes are entered for each absence, illness, authorised absence, unauthorised, educated off site, medical appointments, etc.

The idea that parents can't make decisions about their children's wellbeing is what I find outrageous. This country's emphasis on academic learning, early on, is narrow-minded and doesn't work. Sending grey-looking little children in to sit and do what they're told for hours a day without giving parents - the people who are most likely to understand what is best for their children - any choice is scandalous.

Parents do have choice.

School is optional. Since you feel so strongly about it, I expect you are home educating your children Clock?

TheGruffalo2 · 07/02/2014 20:14

My last post sounds awful ... sorry everyone. For fear of outing myself let's just say there are some amazingly "entitled" parents at present - one of whom recently shouted at me that I was a public servant so should do as she said... It is a relief to come on MN to top up my belief in parents and remind myself it is not universal to be treated this way.

Argawarga · 07/02/2014 20:16

Clock may not be in a position to home educate. This does not mean she has no right to her views, particularly as the rules have been changed after the sign up.

JugglingFromHereToThere · 07/02/2014 20:17

Actually I wonder if there will be significantly more parents choosing to home ed, and that this will be one of the factors in what I hope will be an imminent U turn on this?
I'm sure there must be many who rankle at this increasing take over of their children by the state.
Many will feel like this but not have the option of home ed'ing, but some will have the opportunity and take it.

Misspixietrix · 07/02/2014 20:17

Teachers don't pop off to fecking Tenerife when they strike!! Hmm

Frogbyanothername · 07/02/2014 20:18

My understanding is that it is the interpretation of legislation that has changed - not the law itself.

Even if it had changed - you ARE consulted before any legislation is passed, through your MP - it's the joy of a democracy!

Are you saying you wouldn't have signed up for state provided education if you had known about the current interpretation of the rules? You do have the option of withdrawing your DC; there are no penalty clauses.

Fairenuff · 07/02/2014 20:19

The rules that Clock is talking about haven't changed. He'she is not talking about term time holidays, just the general aspect of state education:

This country's emphasis on academic learning, early on, is narrow-minded and doesn't work. Sending grey-looking little children in to sit and do what they're told for hours a day without giving parents - the people who are most likely to understand what is best for their children - any choice is scandalous.

JugglingFromHereToThere · 07/02/2014 20:19

We seem to have very similar views Arga Smile
A couple of X posts now I think ?!

jacks365 · 07/02/2014 20:20

You have the option to remove your child and arrange any other way to educate them when ever you wish. These fines were well documented before they were introduced. Continuing in state education is acceptance of those terms.

TheGruffalo2 · 07/02/2014 20:22

Rules have changed since I signed my contract as well - one of the reasons for the teachers strike!

jacks365 · 07/02/2014 20:23

Juggling the government would save money for every parent who chooses to home educate so why on earth would an increase cause a u turn.

clam · 07/02/2014 20:24

Why do so many people still think that the rules about term-time holidays have changed? They haven't. This perceived entitlement to up to 10 days' absence is wrong. A Head Teacher was able in exceptional circumstances to grant absence. A week in Tenerife does not count as exceptional - it was for things like funerals, family emergencies and so forth.
The fines are new, granted, but like it or not, they've been well-publicised and the OP needs to suck it up before they're doubled.