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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To be shocked by this?

63 replies

AwfulMaureen · 27/01/2014 22:16

Queensland have made it illegal to fraternize with bikers or Bikies as they're known in Australia.

They have...really. Now I know that Aussie bikers have a large criminal population among their numbers...gangs, guns etc...but really! A State that tells it's population "If you fraternize with Bikies you will be arrested."

That's WTF!!

What if a child or teen had a Dad or a Mum who was in a bikers gang? What about those who aren't criminal? As far as I cans see, if the biker has his or her "Colours" on then you can't talk to them or mix with them at all and they are going to have separate prisons for them too!

Shock and double Shock Is it me..AIBU or can you just NOT tell people this type of shit is law?

OP posts:
Electriclaundryland · 27/01/2014 22:19

Agreed, talking to criminal 'types' does not make you a criminal. Totally odd.

gordyslovesheep · 27/01/2014 22:20

I must be missing something - I'm tired, but I read it 3 times and didn't see any bans like that - just wearing colours, owning tattoo parlors and destroying bike of convicted criminal bikers Confused

Original poster
AwfulMaureen · 27/01/2014 22:24

gordy I will find a link but there's already been arrests for it...you can't associate with bikers.

OP posts:
LEMmingaround · 27/01/2014 22:26

So is it illegal to BE a biker then?? I used to go to bike shows organised by hells angels (they do a lot for charity ya know)

Original poster
AwfulMaureen · 27/01/2014 22:27

here you are *Gordy.

And here is a story about some men arrested when they were out for ice cream and not even in "colours" or with their bikes.

OP posts:
Electriclaundryland · 27/01/2014 22:28

I've just managed to get your link. Sorry I couldn't before previous post. It doesn't sound so bad. I don't know why they need separate prisons though. Do they further corrupt ordinary criminals?

gordyslovesheep · 27/01/2014 22:28

that's just silly! but not suprising

Original poster
AwfulMaureen · 27/01/2014 22:30

LEM Well in Queensland they're going that way! They say they want to "Break" bikers.

OP posts:
Original poster
AwfulMaureen · 27/01/2014 22:30

\Electric what doesn't "sound so bad"?? That they're telling people who to mix with!?

A State can't do that! That's a step away from being a dictatorship!

OP posts:
LadyBeagleEyes · 27/01/2014 22:35

Sounds like they want to break gang culture which seems, by reading the article, to be quite serious in the biker community.
Clearly a specific Australian problem with shootings and drugs and all that gang culture entails.
I've never heard of this in the British or European biking community.

Original poster
AwfulMaureen · 27/01/2014 22:41

LadyBeagle regardless of the Australian bikers' criminal past and present, if a government starts telling people who to mix with, then that is a VERY dangerous path to take.

They could effectively decide to do the same to anyone who has a conviction. The country as a whole has no real protection for the people in terms of human rights. They're not under any of the same legislation as Europe is regarding human rights and freedom of speech...they can do what they like really and that's not on.

Critically, Australia has not implemented the core human rights principles, set out in the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights 1966, including freedom of speech and freedom from arbitrary detention. Other benchmark international obligations, such as the Convention on the Rights of the Child, are also not directly part of Australian law

I took the above quote from this article

OP posts:
idlevice · 27/01/2014 23:02

I found the biker gang culture pretty scary when we lived in Sydney up until 18mths ago. We were in the most old school conservative traditional white ghetto suburb but the neighbouring suburb across the river had fatal street shootings due to biker gang violence so I was concerned it would spread to where we were. It seemed to be on an escalation so some sort of crackdown would be welcome, if it worked.

We found bikers would also take over areas along the main highways at weekends so if you went out to a normally quiet beachside town outside the city it could be full of bikers which didn't feel conducive for a family day out. They were also associated with white-supremacist leanings. You could see swastika designs on display in the tattoo parlour windows.

flyingspaghettimonster · 28/01/2014 06:26

Wouldn't it be easier to make motorbikes illegal instead?

toomanyeggs · 28/01/2014 07:34

flyingspaghettimonster Hmm not really workable is it?

OP, are you aware of the scale of the bickie problem in Australia?

Original poster
AwfulMaureen · 28/01/2014 09:15

idlevice that does sound awful but nonetheless we live...or SHOULD live in a free society where people can have freedom of speech and of movement.

This is a step too close to dictatorship. Because you in Sydney would not be affected by this law, you don't see it as a problem...but imagine if the law were "Do not associate with any named criminal" you'd find that you were suddenly in a different position.

If they can say that people aren't allowed to associate with bikers then they could say that about people who protest against government policy....or against Aboriginal abuse...ALL kinds of ramifications. It's very, very wrong.

OP posts:
Original poster
AwfulMaureen · 28/01/2014 09:19

Legs Yes I am....I have lived there and my husband is Australian.

My children are therefore half Australian. We are thinking about moving there in a year or so...this has put me right off!

How can they justify this? They can't. And please read the article I linked to above which explains how Australia has very little in the way of protection for the people in terms of freedom of speech and human rights. It's very enlightening. I am very upset by this...because it's personal due to my family...and my plans for the future. I know some people would think it rather full-on to reconsider my plans for emigration but do I really want my children growing up in a country where they have no freedom to speak with or meet with certain members of the population!

Look at it this way...I am a writer. I sometimes conduct research by meeting with certain groups or subcultures in order to ascertain facts. If I wanted to write a play or a film about bikers in Oz...I could not meet with them to interview them...their entire voice has been taken away.

OP posts:
NicknameIncomplete · 28/01/2014 09:24

Bet they wont tell you this on BBCs wanted down under.

Grennie · 28/01/2014 09:28

This is about breaking up criminal gangs. If you read about them, they are some of the most violent and ruthless gangs around. I am sure if you lived where they are operating, you would be wanting the police to do everything they could to break them up.

Presenting this as about bikers is wrong. More accurate to say that the Queensland Government is passing laws to break up criminal gangs.

Grennie · 28/01/2014 09:29

If you want to be upset about Australia, look at the way aboriginal communities are treated. There is a lot of racism in Australia

Original poster
AwfulMaureen · 28/01/2014 09:30

No Nickname they won't. The coverage has been shocking. But that's because the bikers are a real minority...when you look at pics of their protests, there are pitifully few of them...and it's only in Queensland.

It reminds me of the time Queensland removed the benefits money from anyone who was Aboriginal...and gave them vouchers instead...to stop them buying alcohol

If you were Aboriginal and on benefits then that was it...you got NO cash. There were women who could not buy their child's school photos...or a magazine. The few shops they had which they could get to, hiked their prices up so they were getting ripped off.

I mean GOD. Can you imagine them trying that on here in the UK! Picking out a certain race of people and saying "You can't be trusted with cash...so you get meal vouchers"

No way would that EVER happen. And whether you think it's wrong that people do waste their money on drink or not, that is not the point. The point is that the government do nothing to break the vicious cycle that these people are caught in.

Entire generations of people are traumatized thanks to the stolen generation...the knock on effects carry on and on and on down the years.

OP posts:
Original poster
AwfulMaureen · 28/01/2014 09:32

Grennie read my post above. I know all about Aboriginal problems.

As for this being about criminal gangs...yes it is...but ANY gang should not be shoved off into a corner and told "We're not talking to you and neither is anyone else."

What about the children of some of the members! Innocent kids...teens...who cannot speak to their own Fathers!

OP posts:
Avalon · 28/01/2014 09:32

Couldn't read the link properly about the icecream bikers. But had to smile at 'the five Victorian men'.

Grennie · 28/01/2014 09:37

I don't have a problem with how they are dealing with these criminal gangs. But then I have read about their crimes and how they murder, rape and terrify vulnerable people in their vicinities. Most authorities in Australia underestimate the impact and extent of their criminal activities.

You realise the UK gives vouchers to asylum seekers? A bloody disgrace.

Original poster
AwfulMaureen · 28/01/2014 09:39

Grennie I didn't really know that no Sad I've seen signs up in a certain London cafe which says "We accept Meal Vouchers" or something and wondered about that.

OP posts:
Grennie · 28/01/2014 09:45

Also preventing criminal gang members congregating in public places, seems to make sense. Let's be clear, those 5 men arrested included a pretty senior member in an organised criminal gang.

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