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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To find the term 'underclass' offensive and to think teachers shouldn't be teaching students about it?

197 replies

Opalite · 08/11/2013 22:43

I was talking to DD and she was saying how her teacher told the class about 'underclass, working class, middle class and upper class' we were watching TV and it mentioned middle class, DD said that we're underclass and her teacher had told her about it yesterday
Is it outdated? I find it offensive and I don't think it's right for her teacher to be telling them these things as if they're facts or as if they matter

OP posts:
AnythingNotEverything · 08/11/2013 22:47

It depends on age and context. In a lesson about sociology, theories about class are very relevant. Underclass can represent the homeless, criminals etc. It could also represent families enduring intergenerational deprivation or worklessness.

In itself, teaching about an underclass isn't a bad thing. It is a bad thing to label kids as being part of a section of society which has negative connotations.

I think, in balance, YABU.

misspontypine · 08/11/2013 22:51

What class would you define yourself as?

I find it odd that a teacher would be teaching a child about class (outside of sociology lessons) If it was in a sociology lesson then fair enough.

I remeber asking my boyfriend's dm if they onsidered themself to be in the underclass as they relied onhandouts just as much as my much looked down upon by my boyfriend's mum single mum.

Nataleejah · 08/11/2013 22:53

Depends on context. What was the point?

Mylovelyboy · 08/11/2013 22:55

I know what you mean OP. There will always be 'this class thing'.

I think to call someone underclass is horrible really. People have refereed to me as middle class which is absolute crap. I grew up on a council estate as a kid. Ive now done alright for myself. So what am I? underclass or middleclass. I think its all shite to be honest. I can see where you are coming from. Why does teacher think you are underclass. Cheeky bastard

Mignonette · 08/11/2013 22:55

It is a Sociological term. Context is everything. As Nataleejah has said.

ThingsThatMakeYouGoHmmmmmmmmm · 08/11/2013 22:55

The underclass exists. Absolutely.

What do you think they should be referred to as, OP?

IHadADreamThatWasNotAllADream · 08/11/2013 22:58

Depends on her age absolutely. Age 5, YANBU. Age 14 - not so much, depends how it was taught.

LaurieFairyCake · 08/11/2013 23:01

I'd be more concerned she categorised you as underclass.

That's a bit judgemental Hmm

It's not descriptive unless you'd previously agreed between you that you were underclass

Original poster
Opalite · 08/11/2013 23:03

To be honest I don't feel a need to define myself as a class
Maybe I'm biased in this situation because I think the class system is a load of rubbish

This wasn't in a sociology lesson, it was in English funnily enough, DD said that while the teacher was describing something from the book they're reading, the conversation moved to the class system

OP posts:
scaevola · 08/11/2013 23:05

What age is DD and what's the book? Social context can be important in lit crit.

breatheslowly · 08/11/2013 23:06

English is full of sociology. What book are they reading?

Mumsyblouse · 08/11/2013 23:06

The idea of the underclass came about to distinguish those not in work/trapped in benefits dependency/marginalized from those who are traditionally working-class, as in working in blue-collar jobs.

I don't think we can judge whether this is reasonable til we know the context in which the teacher was teaching about class (what age is your dd?).

Why does your dd see you as underclass? She may have taken a more general statement about say benefits or unemployment and generalized it to your own situation (which may or may not include these things).

The term sounds pejorative because it contains the phrase 'under' so sounds like beneath, lesser than other classes. It is difficult to think of a more neutral term though (lower SES, Class V have the same issues).

DioneTheDiabolist · 08/11/2013 23:07

I think it's a bad adjective. I think something like Excluded or Separate would be better (I'm sure some other, more eloquent MNetters can put it better than me).

The "Underclass" kind of makes it sound as though they are just poorer, sadder and lazier than the other 3 classes. This is an incredibly limited view. The "underclass", be they illegal immigrants or 5th generation unemployed white UK born) can be wealthy, have principles rules, etc. It's just that they're not always the same as that of society as a whole.

WooWooOwl · 08/11/2013 23:12

Underclass isn't a nice word, but there needs to be some kind of a word that describes that group of people. It doesn't make sense to call people working class when they don't work.

I think it's great that schools teach things about the wider world rather than just academic stuff.

Mylovelyboy · 08/11/2013 23:13

OP you dont have to define yourself as any class. Its a load of old crap. Would anyone walk down the street and say 'oh look at those underclass people over there'. Its rubbish and very old fashioned. What did teacher mean by underclass, thats what i want to know. There are people that are poor, comfortable, rich and stinking rich. I would not call them a certain class.

LetsFaceTheMusicAndDance · 08/11/2013 23:32

If it was relevant to the text being studied yabu. I don't like the term either but it is a widely used one. I can't think of another. You can't really expect the teacher to adapt an accepted phrase to suit one person.

mellicauli · 08/11/2013 23:45

I was curious. And my googling found this from Uncle Tom's Cabin 1852:

"I tell you," said Augustine, "if there is anything that is revealed with the strength of a divine law in our times, it is that the masses are to rise, and the under class become the upper one."

So the "under" isn't as in below another class, more like oppressed by the property owning classes. Doesn't sound so bad now.

PurpleGirly · 09/11/2013 00:08

Oliver Twist, Animal Farm ... Two books I have taught today, both with an underclass.

graceholl · 09/11/2013 00:48

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Monty27 · 09/11/2013 00:55

Whatever it means to be neither working class, middle class, upper class or whatever, underclass is truly negative.

I would be very pissed off and having a word with your dd's 'english' teacher. Perhaps, under privileged or deprived, or those that have been forced to live in poverty may better suited to a lesson on classes. Angry

Mymumsfurcoat · 09/11/2013 01:30

Oh bollocks, there is an underclass and everyone knows it. So shoot the teacher for telling it as it is.

MrsLouisTheroux · 09/11/2013 01:40

I don't find it offensive.
There is an underclass and there is a social structure.

Philoslothy · 09/11/2013 01:50

I don't find it offensive and I come from the underclass.

Monty27 · 09/11/2013 01:53

No, I think its too negative. So there.

Mind you.... (philosophises) maybe its not such a bad term, as it explains just in itself that it's wrong. Confused

Who's going to send me to bed for overthinking? Grin

Original poster
Opalite · 09/11/2013 01:56

I just think it's very limiting and I don't think separating people into these classes can do or does any good at all
Also 'underclass' the clue is in the word 'under' and I don't think it gives the right message to the pupils in this lesson, surely they could have done without learning that
DD wasn't too happy about finding out that she was something that she didn't know she was if that makes sense
I think it's outdated but then I really don't think I'd mind if the teacher said something like 'some people use this class system' but she presented it as fact

OP posts: