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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to expect action from my manager?

64 replies

howmuchwouldyoutake · 14/10/2013 21:52

I've name changed for obvious reasons. I'm having some problems at work and am after some impartial advice.

I work in a local FE college. A student in my class (male, 17 years old) was messing with his phone and had headphones in in a lesson. As soon as i noticed i asked him to turn it off. He told me to wait until he'd finished listening to a song. I asked again, stated that he knew the rules etc. He shouted 'fuck off you stupid bitch, I've told you to wait' i was shocked - had never had an issue before with him...

I asked him to leave, he refused and carried on swearing and calling me names so i called security. Security turned up along with a manager. Student told the security guards and manager to fuck off etc.

As he was escorted off he said that he was going to find me and kill me.

Manager wants to bring the student back tomorrow after a 2 day suspension with a verbal warning.

What would you expect from manager? I don't think it's an appropriate punishment.

OP posts:
CharityFunDay · 14/10/2013 22:39

I'd go with the police route myself. 'Threats to kill' is a serious offence, with a ten-year maximum sentence. Even if nothing comes of it (and it probably won't) it might make the gobby little shit think twice in future.

Original poster
howmuchwouldyoutake · 14/10/2013 22:39

Sorry punt, I've changed some bits (not what happened, just person details which is why it might seem vague) because i know that people from work could possibly see it.

I'm not trying to mislead. You couldn't make up what happens in our department - we're not a PRU but have students who've been excluded from schools etc but normal college class sizes etc

OP posts:
Chippednailvarnish · 14/10/2013 22:42

What would happen if you refused to teach him on the grounds of fearing for your own safety?

BlameItOnTheBogey · 14/10/2013 22:42

At an absolute bare minimum, he should be made to apologise to you before he is let back in class. But I think you should have the final say on whether you feel safe at work with him back. If not, your manager needs to take steps to protect you.

Original poster
howmuchwouldyoutake · 14/10/2013 22:43

Imperial - the 6 week financial rule was part of my argument... BUT we're under student target numbers...

Yes, I'm expected to get him through a GCSE science resit.

OP posts:
Wolfiefan · 14/10/2013 22:46

What does your union say? I'd call police or ask to be signed off with stress if you are asked to have this student back. Angry? Fine. Threatening to get a knife and stab a teacher? Criminal offence.

ImperialBlether · 14/10/2013 22:50

Frankly it doesn't sound as though he's going to pass - it doesn't even sound as though he'd complete the course. Your manager's role is to keep you safe as well as to boost student numbers.

I would go to personnel and get them involved. They are safe up in their offices though and would wet themselves if someone threatened to kill them.

Original poster
howmuchwouldyoutake · 14/10/2013 23:14

I've not been to the union yet (it sounds ridiculous but the whole department is so overworked, understaffed and, if I'm honest down trodden that there is a blur on what we've all put up with. Every member of staff has been verbally abused at some point this year.

I think that's why I've asked for clarity here as to what people find acceptable. Everyone is looking for other jobs and the sickness levels are through the roof (which is why i don't want to go sick - more pressure on my colleagues) although i just wanted to go home today.

We don't even have a manager based in our building so there is literally no support.

OP posts:
Custardo · 14/10/2013 23:19

go to your union for fucks sake

imagine i work in oooh.... let's make it waitrose and a 17 year old was being abusive and said they would find me and kill me

what next?

i think education is a fucking privilege. if hes too fucked up for whatever desperatley sad sad reason, then bringing him back and forcing him to be there isn't going to work.

If the student numbers are low, that isn't your fault, there are some serious mismanagement issues that have nothing to do with teaching and more to do with PR and marketing

Original poster
howmuchwouldyoutake · 14/10/2013 23:22

Custardo - please come with me to meet my manager!
I know how pathetic i sound - i used to be balshy as fuck... I need a new job, this one is killing my self esteem.

OP posts:
puntasticusername · 14/10/2013 23:30

Thanks and sympathy op. It sounds horrible.

quoteunquote · 14/10/2013 23:36

Go to your union,

and in the mean time request in writing that a security guard is in the classroom at all times this 17 year old is in the same space as you.

TrueStory · 14/10/2013 23:36

It makes me angry that this kind of liberal bollox is going on in schools. The politics of it all sound awful too.

But meanwhile, you have been verbally insulted and physically threatened. No-one deserves to take that in any job. Time to get your ballsiness back? I would report it to the police, as a matter of course. It also strengthens your position in your job and your position re. employment rights.

Custardo · 14/10/2013 23:41

its not you - it's them. if not your own safety - then you have a duty of care to the kids in your class - that's the way i would go.

i'll be your union rep

strike
strike
strike
:)

cumfy · 15/10/2013 00:29

17 ?

Just remove him.

Nobody is or should be obliged to teach this criminal.

Wibblypiglikesbananas · 15/10/2013 01:00

Agree with everyone who's saying speak to your union.

Get signed off sick with stress. You shouldn't have to be put in this position.

Original poster
howmuchwouldyoutake · 15/10/2013 07:57

Thanks everyone - I'm going to ring the union today. I think that, especially as we have no management presence in the building (180+ students with just teaching and support staff) we're particularly vulnerable. Our building is also quite secluded from the rest of the campus and quite far from the security office.

I know i come across as a wimp, I've always been the outspoken one at meetings etc but nothing gets done so we've kind of stopped asking.

Thanks again - I'm at work with a slightly less tight knot in my chest today :-)

OP posts:
hettienne · 15/10/2013 08:02

I wouldn't have him back in my class. He isn't 12, he's 17 - pretty much an adult - and needs to know that death threats isn't something that is forgotten in a couple of days.

Laurel1979 · 15/10/2013 08:09

That sounds horrendous. In my line of work as a GP if a patient made threats to kill that would automatically result in police involvement and the patient being off-listed, I don't see why you should have to put up with it. I wouldn't go off sick with stress however as another poster suggested. I get asked to write sick certs all the time for disputes like this, and unfortunately it's well known that at least 50% of these cases result in the employee being dismissed eventually.

cashmiriana · 15/10/2013 08:49

Union.
Document - email to manager asking what has been put in place, containing all the relevant info (and BCC to a personal email address)
Escalate to manager's manager / head of faculty / head of college as necessary.

I feel for you. My DH also works in FE. It's all about retention rates, regardless of what happens to the staff in the classrooms.

Original poster
howmuchwouldyoutake · 15/10/2013 14:09

Thanks so much everyone - I've emailed a formal complaint to my Managers boss and I'm waiting for a call back from the Union. I really appreciate the advice and validation - it's amazing that abuse becomes normalised for us the longer we put up with it. I've got my balls back ;)

OP posts:
cumfy · 15/10/2013 16:47

That's great.

I would still make a report to the police; you can always withdraw your wish to prosecute at a later stage.

It will also mean they would be taking a statement from the manager, which may "concentrate minds" Wink.

Blissx · 15/10/2013 17:00

I would agree with jack365, up until this lad threatened to find and kill you. I therefore agree he should be kicked out. At the very least, he should be accompanied by someone else in each of your lessons or removed from your lessons completely. However, I know that this will not happen as this lad is worth too much money to the FE college. So sorry you experienced this. It is the part of the job that I hate.

ImperialBlether · 15/10/2013 20:36

This is a kind of "Welcome to FE" thread, tbh. This is what it's like. All of the income and therefore the jobs depend on student numbers. The OP's managers will be trying to keep as many students in college but they are clearly doing this by keeping out of the way themselves.

In fact the OP's manager got sworn at in this situation, but knew she could escape. It's disgraceful that lecturers are sacrificed like this.

Original poster
howmuchwouldyoutake · 15/10/2013 21:34

Too true Imperial. The managers are based a 10 minute walk away so have no idea what the 'front line' is like.

My complaint to managers manager fell on deaf ears - the response was turned round to me - asking if i had followed the initial disciplinary procedure (basically a 'contract' for students to sign saying they'll behave issued for low level stuff)

My answer was that i wasn't able to as the student was irate, threatening to kill me and was being escorted off by security'

Ffs - sometimes policy doesn't quite fit! I think i'd still be expected to give a low level disciplinary if the student had attacked me and i was lay bleeding!

OP posts: