to be fuming at the rates of malnutrition in England?

[sashh]

Reading a report in the Independent about a letter sent to the British Medical Journal.

Malnutrition cases seen in English hospitals has gone up from 3,161 in 2008/09 to 5,499 in 2012/13.

I know some will be people arriving from warn torn Africa, some will be children of frankly evil parents and some will be people not eating due to chemo or some other reasons. But that can't account for such a rise in cases.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/food-poverty-in-uk-has-reached-level-of-public-health-emergency-warn-experts-8981051.html

We have tight food budget family of 5 ,3 kids.

its because the only varaiable we can cut back on is food,

so last month had some unexpected cost washing machine repair, car we have to compensate in some way.

I do now how to cook from scratch.
I do a frozen shop every few months at farm foods they have very little produce but i do stock up on loads of frozen veggies and try and serve 1-2 servings with main meal.

We then do rest mix between lidls/aldis.
The aldis super six can sometimes be good.

rest of time we flit between coop large one, small sainsburys tesco metro and morrisions on weekday evenings , sundays and bank holidays for reductions rarly buy full price salad stuff takes time as walk there mostly.

tonight it paid off in spar of all places
1 pints milk 15p got 6 as we get through loads
bag funsize apples 25p abg got 2
pack of tomatoes 13p.
mince 57p
pasty 28p -husbands lunch tommorow

we have big freezer.
kids like tinned fruits
fruit bowl mostly has apples or bananas they the cheapest, satsumas and oranges in season only the rest especially berries/grapes have to be reduced for me to buy.
some weeks fruit bowl looks bare.

i do try everyone get 5 a day not sure they do.
proteins ie fish /meats are most expensive to provide we have roast once a month not every sunday.

we have occasional ready meal if reduced and value or on offer pizza.

least 1-2 nights a week its crap tea nigt often oven chips work oyt cheaper than buying potatoes.

I can do dinners cheap enough its the snacks, breckfasts and packed lunches plus non foods still have 2 in nappies that bumps cost up

supermarket basic own brands have shot up in price which feel is wrong and not everyone can get to and aldis or a lidls.

food shop has felt harder during 2013.

Er no, but then I didn't say it would! People don't exactly help themselves at times, even though they are well aware of nutrition and know exactly which choice is best for their family

But hey, let's all just sit back and blame the government or someone else

www.theguardian.com/society/patrick-butler-cuts-blog/2013/dec/04/suppressed-tory-report-welfare-reform-link-to-foodbanks-homelessness

3asAbird, it sounds like you are doing the very best you can on a tight budget. I hate that I cannot make more fresh fruit and veggies available to my children more readily. ( my daughters would snack on them all day long) We rarely have red meat of any kind as it is too expensive. I sometimes crave a really rare cheeseburger...

I will not complain though we have enough and my children are thin though certainly not malnourished.

My son is diagnosed as clinically malnourished .

Poor boy is only getting 3000 calories a day, quick report me to SS!

I know a lot of clinically ill children who are classed as such. I also know many people on low incomes - funnily enough these are not families with children who are classed as malnourished.

While I do think that there is poverty in this country and something should be done about rising costs, I believe the malnutrition rates are more likely to do with a rise in eaton disorders and management of the clinically unwell.

*eating

Have you read the link?

Also, plenty of reported cases of the elderly in hospital, starving at the hands of the NHS because the food is inappropriate, or the person cannot physically feed themselves.

I've read the link.
I don't know why the number of cases of malnutrition has increased, certainly no evidence is given in the article. The clinicians 'speculate' that it may be linked with government policy, yet give no reason why, eg., "x% of patients are reporting cuts in their welfare is causing them to cut back on food, " etc.
Same with food banks. There are many other reasons why usage has increased, the main one being awareness. We won't know the truth until there's some evidence.

I have two food shops in walking distance, neither have a produce section, the next three closest shops don't either.

And yet when Tesco opem up a Tesco Metro, which for all its failings will have a produce section of sorts, there are middle-class howlings about it being Tesco (although oddly, Sainsbury Express provokes no such outcry, even though their business model is precisely the same). It's easy to complain about Tesco driving out local shops when you wouldn't shop in either and prefer Waitrose, and there's a hideous "let them eat overpriced artisan brioche" air to stuff about farmers' markets and the like. The reality is that, compared to many food shops in deprived areas, the arrival of Tesco is transformational.

We dont have an express nearby but my mate does very well from hers.

We do have sainsburys local which is expensive however the fruit and veg is frequently reduced so tend to go i there and only buy reduced or essential items in there.

I find with specific things its better look out reduced than buy aldi super six.

genrally anything on promotion bay in large co-op ends up reduced so will get reduced satumas and oranges at some point this month.
Winter and rainy days best time to buy salad stuff.

sadly apart from me none of family like stir frys but they often reduced add some diced turkey always reduced and noodles its balanced cheapis meal but cant be frozen.

our co-op opens boxing day thats when we will buy 5-6 reduced chickens and freeze and try last whole jan as 5 week pay gap due to dec paid early.

My kids dont mind value mandarins, peaches and pinnapple.
Still have some free cherries from summer.
farmfoods andpossibly iceland have frozen fruit if kids will drink a smoothie mine wont.

Winter perfect time pick up whatever reduced veg cook then blitz into tomato soup.hide the goodness.

I do worry they not always getting 5 day or enough protein.
I try keep few tins tuna in cupboard for patsa and sandwiches.

I bulk out ince dishes with red lentils.

have used quorn but hubby hates it and its not that cheap.

but mine never go hungry i think their meals are fairly balanced.
cant afford school dinners every day which is a shame.
just 40quid amonth is liek nearly 1 weeks family food shop.

lot of reduced is just luk cant be guranteed.
i hate way value lines just dissapear or hike in price by 20p nothing downshift too.
It takes time to shop around and get reduced but its become way of life and way for family to get treats like cream cakes, fancy yoguryts/desserts as ocassional treats as naything cat be frozen tends to be reduced cheap.

A diet of fresh is expensive its reason we stopped doing shop in big 4 as produce section was huge and ended up spending too much.

The girl called jack thread she and her boy lived on £10 per week.

There is post on mse £7 a week thread some lovley ideas and posters that discusses ow things rissn but im doubtful its possible to have such a balanced diet on such a low budget.

keep reading about parents skipping meals. The independents been doing food a lot. food banks dont give any fresh stuff.
Which reminds me want to donate some stuff before xmas.

3asAbird - you say you don't know how to cook from scratch - is there any reason why you can't learn? You presumably have internet access, there are any number of cooking films on Youtube. Library access? Does you area not run any adult education classes?

I'm not picking on you particularly, but in this day and age is it that hard to pick up essential skills?

You can buy an apple or banana for 15-20p ..... Tell me why there is a sudden malnutrition problem again?

You can buy a packet of biscuits for that. If you have 3 children and 20p left to get them a treat would you get them a banana to share?

you say you don't know how to cook from scratch - is there any reason why you can't learn?

I do know how to do this. Some days my arthritis stops me. For other people - where do you learn? If you are poor you cannot afford mistakes, you have to eat what you have made or go hungry.

As someone said upthread you might not live anywhere you can buy healthy food.

I agree with 3asAbird, it's not the cost of food that's the problem it's the rising other costs of living such as rent and energy. It seems that the only way to cut household costs is by cutting the food bill.

Here in London, where a one bedroom flat will cost you at least £800 per month ( one in poor condition in a poor location) that's a much higher proportion of your income than your food budget.

As someone whose recently dropped from a 2 income to a 1 income family in London due to motherhood I've found the way to cut our food budget was... to buy lots of fruit, veg, flour, etc and make things from scratch. I wasn't much of a cook before, but MrsOakenshield is right, I just looked stuff up on the net.

I know when I had 3 small children, I wouldn't have time to teach myself to cook

then there is the worry of a balls up, which when you are on the bones of your arse - you just can't afford to experiment or cock up an evening meal.

if you boil anything down to it's bare bones it sounds simple enough
relationships = communication, trust, love

diet - eat three squares a day, don't snack, small amounts of excersise.

but life is not that simple.

.20p with 3 kids - 1 piece of fruit a day = .60p a day - over 7 days for one piece of fruit a day = £4.20

£4.20 is a lot of money when you haven't got any. and that can be spent on a meal that some children may otherwise not have

meal or fruit...meal or fruit.

4.20 can get you a large bag of really shit chips, 3 tins value beans and if you're lucky, maybe some value (cardboard) bread.

that could be a families meals for half the week

Or.... 4.10 could buy you:

40 tesco value fish fingers - £2.40 and just as good as Birds Eye,

1kg frozen broccoli - £1 , more vitamins than fresh and already cut up for anyone with dexterity issues,

2kg carrots - 90p

It's about choices

I'm very into diet and fitness and can confirm that it's expensive to eat healthily, especially when buying a lot of fresh produce, which doesn't keep well and is liable to go off quickly if not used.

Also, I have fussy eaters and end up wasting a lot of food. A lot of times, my children won't eat their vegetables and end up eating pretty much carbs and dairy for days on end and I'm not uneducated about food. I'm just grateful they will eat fruit and nuts!

400g of pearl barley for 50p sainsburies.

Let them eat peal barley

people are not malnourished because they are not eating their 5 a day.

they are malnourished because they are consistently eating a very bad diet and not more people - too much food overall.

You need protein in your diet. Cheap carrots and bananas won't cut it or fill you up.

I can cook from scratch im self taught as home ec was bad and mum fed me readymeals and hated cooking.

but there are nights when we have lazy meals like

sausage and chips
breaded chicken or fish with chips
or frozen pizza with oven chips.

i try add porton of veg or beans to the side.

But with kids life is hectic im in and out house a lot on weekday.

sometimes when hubbys off i batch cook but not managed that latly.

i try stick simple quick meals like

baked potatoes
fish and new potatoes
omlette
soups.

so does not always have to be complex masterpeices.

but everything may seem small price but all adds up.

my kids have habit of eating through fruitbowl really quickly.

I offer then fruit, value breadsticks or value fromagae frais as snacks.

i limit crisps to one bag per day.
i try limit the value bicuits and choc mouse too.

hubby hates most veg. I try not buy too much fresh other than salads, potatoes , onions, carrots , leeks and pepers rest i do from frozen as no waste the and lots veg is 3 for 2 at farmfoods.

I have made culi cheese using frozen caulifower and packet cheese sauce mix

cassroles easy enough with jar or oacket mix.

occasionaly desperate we get veg bo from dairy as pay them monthly.

daughter has pcked lunch 3 days a week.

typical lunch is

sandwich cheese or sliced meats both can be pricy or tuna.
I try get reduced bread rolls, wrapps and loaves and freeze as find cheaper than baking my own and nicer than value.
1bag crisps-if we stuck we buy value brand.
2portions fruit ie kiwi and orange or apple depnds whats cheap and reduced.
value fromage frais.
squash in bottle.
2biscuits.

occasionally if baking i add cake but cakes tend to use sugar and loads butter and eggs all adds up as did school bake sale last week and spent small fortune.

food reallys is only non fixed amount on our budget we rarly go out have few luxuries we try set 200-250 amonth but if something goes wrong ie car needs go garage tommorow plus xmas we need to make cutbacks.

sometimes i find random stuff reduced

mashed potato i just froze then when sausages were reduced made bangers and mash with value yorkies and frozen veg,

got 2packets yorkie pud mix yesterday 13p each im sure they come in handy over xmas.

every reduced think like fish, meat, sausages is another meal so i buy random things when I can and manage to pull it together for family meal.

friday16 - Very true, actually the closest shop to me with a produce section is a Tesco Metro (with a Co-op slightly further that expanded their produce section to compete with them). The produce section is a bit small and mostly bagged fruits and salads (not the single items that were being costed in the post I was replying to) and frustrating to have one cabinet of fresh foods next to three large cabinets full of fizzy drinks and puddings, but it was refreshing and encouraged other shops. Not in walking distance for us and I can imagine it quite difficult for some of my neighbours, but it has been helpful (though I think producers/farmers would disagree with their being helpful). A way to help smaller shops to do so would be good for many people, but larger shops have been helpful and more accessible (certainly more than Waitrose!).

While many are giving information on cost, the problem of access is just as big a problem in many areas, particularly for those unable to drive or move about well, many who are in groups vulnerable to malnutrition.

Eating vegetarian is much cheaper.