To not want to see my friend after this revelation.....

[Writerwannabe83]

I have a friend that I have known for 14 years now. When we were younger we were really close but then as life got in the way we didn't see each other as often. These days we meet up for a good old chat every few months and go out for a meal etc and I'm due to be seeing her this Monday.

My sister just phoned me, who is also friends with his girl, and told me that this afternoon our friend confided that she has started seeing a married man who also has children - the youngest of which is only a baby of 5 months old My friend, despite being 32 has never had a serious relationship, she goes from disaster to disaster, she lets men lie to her and use her, she goes for the wrong type all the time, sleeps with men because she thinks they will then like her etc etc - I'm sure you get the picture. But I never, ever, ever thought she would go this far.

My sister was really upset as she has not long broke up with the father of her children (after 10 years together) because it transpired he was having an affair. Our friend can't understand why my sister is so upset and sees no problem with what she is doing. Apparently our friend is convinced this is something special and has "never felt anything like it..." She was complaining to my sister that she never gets to see this guy because the baby is taking up all his time.

Now, I'm absolutely dreading seeing her. I'm upset on my sisters behalf but also, I'm currently pregnant and I know I will sitting there, listening to her talk about it like it isn't an issue, whilst imagining that it could be me at home with the new born whilst the husband is out cheating. I don't know how I'm going to be able to stay friendly or calm with her....

I'm tempted to just text her and cancel.
I know we shouldn't be judgemental, but I really don't think I can sit there and listen to her or face her.

OP, I don't think you sound smug.

What XiCi said. I typed out much the same and didn't post. Pity friendships are worth nothing at all. Let you 'friend' know that you aren't interested in the friendship and maybe she'll make the effort to find some new ones or manage on her own.

I disagree with xici completely I think friendship should be a two way street, it sounds like you give, give, give and she takes, takes, takes - if you are happy with a friendship like that then tell her you are not impressed (and tell her you cant believe she would be so insensitive as to run this past your sister who has had the same done to her) I suspect, as you dont want to be an "audience" to her latest drama that you wont hear from her much until its all done and dusted.

It sounds to me like you have tried your very best to be a good friend but sometime people are just unlikeable, she wouldnt thank you for being a friend just because she doesnt have any others and if this cuckoo wanted to take root in your nest gut feeling is she wouldnt let your "friendship" stop her.

I had a few one way friendships over the years now I just find them too emotionally draining - I do feel sorry for people who are this damaged but its up to them to sort themselves out not me.

She has got plenty of friends - we don't even live in the same County. I see her maybe twice or three times a year.

The 'close' friends she does have, I.e the ones that she lives near and socialises with, I have met on a few occasions but from what she tells me, they are pretty horrible to her. She admits to herself that they are but when I ask why she allows them to be like that she can't give an answer. She just thinks it is all she deserves and that it's better than nothing.

I don't class her as a close friend and I imagine she doesn't class me as one either, we both know how things are - we just have a history that goes a long way back and so stay in touch. I arranged this meet up because I wanted to congratulate her on getting through her degree as I know she has found it hard at times.

I'm not smug - I feel somewhere between angry at her (because of how it has upset my sister) and also sad for her. I just wish she could see that she deserves so much better.

'as she has no qualms about starting a relationship with a married man then she may do the same to me.'

The married person in any affair scenario is more at fault and should be judged more harshly than the single person, IMO.

I'd go, hear it from her and try and educate her.
A man who is out cheating whilst his wife is looking after their 5mo baby is nothing but a shitbag. No excuses whatsoever in that scenario. Can your friend not see that? Does she want a shitbag? What does she think he will be doing if and when they have a 5mo baby together - out cheating with the next silly little girl, which frankly is what she sounds like.

She likes to wear rose tinted glasses - she is so naive to it all.

The last guy she had (he was about 45 I think) would come and visit her Fri-Sun - though she had to pay for his train fares as he 'couldn't afford it. They would have sex but wouldn't sleep in the same bed as her and would always leave her bedroom after the deed was done and sleep on the sofa instead?? He would spend each day he was there doing nothing but drinking alcohol and eating her food. He would typically sit there and send text messages to his ex girlfriend - telling her he still loved her and missed her - and my friend just let him. My friend knew exactly what the texts said but she always made excuses for him...... Unless she contacted him in the week she didn't really hear from him.

No matter how much I and other people told her what an idiot she was making of herself, she told us we were all wrong, we didn't know him like she did and they had something that could be really special.

He soon got bored and ended it.

That is how every relationship she has goes - she doesn't seem to have any clue as to what a nice, normal man is. She seems to be accepting of so much shitty behaviour.

I have met woman who have low self esteam actually target married men because a) if another woman wants him, he must be a bloke worth having (particularly woman who've got a history of dating wankers), b) if they are rejected by a married man, it's because he's married, he doesn't want to have an affair, she isn't being rejected, he's just being a good guy, it's not like a single man turning her down because then it must be just about not wanting her.

This also feeds into not being able to see him much - it's not that he's chosing not to see her often, or just isn't interested in her, he can't, so it's ok.

Plus if she's worried about being hurt, it's safer, it can't go anywhere so she can't get her hopes up just to be dashed.

I would meet up with her and ask her what does she want from her life, does she want to be married with DCs? It's perfectly valid not to want these things, but this man, as he's married to someone else either can't give her those things, or if he did, it wouldn't be a good life with him, he can't be trusted. If she just wants fun, then this man will give her that, although it's a shitty way to go about it, but if she wants family and commitment, no matter how much she thinks she loves him, she needs to end it and look for someone who can give her that. No decent bloke will want to ask out a woman who's in a relationship with someone else, esp if that someone else is married.

Tell her what you think but still be friends with her. At some point the shit will hit the fan and she will need you.

Some people are just desperate to be loved.

That's the thing dontmind - she is absolutely desperate for marriage and children, it's all she has ever wanted. Even when we were 16 she used to daydream and fantasise about it. That's why I can't understand why she is wasting her time with men where commitment/family is off the cards. I would love her to just meet someone 'normal' and decent who treats her right, but she doesn't. It is bizarre. When we have talks about where she sees her life going and what she wants from her life it it always ends in her crying. She knows how self destructive she is but she can't change her pattern of behaviour. She has told me that if by the time she is 33 she isn't in a serious relationship she will go to thenSperm Bank. All she wants is a baby, I actually don't think it matters to her who the father is. I think she just wants to be able to say to people 'I have a partner/husband' and the finer details, I.e if he is a nice person or not isn't really relevant.

Then perhaps just say to her you don't want to discuss details, you're not going to tell her off, but that you know that she wants marriage and children, and this man isn't going to be the one to give those to her, or if he does, then she won't have a happy, settled life, she'll be waiting for him to cheat on her. That even worse, being in a relationship with the wrong man means that any decent men she meets will not ask her out, because a decent man wouldn't chase after a woman in a relationship with someone else.

I think it is the hypocrisy that gets to me. When I think about how she reacted when it came out about my sister's partner being a cheat...

My friend probably thinks this man will leave his wife to be with her and bring the children too - a ready made family. I know that sounds extreme, but that's what she's like.

She sounds very damaged and lacking in self worth. It would be worthwhile seeing her, just to try and get the message across.

I've been giving her the same message for a good 13 years - as has everyone else - it goes in one ear and out the other. That's why we all get so frustrated. As another poster said, she is just draining. It is the same issue over and over again, year after year after year. There is only so many times you can face hearing about her latest drama and repeating the same advice for it to go ignored again.

cut all ties if that is how you feel

You seem to not like her/herlifestyle so just cut contact

I do like her, she has some lovely qualities but if she just dropped her negative attitude she would be much easier to handle. She isn't a nasty or horrible person, she goes out of her way to do nice things for people, she is very thoughtful, helps people out financially if she can etc but it is just difficult when she makes her life hard for herself. It's uncomfortable to watch. I hate seeing her cry, I hate seeing yet another man crush her but I don't know how to deal with it anymore. It's hard watching someone you are friends with make so many mistakes and repeatedly get hurt - but if she won't take anyone's advice it's hard to know how to deal with her. I just wish she could see all the positive things she has in her life (including many aspects of her personality) and see that she deserves a nice and normal guy just as much as the next person does.

It is hard for her to have true friends as she doesn't make the effort with anyone

Does she know how?

All the stuff with men just sounds like she doesn't think she is worth treating well.

Dontmindifido
Really good post. Its sort of like self sabotage isn't it.

She's just so complicated - like I said she is kind and does lovely things for people but in term of forming attachments, that's where she falls down. Like she hosted a baby shower for a mutual friend, which was lovely of her to do, but when our friend was having problems in our marriage there was no support. She will dip in and out of people's lives, not really showing any genuine concern or interest if they are having a difficult time. She will make grand gestures (like the baby shower) but when it comes to the day to day maintenance of friendships and just generally 'being there' she can't cope with it. She will do things for people but only if she thinks it will make them like her more. She only 'dips in' to our lives if she wants to try and do something to impress us or if she wants to talk about her recent relationship and have everyone's attention, and sympathy and focus on her.

It's just so difficult because beneath all her complexities she is a really nice woman, she just doesn't know how to show it and she rubs people up the wrong way.

You said her parents threw her out at 16, I can imagine that and whatever came before it, would have an impact on her ability to form attachments?

Sounds like she does what she thinks 'works' and favours grand gestures to detract from her shortcomings.

Its a shame that she doesn't seem to get much pride out of her achievements.

I used to be like your friend, although I only ever got involved with single men and changed my ways after reassessing my life after a bereavement.

I only ever contacted my friends when something happened in my life, otherwise I waited for them to contact me. This was because I felt that I actually had something of interest to tell them and that at other times I would just be bothering them.

I would get involved with emotionally unavailable men because ( i realise now) that I wanted to fix my relationship with my mother. She was emotionally distant and I wished I could find a way to behave to get her to act like she loved me. Subconsciously I though I would find a way to 'turn' one of these men and then use the technique with my mother. Sounds bizarre I know....

If I imagine myself in your friend's position, I think she feels really special because she thinks She's more important to this man than his wife or baby.

Hth

If she just isn't much of a friend anyway, and you can't think of a reason why you'd want to see her, then the friendship seems like it's probably over.

I cut a friend out earlier this year for behaviour which isn't too dissimilar to your mate's. I don't miss having someone so self-centred in my life. There is literally nothing in the past 7 months that I wish we done together. If you feel so strongly about the way she's acting, you might feel the same.

You made her sound really self centered and a waste of time in your earlier posts but subsequently have said she has some nice points.

I dont know - the friends I decided not to bother with were consistently draining and any contact was always on their terms With one I was expected to go to anything arranged by her if she decided to invite me but she rarely even did anything for me and often let me down with a pack of lies at the last minute. The other was in the marriage from hell and despite numerous people giving her practical advice and emotional support was just never geting out of it. Every time I saw or spoke to either I felt exhausted and depressed and we just kept going over the same problems again, and again, and again.

It must be getting old to have to keep going through the drama over the relationships and seeing her making the same mistakes - you are either the kind of person who does have the time and energy for it or like me decide to bow out and hope they eventually sort their lives out on their own. I dont wish either any ill will, I hope they are eventually happy, I just cant keep on being emotionally bled dry by them.

Well I met up with my friend and instead of feeling angry with her I just feel incredibly, incredibly sorry for her. She has clearly met an absolute shit who knows EXACTLY what to say to make a vulnerable woman feel special. He's fed her all the usual lines about how bad things are at home but he can't bear to leave because of how much he'll miss his children etc. He's told my friend how special she is and how much he misses her when they aren't together and how proud he is of things she has achieved in her life......blah, blah, blah. And she just laps it up.......She was actually sitting there trying to defend him when I was telling her what a complete bastard he is!! She said, "It's not just about sex, he really likes me, it just feels so right....."

She found out about the girlfriend (not wife) and their two children when she searched for him on Facebook. How cliche. He has since blocked my friend from his Facebook Account - I guess he doesn't want her to see that actually home life is pretty good and happy, certainly not the Hell he made it out to be. The youngest is only 2 months old and this 'wonderful guy' started seeing my friend just before the baby was born.

We had a good long chat and tried to make her see what an evil, vile, cheating wanker this guy is, and although she goes, "I know....." it's just words. She found out 3 weeks ago about his home life situation but has said they are still in touch. She said she isn't going to see him again (yeah right) but they text each other throughout the day frequently and speak on the phone every 2 days.

He's got my friend right where he wants her - I bet he's having a great laugh at her expense and feeling very smug about how gullible she is so he can have his weekend fun when he tells his girlfriend he's away working. It is quite clear from how he is behaving that this isn't the first time he's had an affair and my friend probably isn't the only 'OW' that he has on the scene.

I just sat there, looking at my friend, feeling incredibly, incredibly sorry for her. Why can't she see what everyone else can......

Poor thing. How awful for her, the kids, the DP, everyone. What an enormous wanker this man is.