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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to want to give my friend a shake?

12 replies

Brittapie · 08/01/2014 17:40

I have a newish friend, a really lovely woman with a great sense of humour and genuine kindness, who is pretty and nice and generally great.

HOWEVER. Her low self esteem is really making life hard for her, and is losing her friends as well as romantic interests.

She told me she hasn't had a relationship of more than a few weeks in over a decade, and this upsets her - she has one teenage son (who she had when she was a teenager herself) but really really wants someone nice to settle down with and maybe even have another baby with.

I've seen her "in action", as it were, with two men recently who she wanted to have a relationship with.

One of them is a very close friend of mine, so I heard both sides, so I'm pretty confident I have it right. She told him (and me at first) that she just wanted no strings fun, even calling him at 3am one night, getting him round for sex. Then, after two times together, still telling him she wanted no strings, she started telling me that she thought they were an item and that she thought they were really developing something. I kept telling her she needed to speak to him instead of assuming, but she said that "all men" are scared of relationships so it was better to lie.

Second man she actually was seeing for two weeks, but she was talking about a long term future almost straight away when he is actually so young and again was looking for a fling (and made it obvious, and she had told him that was what she was looking for). She is only just getting over that now, going out to places he might be without making a huge fuss etc, two months later.

She has one night stands too, really unwise ones (I have no problem with one night stands in themselves) then spends weeks beating herself up about it. It's almost like she self sabotages - she seems to go for the worst possible option for who to sleep with.

On nights out she actually scares some of my male friends by how forward she is - stroking them and following them about etc. I've watched and they aren't giving her signals that they are enjoying it apart from the odd nervous joke.

I am pretty sure that, if a bad man wanted, he could make her go past all her own limits just to please him, she is so desperate.

She says there is no point being herself near men, because no man actually wants to settle down, or at least not one that also enjoys sex. I've tried telling her to just find someone she likes and see how it goes, but she seems to think kind of like a female "nice guy", except in reverse - ie if I give them sex then they will give me a relationship.

If I ever moan about my boyfriend, she tells me I should be grateful that I have one and just deal with anything I am moaning about.

She acts a bit the same way with friends too. I'm odd myself so I don't mind, but a few people have mentioned that she goes from 0 - intense in friendships, and starts trying to insert herself in everything, then gets really upset at any perceived rejection, which she will of course get because she is doing things like trying to organise events that have already been organised, in an effort to make friends. So she ends up losing friends by being OTT.

How on earth can I tell her to just chill out and be herself? She is so lovely when she is relaxed!

OP posts:
nennypops · 08/01/2014 18:07

Oh dear, she has absolutely no idea, does she? You are right, the only possible approach for her is to chill out and be herself, and I suspect the only way you can get that through to her is to sit her down and be brutally honest. She must surely be aware that her approach is disastrous so I would hope she is prepared to listen.

Cautionary tale - she sounds quite like SIL who could never meet a man without rushing ahead and planning the wedding. She got hooked into a longish relationship with one man who was married but who kept giving her really unconvincing excuses for his failure to get a divorce, but she refused to acknowledge that he was obviously lying until the day he broke it off. Subsequently she scared off a few decent blokes, and then married husband no. 1 basically because he was the first man to propose. He turned out to have numerous issues - they never once had sex, they started getting massive bills for calls to sex chatlines which he swore blind were nothing to do with him but turned out to be his calls, and he was into cross dressing. After the divorce, it was the same pattern again; this time, the first man willing to get married was a middle-aged mummy's boy with massive control freak tendencies, and again it ended in divorce. SIL could certainly have had a happy normal relationship with the right man if she hadn't been so desperate, and equally would have had a happier life if she had just remained single.

KissesBreakingWave · 08/01/2014 18:24

I think everyone knows one of these. The one I know keeps shagging married men. Is currently off the social scene in hiding from yet another enraged wife: she's so keen to drop 'em for anyone that pays her the slightest attention that she doesn't stop to make the most basic of enquiries.

That aside, I'm not sure there really is a nice/humane way to get such people to wake up and smell the coffee. The one round here might be forced into a moment of clarity the day she gets named as a co-respondent. Maybe.

Sorry to sound pessimistic, but problems like that are generally waaaaay too deep-rooted to be sorted with a good talking-to.

Brittapie · 08/01/2014 18:25

The woman does my head in. I've only known her about six months, I enjoy spending time with her most of the time, but OMG she needs to realise her own worth!

I have no objection whatsoever to casual sex, or unconventional situations, but she just seems to seek out the worst possible combination, and has said that she wants to do various things that I suspect she doesn't actually want to do but she thinks will impress people.

She's going to end up getting seriously hurt if she carries on like this. I do some spectaculary stupid things sometimes, but I am really worried where she will end up, when actually what she wants is a nice man, in a nice house, with a nice job, who will have a nice life with her. And she could have it, she is lovely, but she scares all the nice men off by being so terrifying!

OP posts:
wyldchyld · 08/01/2014 18:40

nennypops - no issues with your post other than the comment about one of the reasons he is weird being cross dressing. Horses for courses =) Cross dressing is not weird as long as it is done sensibly, carefully and with full knowledge of both partners and does not adversely affect the relationship.

Sorry, one of my touchy subjects (no, I don't have a thing about jock straps before anyone asks xD)

Revengeofkarma · 08/01/2014 21:20

She won't change unless she wants to. And while she might say she wants to fix the situation, she's so convinced herself that everyone lies, etc and her way is perfectly normal, and men are horrible that of course none of this is her lying, obsessed fault. It's everyone else who has to change.

If it's doing your head in, you either set a clear boundary with her that you're not going to talk about the man situation, or you put up with it. There's not much else you can do really. Because as noted above, we all know one. And I have yet to know one who changed. In fact, the just get more loopy as they get more desperate.

Rhubarbgarden · 08/01/2014 21:34

I have a friend like this - as another poster said, doesn't everyone? I spent years listening to the angst and trying to help her whilst being continually told I couldn't possibly understand and it was all ok for me because I wasn't single. She just ended up making me miserable because I always felt guilty, either because I couldn't make her wake up to herself or because she'd wound me up so much I started feeling really negatively about her.

I had to cool off the friendship in the end for my own sanity.

Marylou62 · 09/01/2014 08:24

I have a very very good friend who I really love. (you know...some friends you like some you love) but I have given up trying to advise her. She goes from crisis to crisis. I try to be there for her but sometimes I back off. Your friend will never change. We have been friends for over 20 years!!Just enjoy the bits you like in your friendship and tell her firmly that you don't want to get involved with her dramas! I do/did and we are still friends. Not saying that during dramas I don't worry about her, I do but...When I back off I really miss her! Nowt so weird as folk!

DigestivesAndPhiladelphia · 09/01/2014 08:53

I have a very similar friend. In the end, I just stepped back from giving her any relationship advice at all. Unfortunately this meant I had to step back from the friendship.

I had enough of spending hours on the phone giving sensible advice which she would totally ignore...then she would phone a few days later crying and asking what I thought she should do next. My friend also kept introducing the new men to her DC (within a couple of days of meeting then) or leaving the DC with anyone she could at night so that she could go out looking for men she was pursuing. It was that that finished me off really.

She also continually told me how lucky I was and how she wanted a relationship just like mine with DH. My life isn't perfect but I chose to marry a lovely man who treats me well, if he had behaved like a twat when I met him & told me that he only wanted sex, obviously I wouldn't have seen him again! I'm not sure that is 'luck'. When my friend went on dates with anyone who seemed normal she would complain "He is just too straight-laced for me, I prefer 'bad boys' " Hmm

I think you will have to accept your friend as she is and put up with her dramas or just see less of her. She will only change if she is ready and you might end up feeling exhausted by the whole thing.

AngelaDaviesHair · 09/01/2014 12:22

You can't talk her out of this-these are really fundamental problems. She sounds to me to be desperate for a relationship but terrified of true intimacy, hence all the self-sabotaging behaviour (been there).

I agree with RevengeofKarma- if you don't want to have to deal with it put in a clear boundary about not talking about her relationships. Trouble is, with a lot of people like this, this 'issue'/drama is all they do want to talk about, in which case you have to move on.

QuintessentialShadows · 09/01/2014 12:28

If I were you I would just let the friendship slide. You really dont want to let her drive a wedge between you and your male and non-male friends with her behaviour.

Famzilla · 09/01/2014 12:42

I have a friend like this. She was sexually abused throughout her childhood and it has given her a very warped attitude towards relationships, understandably.

I just don't get emotionally involved in her problems. I'm always there if she needs a non judgemental ear, but I don't put too much thought into her life, because it's her life. She's never going to change, so either embrace it or walk away.

Callani · 09/01/2014 13:00

I think there's a lot of truth in the phrase "We accept the love we think we deserve"

Your friend seems to have low self esteem and thinks that the only way she can "earn" a relationship is by sleeping with men straight away. The problem isn't that she's having one night stands, it's that she's claiming that's all she wants when really she wants something very different, and is therefore lying to men about her intentions.

I don't really know what to suggest, except to say that I was similar to her (a long time ago in my teens admittedly) and that I grew out of it when I met a nice guy who made me realise I was worth more than I realised...

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