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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To ask if parents support a longer school day?

198 replies

namechangingf123 · 17/10/2013 22:56

As Michael Gove is proposing? Would it help you as a working parent?

How long would suit you/your child? And if you didn't agree with longer day (as I don't) would you/could you just pick DC up at 3.15ish as usual?

OP posts:
Crowler · 18/10/2013 22:56

No, no, no.

I think the wrap-around care should aim to create a homey environment - snacks, toys, couches, and possibly some screens? It kills me to think of a 5 year old in school for more than 7 hours. No way.

Spikeytree · 18/10/2013 22:56

I think it is as short as it can be to fit in what we have to do.

manicinsomniac · 18/10/2013 22:58

They would learn just fine spikeytree. How old are these kids? We have 7-8 year olds learning sciencefrom 3.30-4.40. After half term I will have double English at that time for Y5, Y6 and Y7. Our top sets are achieving 2-3 years ahead of national curriculum standards. Our bottom sets are working successfully towards the targets on their IEPs.

Maybe it's becuase they don't know any different but we do have children coming into the school at all ages and they settle quickly and easily into the longer routines.

I think we are too quick to underestimate children's capacity for learning. It's fine not to want it and prefer to do other things but it isn't right to say the children couldn't handle it. Thousands of children from age 7 up do this every day of the term.

Spikeytree · 18/10/2013 23:04

If you can, in a meaningful way, teach imperialism and militarism to bottom set year 9s (some of whom cannot read) at 4.30 in the dark in a mobile classroom in the woods then you are a better teacher than I can claim to be. 10 years teaching tells me that 6 different lessons in a day is enough. The children can walk up to a 1/4 of a mile between rooms 6 times a day. Your day is broken up with sport and prep, very different to the average secondary school in a deprived area.

manicinsomniac · 18/10/2013 23:19

I agree that all the differing variables that we have as teachers probably account for the difference in opinion.

I can do poetry analysis with bottom set year 8s (all of whom can read but some 5-6 years below chronological age) at that time in a normal classroom next to the woods (closest I can get to your situation!! Grin) - and sadly, I have to admit I'm a pretty average teacher. But yes, these children are not deprived and they have come straight from the sports field.

I wonder if the key difference is that my biggest class is 18 this year and we never go beyond 20. Maybe it is possible to teach even young or low ability children late in the afternoon but only when they have a small, nurturing environment and know they're going home (or to the boarding floor in many of our cases) to TLC and security.

I admit I have no idea what it's like to teach in a deprived secondary and you couldn't pay me enough to try it out - every respect!

Spikeytree · 18/10/2013 23:24

33 year 9s with the highest reading age being 8.6. They are tried, grumpy and hate each other by 3.15 when the bell goes. I need to lie down in a darkened stock room for 10 minutes when they leave.

Thinking about this, when would I do my detentions, catch-up lessons for kids who had been absent, one-to-one mentoring of sixth-formers etc? I can't see any kids being able to stay after 5.30 for all of this.

Nonie241419 · 18/10/2013 23:28

I'm a teacher and a parent. Neither of my school aged DC could cope with formal lessons for longer than they already do.
As a teacher, having to plan for, resource, teach and then mark/assess another 2-3 hours of lessons a day would tip me over the edge physically. I'm only contractually employed for 2 days a week, but the only day of the week I do no work is Saturday. An average term time week sees me work around 30 hours. I'm paid for 13. I can't give anymore of myself to this job, despite the fact I love teaching.

ringaringarosy · 18/10/2013 23:33

i think the school day is too long already for primary children.I can see the point of longer days maybe for the last couple of years for secondary though.

manicinsomniac · 18/10/2013 23:41

spikey - another private/state and middle/secondary difference I suspect - we have no detentions, children are expected to catch up in their free time and we have all evening to mentor boarders (I had an impromptu study one to one at 8.30 tonight and a pastoral session at 9.15) so it's much easier to fit in day children as and when. I apologise for not really thinking about how much harder tricky urban secondaries must have it.

SingingSands · 18/10/2013 23:48

Not read the whole thread, so not sure if already mentioned, but a longer school day in winter would mean kids coming out of school when it was dark...

cory · 19/10/2013 00:05

Coming out of school when it is dark doesn't have to be a massive problem: they do that all the time in Scandinavia.

Coming out too late to spend time with your family, play with your friends, go to the park, do activities that are not on offer at school (such as ballet), visit the local library (state school libraries tend to be very small) and learn whatever your parents might be able to teach you seems more of a loss.

Coupon · 19/10/2013 00:15

I think it's a bad idea. The day is long enough as it is.

Iaintdunnuffink · 19/10/2013 00:17

If we're talking extending the school day to 6pm, and restructuring the school day completely , I would be interested. Which would include different outdoor, or practical activities with completely different groups.

Extending the day to 4, or, 5 wouldn't help that many parents? They'd still need out of school care. It wouldn't make it cheaper, after school clubs would need to bump up the prices or cover their costs.

The one benefit of my youngest son going to after school club is that, despite finding it tiring, it's down time with a completely different set of kids. If he's had problems with class mates, they're not going to follow him past 3.15. At his after school club there is a different style of care.

SingingSands · 19/10/2013 00:19

This is not Scandinavia. Coming home in the dark in the UK means more road accidents, more opportunities for trouble, no time for half an hour playing in the park, kicking a ball about on the rec, walking the dog by themselves etc.

ScarerStratton · 19/10/2013 00:20

We have the complete opposite.

DD2's school has just restructured their day. They now start at 8.40am, have shortened breaks and lunch, and finish the day at 3pm.

It is bliss. She's home just as the other schools are finishing, we have more time together in the evening, and she finds it much better for homework and revision.

farewellfarewell · 19/10/2013 00:26

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

70isaLimitNotaTarget · 19/10/2013 00:28

Visualises the road near the Primary/Junior School at 8.30 - 9.00 then again at 2.50 - 3.30.

Visualises the same road at 5.00-5.30 when the people who live there come home.

Combine the two sets of traffic.

cory · 19/10/2013 00:50

Yes, you're probably right, SingingSands.

unlucky83 · 19/10/2013 01:07

I think I support it - if it is more or less the same amount of learning spread out throughout the day ...
Can't see the difference between a child in childcare 8 -6 (with school in the middle) and one learning the same amount of stuff but spread out more with extra PE, Music, Drama and playtime and rest...
Mixing with other children - IME most CMs/after school clubs have children from the same school anyway...
In Scotland - I know DD1's High school are struggling to fit all the compulsory stuff in the Curriculum for Excellence (Home Ec, PE, Social history, Social studies, Business studies etc) along with require no of hours of Maths, English etc - At the end of first year my DD1 has had to give up geography, history, music - so she can do 2 Sciences and Art and Drama...
They have shortened lessons, lunch and breaks -and finish 10 mins later... (so 8.50 - 3.20) - the whole day is more frenetic..
Guess the biggest problem for them is 60% of the children are bussed in - leaving at 8am, return just after 4...so it would be late back...
But there are after school activities - the late bus doesn't get them home until 6 ... my DD won't do any - mainly because of not wanting to be on her own on the bus - but if school was longer with less homework and some of these activities compulsory.....
Actually the primary school too was puzzling over how to fit all the compulsory PE time (which I think is important) so maybe they would be better with a longer more relaxed day...
As for people saying their child is 4 and would struggle - my DD1 was in nursery from 3 months - 9am-6pm every day -when she started school at 4 she was absolutely fine ...guess she was just used to to it? Hmm
But then DD2 (I'm now a SAHM) was also fine at 4 - wasn't exhausted at all after school...

Ragwort · 19/10/2013 08:05

unlucky - I too have never known my child to be 'tired' after a day at school Hmm - I wish !! He has always had bags of energy - and was more than ready for after school activities even from his play-group days Grin. Who are these children who get 'tired'?

Xoanon · 19/10/2013 08:20

unlucky Maybe in your experience most kids mix with the same kids at after school clubs - but then, you say your child doesn't do after school clubs. So how could you possibly have any experience? My kids all do drama outside school and one of them does a load of dance. All 3 of them are in different classes at the drama group and they have all been going since they were 4 (they are now 15, 13 and 10). They mix with kids from every school in the 'city' where we leave and from the outside villages. Not just the state schools either, the posh schools too. My two younger children's best friends are both kids they know from drama (and ballet) - one of them goes to the poshest school in the area, the other one went to a different primary school to my DS but they are now at the same secondary school (he's a year older though). When DS moved up to his secondary school, he knew kids in every year as a result of the drama group. The dance school is the same - kids from every school, no distinction between posh and state. It would be outrageous to lose that sort of activity - and there is no way it could all be fitted in on the weekend, their weekends are already full - existing classes, ballet exam classes, rehearsals for shows...

As far as music goes, in our area not all county or city or regional groups meet on a weekend, for starters. Sme meet during the week. Music provision in state schools is patchy in our area so many parents have to source some or all tuition outside school - typically that doesn't happen on a weekend but on a school night. Extending the school day would kill all of that.

SirChenjin · 19/10/2013 08:29

Who are all these parents who can take their children to after school clubs?? Most of the parents I know are WOHM and don't ie can't take their DCs to afterschool activities, so is it a case of most of the parents who don't support this are the ones who don't WOHM? And as for the "they'll be too tired" - really? Children across the world go to nursery from 8am-6pm from an early age and mange just fine.

Xoanon · 19/10/2013 08:33

SirChenjen I work outside the home. In fact, I sometimes work very far outside the home. This week I was working about 200 miles outside my home for two of the days. I'm not a single parent though and my DH's hours enable him to do the after school stuff.

SirChenjin · 19/10/2013 08:34

In which case, you're very lucky - not many people have hours which fit around school hours.

Ragwort · 19/10/2013 08:34

I guess it depends on your circle of friends/acquaintances SirChenjin - where I live there are a lot of SAHPs & parents who work part time so the after school clubs and activities are well supported - I should know as I run one (as a volunteer Grin).

Just to clarify, I am a SAHM but I support a longer school day Grin.