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Original poster

To recommend all sahms who might have another baby register as self employed...

157 replies

sillyoldfool · 15/10/2013 15:19

...and pay their class 2 national insurance contributions?

If you register, and pay your NI you're entitled to the full amount of maternity allowance (£137 a week for 9 months) it doesn't matter how much, if anything, you earn. The NI contributions are less than £2 a week. If you pay them for 2 years you'll get the full amount back within a couple of weeks of MA.
So register, sell a couple of bits on test or similar, do a tax return once a year (very simple if you're not earning much) and then claim MA.

OP posts:
Original poster
sillyoldfool · 15/10/2013 17:35

Yes you have to be registered as SE, as I stated.

I am registered as SE, I pay class 2 NI. I have been asked for no other proof of income. I have in front of me the letter saying I am entitled to the full MA amount.

It's really desperately unclear in all the information, probably because it's a loophole they'd rather people didn't exploit, but it is true.

OP posts:
Original poster
sillyoldfool · 15/10/2013 17:37

Again "If you
-are registered as self-employed, and
-have paid class 2 NI contributions, and
-do not hold a small earnings exemption certificate
you will be treated as having enough weekly earnings to result in the standard rate of MA for any week covered by that Class 2 NI contribution"

If you hold a small earnings exemption you will be classed as having earnt £30 a week for each week you hold the certificate.

OP posts:
Original poster
sillyoldfool · 15/10/2013 17:51

Anyway, look into it if you think it might help you, I'm stepping away now before I get blamed for causing the deficit or something...

OP posts:
DoJo · 15/10/2013 17:51

sillyoldfool
You keep quoting that section, but it is just one small part of the requirements for entitlement to Maternity Allowance and is usually preceded by the words You might get MA if: which is all important.

You may have 'got away with it' but it certainly doesn't mean that anybody else will necessarily (I know for a fact that my tax return was specifically checked when I applied for MA as I had to go through it with someone over the phone). So whilst it may be possible for others to get MA when they aren't strictly entitled to it, it should not be assumed that everyone will.

Bragadocia · 15/10/2013 17:57

sillyoldfool is really and truly correct. One registers as self employed, pays the NI class 2s, and you get the MA payment in full without having to prove earnings.
Which was fortunate for me, as I'd earned about £100 freelancing in the year preceding my son's birth! But I had been paying my NIs because I'd researched all this long before I was pregnant. Therefore, I got the full entitlement.

skyeskyeskye · 15/10/2013 17:59

There does seem to be some very conflicting information out there, with the Government's own websites, DWP and Gov.uk saying completely opposite things.....

Original poster
sillyoldfool · 15/10/2013 18:00

But it's not preceded by might in he booklet you get with the form. I'm quoting that because that is what it says in the booklet about SE entitlement and how it's judged.

If you download the actual form the info booklet is there too and is much more specific than the info on the general website.

Anyways, as i said, before I'm told I'm a scrounged or similar I'm off!

OP posts:
SpookyPumpkins · 15/10/2013 18:04

Skyeskyeskye- sorry but you are wrong. It does work, I've done it myself! Morally wrong, probably. Would I do anything for my family? Yes!

skyeskyeskye · 15/10/2013 18:04

I am prepared to eat my hat if I have posted incorrectly, but as I just posted above, the Government's own websites, including HMRC as well, are all saying different things.

So, if it is correct, please get proper advice from an accountant and make sure that you register long before you are pregnant as you won't qualify for too much once you are pregnant as it is worked out over a set number of weeks.

plus due to Universal Credit - HMRC are going to be stamping down on anybody who is self employed and doesn't actually make any money as they want to stop people using it as a way of getting tax credits.

skyeskyeskye · 15/10/2013 18:08

Taken from DWP website:

If you are self-employed proof of earnings are not required to establish the rate of MA. However, on receipt of your MA1 claim form Jobcentre Plus will check with HM Revenue & Customs to see if you have been registered as self-employed and/or whether Class 2 NI contributions have been paid or if a small earnings exception certificate is in place.

AND

If you have paid Class 2 NI contributions at the end of each week in your 13 week earnings period, you will be treated as having enough earnings to receive standard rate MA.

If you hold a small earnings exception for at least 13 weeks in your test period and you have no other earnings you will be treated as having earnings of £30 a week (equal to the MAT) and receive a weekly rate of MA of £27.00 (90 per cent of the MAT).

AND from NIDirect.gov.uk

You might get Maternity Allowance if:

you're employed, but not eligible for Statutory Maternity Pay
you're registered self-employed and paying Class 2 National Insurance Contributions (NICs), or hold a Small Earnings Exception certificate
you have very recently been employed or self-employed
You may be eligible if:

you've been employed and/or self-employed for at least 26 weeks of the 'test period' (66 weeks up to and including the week before your baby is due) - part weeks count as full weeks
you earned £30 a week averaged over any 13 weeks in your test period

candycoatedwaterdrops · 15/10/2013 18:09

As long as you're not the same people who complain about the big companies not paying their fair share of tax..............

ILetHimKeep20Quid · 15/10/2013 18:17

All very well if you are actually self employed and aren't turning over much. But totally out if order to encourage sahm's, who have chosen not to work, to pretend they do work to claim a benefit.

daisychain01 · 15/10/2013 18:20

Exactly, candy, and amazing people seem to know all the ins and outs and whatevers, its all the same to me - if you encourage people to register as SE with the motivation of getting something for that act, and not due to real entitlement, its no different than the fat cats who play the system.

They have their fancy expensive tax experts. The rest have crap advice on MN that tries to make out they are giving people good advice (which is a mascarade for something less than honourable.

It made me cringe reading it, maybe just very ill advised wording, but not nice.

daisychain01 · 15/10/2013 18:23

So register, sell a couple of bits on test or similar, do a tax return once a year (very simple if you're not earning much) and then claim MA

AKA cheating

Bragadocia · 15/10/2013 18:23

But SAHMs might well have paid a significant amount of their 'fair share' in tax and NI for many years of their working lives; just possibly not in the period of time preceding a pregnancy. Doesn't make them morally the same as tax avoiding corporations.

dreamingbohemian · 15/10/2013 18:30

People also need to be aware that MA counts as income if you're on housing benefit, so you don't want to screw yourself over there

PedlarsSpanner · 15/10/2013 18:49

Also the tax office has to accept your 'self employment' iirc there are quite strict criteria as to what constitutes being self employed

Folks, do tread carefully, do your homework first

cashmiriana · 15/10/2013 19:10

When I was expecting DD2 I cut my hours as a freelancer (self-employed) due to bad SPD. From the 6th month of my pregnancy I was earning £90 per week from a regular client, and had given my other clients (all charities) up. Prior to that my income had been around £200 - £250 per week.

Because I had paid my NI contributions I received the £100 MA for 26 weeks. I actually rang them up and queried it and had a letter to confirm my entitlement.

juneybean · 15/10/2013 19:12

What happens if you're employed and also self employed so pay two lots of NICs? Do you get SMP and MA?

ILetHimKeep20Quid · 15/10/2013 19:16

But it's only the time in question that counts! Bloody hell, ni isn't your personal trust fund.

Oceansurf · 15/10/2013 19:19

Hmm. This is interesting. I'm working for an agency at the moment, so I'm a 'worker' as opposed to an 'employee'

Would it be worth registering as self employed as well? As a second job I mean? I don't work full time, just p/t. Really worried that I won't be entitled to MA...Hmm

skyeskyeskye · 15/10/2013 19:19

you can't claim both, you only get maternity allowance if you are not entitled to SMP. So if you don't earn enough to get SMP then you may be able to get a small amount of MA.

wandymum · 15/10/2013 19:47

OP is right. I had MA twice as I'm self-employed. I was earning more than the minimum but no-one ever checked. They just take the fact that you're paying class 2s (which you wouldn't have to if you were earning under the threshold) as proof.

They can't have checked it against my tax return as the MA test period would have been after the period covered by my last tax return.

whois · 15/10/2013 20:07

Someone to do this as a SAHM with no real business or intention to make money from their business is exactly the same as someone fiddling benefits and saying they have split from their DP when they haven't in order to get more benefits.

Or the super rich exploring a legal tax loophole and doing complicated structured transactions to get out of paying tax.

skyeskyeskye · 15/10/2013 20:37

It is meant to cover loss of earnings and people who choose not to work and stay at home, have no earnings so I tend to agree that it would be wrong to register as self employed just to get maternity pay. If you are getting by without that income when not pregnant then you don't need it when you are pregnant.

People who are genuinely self employed are entitled to it as they don't get SMP.

It may be a legal loophole but morally it is wrong.