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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To think you should still pay fees for clubs if you take your child on an extended holiday?

23 replies

unlucky83 · 12/11/2013 10:52

I collect the fees for two groups - both charities and one of the groups is oversubscribed with a waiting list.
Neither group makes a profit - the fees cover costs like hall rental and for one a member of staff - neither of them are large amounts - the fees are as low as possible, based on numbers attending and running costs.
A family have gone away on an extended holiday and they have automatically deducted the fees for the missed sessions from their bills...(they have one DC in each group)

AIBU to think that is UR? It shouldn't have been expected?

(We are lucky it is just one family - and both groups can just about afford it - but if everyone did this...even if it was just every time a DC missed a session because they were sick/granny's birthday etc we would be stuck (obviously long term sick etc etc we would do our utmost to not charge) - These parents have chosen to be absent and we are keeping their place...

OP posts:

Bowlersarm · 12/11/2013 10:54

I agree with you. Is it for a term time activity? Could you make fees payable upfront for the term.

VoiceofRaisin · 12/11/2013 10:54

YANBU Do people still pay if their child is off sick one week? What is the norm/ expectation?

Original poster

unlucky83 · 12/11/2013 11:01

They are term time - the half term was in the middle of the holiday...
When they got the bills they said - right well we aren't here for these four week so we owe XYZ....
I guess we should have said - actually no you need to pay anyway -but just felt a bit and maybe
(and I wasn't there when it happened at the over subscribed group - or I think I would have said - sorry you can't do that ...)
People do normally pay if their child misses a week ...otherwise we would have to charge more on the off chance someone did that...

OP posts:

TrueBoo · 12/11/2013 11:02

I think that's outrageous. Just tell them that their children cannot attend until fees fully paid.

jacks365 · 12/11/2013 11:07

I agree with trueboo they've not paid so lose their place. If you want to keep a place open for your dc you pay for it.

FeisMom · 12/11/2013 11:08

Tell them to pay up or lose their place

scaevola · 12/11/2013 11:09

Yes, you should pay the fee if you are away.

Rule of thumb - if it's a family reason you don't go, you still pay. If it's the clubs fault that a whole session cannot be run, then a refund or additional session is offered.

BalloonSlayer · 12/11/2013 11:10

Did they sign an agreement when their DCs started the clubs?

Usually there is something in the terms and conditions about what you pay for.

You need to find out, and write to them.

sparechange · 12/11/2013 11:17

Can you present the bills as the annual/term cost, but with a footnote that you will either accept the payment as a lump sum, or split across X payments and paid weekly? And any accounts in arrears for more than 2 weeks will result in the place being offered to another child?

That way, it is clear that this isn't a pay-as-you-go cost, but they have to cover the whole cost even if they miss some?

Original poster

unlucky83 · 12/11/2013 11:31

No they didn't sign anything before they started ...
I think it might be too late now - we have kind of agreed to it as we were just so surprised at the time ....and they seemed to think it was perfectly reasonable /expected...
It was only when I thought about it later I thought ...
But at least no-one thinks IWBU in future to say that someone in that situation has to pay....
(And spare that is a good idea - they do get termly bills for a set amount - but I could add a sentence on there to make it clear it is for the place for a term not how many weeks you attend...)

OP posts:

MomOfTwoGirls2 · 12/11/2013 11:39

They were very cheeky, especially as they deducted it from the lump sum payment. There is no way they would get away with this from a private club.

I think the treasurer of the club should send them a bill, explaining that the fees are for the entire term, regardless of how many days the children attend. You don't want to set a precedence on this.

Original poster

unlucky83 · 12/11/2013 11:55

I am the treasurer...
And it is the precedence I am a bit worried about...I might try and have a quiet word with them... if I make too much fuss it will become well known (doubt they have told anyone about it at the moment) and that might make it worse...

We do have a little buffer...mainly because as part of being a charity we have to be inclusive - so if there was a child who was attending and whose parents ran into unexpected financial difficulties (ie we had one DC whose DF left them and DM was struggling at first) we try to have the leeway so we can eg waiver the fees for a term (a bit like for a child on long term sick)...
(Shouldn't be for someone going on holiday though!)

OP posts:

halcyondays · 12/11/2013 13:17

That was cheeky of them, they should have just paid the full fees, as it was their choice to go away.

TheFuzz · 12/11/2013 13:19

Have they signed any agreements. They are being unreasonable especially for a Not for Profit organisation !

Mim78 · 12/11/2013 13:27

They should pay. I would send a bill with reminder they will lose place if not filled.

I've Never heard of a club where you don't pay if you miss a week or more when it's on.

GobTheGoblin · 12/11/2013 13:30

I think that for next term you need a new policy re fees putting in place.

Also a 'contract' or constitution of some sort that includes what the club does, that it is none profit making, what is expected of members and the new rules regarding fees (how much and when they need to be paid by) and make sure that everyone who is a member gets a copy and signs to say they have read and agree with the terms. That will then stop anyone else deciding to do the same and deduct weeks they are not there for.

Isildur · 12/11/2013 13:31

We pay termly for most activities, and for everything from Cubs to music lessons, we sign a form to say we will pay even for missed sessions.

I guess you need to implement the same.

JoinYourPlayfellows · 12/11/2013 13:35

Cheeky fuckers.

You need a policy to cover this.

What should have happened is that they were told they paid for the full term without their own discretionary deductions or they lost their place.

Fleta · 12/11/2013 13:38

Yes they should absolutely pay to keep the place open for their child

BalloonSlayer · 12/11/2013 13:41

Could you write to them?

Dear Mr and Mrs Freeloader

I am writing to you as it appears that there has been a misunderstanding in respect of your latest invoice for fees.

The fees are for your child's attendance at xx activity for each term. If your child does not attend a session then the fee is still payable for the whole term. It is not possible to deduct fees because your child did not attend.

The reason for this policy is that xxx is a very popular activity, and there is a waiting list to join. xxx is a charity which runs on a tight budget, and it is not possible to keep places open for children who do not attend and do not pay fees while they are not attending.

If a child is absent from xxx without fees being paid, it is normally assumed that the child has been withdrawn from the activity and their place is now free to be taken by someone on the waiting list.

However, as it seems that there has been a misunderstanding in this instance, if you could arrange to pay the shortfall of £xxx by xx date, we would be able to keep your child's place in xxx activity open.

With very best wishes

Unlucky

Arohaitis · 12/11/2013 13:45

I don't think you should let them get away with it, I don't think they will complain if you ask them to pay up or they loose their place, everyone on here has given the same answer (ie they expect to pay) and I think in the community if they said anything they would pretty much be told they should expect to pay

Bakingtins · 12/11/2013 13:48

What balloon said. The fees for the term cover your fixed costs, which do not vary if one family choose not to attend. We pay for all clubs termly or half termly in advance. If the organiser cancelled a session I would expect a refund or an alternative session, if I choose not to or am unable to attend I suck it up.

BalloonSlayer · 12/11/2013 14:05

Also think what would happen if word got out that this family hadn't paid for the weeks their DCs did not attend.

How many other people would then demand refunds for the weeks their DCs didn't come, that they paid for?

Would you be able to refuse them? How, when you have let this family get away with it?

You'd go bust.

I think it would be a massive mistake to ignore this for the above reason.

I also think it would be a mistake to say "um sorry you do need to pay you know" because people like this are thick-skinnned and could easily weasel out of it.

You need to present this as "YOUR actions in not paying for your weeks away have meant your child has lost their place. This is the rule. No Buts. However, as it seems you have been trying it on misunderstood, you have one last chance to keep your child's place. Cough up. Pronto. "

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