Aibu to want this boy excluded from school.

[dementedmumof6]

There is a boy in my highschool aged dd year at school, that is currently on police bail for threatening to rape a younger girl he knows. Who has sent inappropriate sexual texts to my daughter and who told one of her friends that as soon as he gets the chance he was going to rape her and that she would enjoy it.

For the last month he has been in seclusion, enters school after everyone else , is taught on his own and leaves early,

However the friend that he threatened to rape has been told that as of Monday he will be back in class as normal until it goes to court and that to keep her safe she is to make sure that she doesn't go anywhere in the school without someone with her at all times , when she asked them to clarify was told that she was to have one of her friends with her (so not even an adult ) even to go to the toilet,so that he can't approach her.

So the question is would I be unreasonable to go into school and insist that this isn't appropriate that if they are worried about the boys behaviour he should either have a teacher with him at all times or be excluded , and he shouldn't be allowed anywhere near any of the girls in the school.

[Whistleblower0]

why are some people so intent on keeping violent criminals in schools and making excuses for the reasons that should be so


Personally, i think that there is a whole swathe of professionals who have a vested interest in the whole 'abusive children are victims too mantra
'It keeps a lot of them in jobs! They never seem overly concerned with the rights of the real victims of these violent thugs!

Also you are right in saying that if this boy was say a couple of years older and an adult in a work enviroment, he would'nt be dealt with with the kid gloves that some posters on here are advocating!

[whatsagoodusername]

I think it is quite sensible to allow the girls – all girls, not just the one or two he has threatened already – at the school to have a friend accompany them so that they feel safer instead of going anywhere alone if he is loose in the school. But they should not be putting the responsibility on the girls to remain in pairs to ensure their safety. He ought to have an adult with him at all times.

He does have a right to an education and given his skewed view that this is a good way to behave, educating him seems very important. But not at the expense of the girls' safety.

[Whistleblower0]

With rights comes responsibilities!I dont agree that he is entited to an education. I know it's the law, but the law is an ass.
I have zero sympathy or empathy for those who threathen sexual violence.
Dread to think what this speciman will be like as an adult.

[friday16]

He does have a right to an education

So send him to a PRU.

[whatsagoodusername]

Just to be clear, I'm not defending his right to an education in a mainstream school! If he's a threat to others, then he doesn't belong where he can't be controlled safely. A right to education in a PRU, or prison if he acts on his threats, but educated hopefully to the point he no longer is this threat. Don't know if that's possible, but it would be the best outcome for everyone.

[GimmeDaBoobehz]

I agree nothing has been proven but then again if he has been making threats that are similar to the allegation to other young girls then it's unlikely to the max that it isn't true as you don't go round making them threats.

I hope whoever is being threatened now has mentioned this to the school and police.

If he was accused and hadn't behaved similarly ever before, I'd feel more sympathetic to his plight but he's acting guilty alright by saying the things he currently is.

[JustGettingOnWithIt]

leas can have their own agendas and exert pressure from behind the scenes.

Successive governments have hailed the reduction in exclusions as a sign off improved behaviour. All it has done is put pressure on those leas and schools to not exclude. With little or no funding for alternative provision, everyone is just stuck.

This is absolutely spot on. Lea's lean on schools, and will use any means possible to get what they want regardless of who gets damaged or the risks.
They try exerting 'pressure' that some would consider to be more than 'pressure' and use a different word for, on some parent's too.

[friday16]

Lea's lean on schools, and will use any means possible to get what they want regardless

How many secondary schools are there which aren't academies, or converting this year?

An LEA which threw its weight around would simply accelerate the process of all the local secondaries converting.

[NearTheWindmill]

No child should have to attend school with fear hanging over them, advised to remain in pairs for their safety. Any teacher who thinks that situation is acceptable would not, imo, be fit to teach or guide a child of mine - in fact I think that view makes them unfit to teach or have any influence over my children.

OTH I did confront a head over this; I couldn't have done that if i hadn't had the means to remove my child. i gather the school is now starting to wake up a bit though - but only after significant attrition of the children they could least afford to lose.

[NearTheWindmill]

No child should have to attend school with fear hanging over them, advised to remain in pairs for their safety. Any teacher who thinks that situation is acceptable would not, imo, be fit to teach or guide a child of mine - in fact I think that view makes them unfit to teach or have any influence over my children.

OTH I did confront a head over this; I couldn't have done that if i hadn't had the means to remove my child. i gather the school is now starting to wake up a bit though - but only after significant attrition of the children they could least afford to lose.

[dementedmumof6]

Sorry was not on over the weekend,

He turned up as normal to school this morning but was then placed into isolation so he is being taught separately not eating in the dining hall ect, and I have an appointment to discuss my concerns with the head on Wednesday

[Debs75]

That sounds like a good compromise for now OP

[BoneyBackJefferson]

nearthe

The excuses that you are making so much noise about are facts of life for schools, if you want this changed then lobby the government, they are the ones that set the policies that schools have to abide by.

No teacher wants violent criminals in the school that they teach, they have no choice, I have worked in schools where both male and female staff have been told to not be alone in a room with various pupils, sometime due to the threat of sexual attacks, sometimes due to violent attacks and sometimes (yes it really does happen) due to a history of false allegations.

Would you prefer for this boy to be roaming the streets or sent to a new school where his past has to be kept secret so that HE gets a fresh start?
Where the female staff and female pupils have no idea what he has done?

Why can't the school send him to a PRU? because the parents have to agree to it.
Why can't they reduce his timetable? because the parents have to agree to it.

So what have they done? according to the OP he is being kept in isolation away from all of the other pupils.

Sometimes the school can't be right because there is no right.

"How, just how does the culture of excuses teach young people rigjt from wrong and suppoprt the miscreanmts in any way. They need to be prepared for real wprld and to do otherwoise is failing them."

I don't disagree

"Wonders what planet many educationalists actually inhabit."

Its called the real world, where a one fit answer doesn't always work.

"It is quite scary that young peope face this soprt pof attitude on a daily basis."

You mean just like the real world? you can't have it both ways. (as much as you may want to)

[friday16]

You mean just like the real world?

No, only for children in state schools. If a member of staff in any workplace threatened his colleagues with violence he would be suspended and then dismissed. And if a member of staff in a state school were to threaten his colleagues with violence, he too would be suspended and then sacked. The real world protects people from violence in the workplace. It's only state school teachers who shrug their shoulders and tell children that being threatened with rape is just "the real world" and something they simply have to put up with.

[Whistleblower0]

Excellent post friday.

[BoneyBackJefferson]

Friday

Please point me to the post where a teacher has said that rape is "something to put up with"

As for state schools not being in the "real world" maybe yours is in some sort of parallel universe but unfortunately schools are part of the real world.

[friday16]

Here's what a shrug looks like:

No teacher wants violent criminals in the school that they teach, they have no choice,

They have every choice. They could, for example, simply refuse to teach such pupils, citing their own health and safety concerns.

[BoneyBackJefferson]

And they would lose their job as the system is set up to protect the violent child.

back to the real world can you think of any cases in the news where teenagers have gotten away with violence outside of school?
Where teenagers have gotten away with rape outside of school?

I can think of several.

And you still haven't pointed me to the post where a teacher said that rape was "something to put up with"

[friday16]

And they would lose their job as the system is set up to protect the violent child.

That explains why all the staff at Saltley who refused to teach a child who had threatened others with a knife are...oh, look, still in post.

And you still haven't pointed me to the post where a teacher said that rape was "something to put up with"

I said the threat of rape. And I was referring to your statement that "You mean just like the real world? you can't have it both ways. (as much as you may want to)".

I think children should be protected from the threat of rape. You've got a lockerful of excuses as to why you don't think teachers should worry about it. I hope that if your own children were threatened with rape you'd bestir yourself a little more.

[friday16]

back to the real world can you think of any cases in the news where teenagers have gotten away with violence outside of school?

Gotten? Are we all American all of a sudden?

Yes, I can think of plenty of cases. I can't think of many where the police have immediately rushed to the defence of the perpetrator, while telling the victim that they should get a friend to look after them because the victim is the most important person here.

[Whistleblower0]

I think in instances like this boney, teachers do have a choice. They simply choose the easiest option by not putting their head above the parapet..

[BoneyBackJefferson]

I have not posted that teachers should not worry about it.

You can quote me if you can find out where I have posted that.

"I said the threat of rape"

then point me to a post where a teacher has posted that a threat of rape is acceptable.

"I hope that if your own children were threatened with rape you'd bestir yourself a little more."

Are you really running that low on arguments that you have to resort to that?

[BoneyBackJefferson]

And just FYI I have agreed with the OP pushing the school from the start.

[friday16]

then point me to a post where a teacher has posted that a threat of rape is acceptable.

Your repeated references to "the real world" is either implying that it's a fact of life that should be accepted or, well, or what?

Are you really running that low on arguments that you have to resort to that?

Suppose your child was threatened with rape at school. Would your response be "well, it's the real world, and there's nothing teachers or schools can do?" If yes, at least you're consistent. In no, why is it different for other people's children?

[BoneyBackJefferson]

My repeated references to "the real world" are to show that the same instances that happen in school are happening outside of school.

read here

full publication here

or what about the history of how slut walks came about?

My reaction to a threat of rape to my child does not change the fact that schools are part of the real world and have to deal with real world problems, and have to deal with them as part of a set framework, your example of someone being fired for violence in the workplace steps over the fact that the workplace would still have to abide by the rules set down and several have found themselves at the rough end of tribunals where huge amounts of money have been paid out due to the situation being badly handled.