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AIBU?

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Original poster

the company that owes dp money is going insolvent

31 replies

LEMisdisappointed · 22/10/2013 10:10

Sorry posted here for speed. Basically dp is owed 1k by old employers he was self employed. Going through process of sending final letter of action before making claim via small claims court. Checked address with company house and they are going through liquidation procedures. Argghhh owner now trading under different nsme but not limited company so now what do we do?

OP posts:
IamGluezilla · 22/10/2013 10:16

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

JennyPiccolo · 22/10/2013 10:16

I think you need to write it off. As far as I'm aware the chances of you getting it back are very slim. I'm no expert though, hopefully someone With more experience might have some more positive advice.

UC · 22/10/2013 10:26

Even if you file your claim, which you can do, and you win, you will still only be an unsecured creditor in the amount of your claim.

You should make sure that you file a proof of your claim (i.e. register your debt) for the 1k in the liquidation - regardless of whether you file a claim in the small claims court or not. Have you done this? If not, contact the liquidator to do so. You may not get much, but filing your proof with the liquidator costs you nothing.

You can only pursue the company your DP had the contract with, not the new entity the owner is now trading as.

PerpendicularVincentPrice · 22/10/2013 10:29

Is the company going into insolvency a ltd company? If not, he may be able to pursue the company directors individually for payment.

If it was, as a presumably unsecured creditor he has little protection and should just get in contact with the liquidator and register the debt. Any tax paid against it can then be claimed back.

However, employees wages are far higher up the pecking order for distribution of funds. If he could have been classed as one he has a chance.

I have some knowledge of this but am not an insolvency practitioner - i'd put this in legal.

Original poster
LEMisdisappointed · 22/10/2013 10:37

The plot thickens turns out that the company that is going insolvent isnt the one that owes dp same director same industrial estate different address weird ( small glimmer of hope)

OP posts:
Original poster
LEMisdisappointed · 22/10/2013 10:37

The plot thickens turns out that the company that is going insolvent isnt the one that owes dp same director same industrial estate different address weird ( small glimmer of hope)

OP posts:
HereComesHoneyBooBooDragon · 22/10/2013 10:40

Inform the insolvency company quick smart anyway.

We had this happen for £40k Sad, we lost our business as we refused to go down the same route! we even remortgaged to pay what owed our suppliers.

Original poster
LEMisdisappointed · 22/10/2013 10:40

Sat in citizens adv beareux waiting to see someone

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Original poster
LEMisdisappointed · 22/10/2013 10:43

Honey im so sorry to read this thats awful. 1k is still loads to us but 40k christ. The annoying thing is that this guy is an utter sheister and seems to have had a lot of companies. When dp had guys work for him we went without food one week to make sure they got their money

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HereComesHoneyBooBooDragon · 22/10/2013 10:51

The company in question was "sold" to the directors wives who "employed" the directors. There are some fuckers out there.

CAB will help. £1000 is a huge amount of money, make as loud a fuss as you can.

PerpendicularVincentPrice · 22/10/2013 11:01

Honey was it a prepack insolvency? That's rubbish, i'm really sorry.

LEM, let us know what the CAB say - I have advice to give but it depends on the set up of the company.

Original poster
LEMisdisappointed · 22/10/2013 11:06

Thanks guys will let you know

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turnaroundbrighteyes · 22/10/2013 11:10

Might be worth having a look on HMRC's employment status checker to make sure he really was self-employed rather than employed. If actually employed ie they dictated where, when and how he worked and the firm. He worked for also went insolvent it would have a higher priority and may be able to claim the outstanding wages from the government if the liquidator doesn't have the funds. Definitely worth talking to the insolvency practitioner in any case.

HereComesHoneyBooBooDragon · 22/10/2013 16:56

How did it go at CAB?

Vincent, yes it was Angry

tablefor4 · 22/10/2013 17:04
  1. DP can only claim against the company which contracted with him. If they are not in a process then you can continue, although be aware that if a related company failed then all the companies might be on edge.
  1. If the contracting company goes into admin/liq then a) file a proof of claim with the liquidator/administrator. It's free and easy. b) look at the HMRC site suggested/talk to the officeholder to see if DP's claim might be an employee claim which gives it a higher place in the order of pay-outs.
  1. Generally - and to Honey - if you suspect shading dealings you can report it to the Insolvency Service's hotline here
Original poster
LEMisdisappointed · 22/10/2013 17:18

OK, so it turns out that the company isn't going into liquidation and is still registered with companies house. He had another company with a very siimilar name (almost tempted to name and shame but wont) at the same address that is in the process of being liquidated. "forced windup"?

Have checked which company has paid DP and thankfully the cheques are from the non liquidated company. So am going to send a "letter before action" tomorrow, giving him a week then we will claim through the small claims court.

I am incredulous that people can wind up a company leaving creditors unpaid (he has done this before to others) and just start up again under a slightly different name. I don't know if we will get our money but im going to be a thorn in his side for a fair while!

CAB also said to write to trading standards, not to get monies back but because of te two similarly named companies. Never mind a THIRD set up as a sole trader! The other week when we tried to contact him the girl on the office said he was away on holiday Angry

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Original poster
LEMisdisappointed · 22/10/2013 17:19

table, it was definately a self employed basis under the construction industry scheme, DP registered as self employed

OP posts:
UC · 22/10/2013 17:48

You are not supposed to liquidate one company and then start another with the same or a similar name, unless you jump through several legal hoops - doing this is an abuse of the process, and is prohibited by law. But it doesn't stop some unscrupulous people doing it...

If you think this is going on, report to the Insolvency Service, as someone said upthread.

HereComesHoneyBooBooDragon · 22/10/2013 18:07

Too late for us, it was years ago. We got our own back though Grin

PerpendicularVincentPrice · 22/10/2013 18:07

Honey, I hate prepacks, they were designed to encourage small businesses to keep trading but in the meantime affect people like yourself who are trying to trade honestly but then end up losing out.

LEM, that's good news. If the co isn't ltd remember you may be able to go after the director's personal assets. For a debt over £750 you can also petition for their bankruptcy.

HereComesHoneyBooBooDragon · 22/10/2013 18:10

Yup, it was in 2003, it started, right after they changed everything.

HereComesHoneyBooBooDragon · 22/10/2013 18:11

I did later get my revenge Grin

PerpendicularVincentPrice · 22/10/2013 18:13

Honey I need to know more Grin.

kim147 · 22/10/2013 18:15

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

HereComesHoneyBooBooDragon · 22/10/2013 18:51

Pm'd you Vincent, it's not suitable for the boards