To ask MN to ban the term "slut shaming"?

[BratinghamPalace]

That really, for obvious reasons. Have just been reading the Sinead o Connor/Miley Cyrus thread. (Will be gone for a while and check back later).

Is it really being used by misogynists to mean the opposite. I don't think so, but it is being used in a way that doesn't ALWAYS make clear that the term is pejorative to the shamer and not the subject deemed to be a slut.

For example there was a quite widely circulated blog post by a Christian mother of teenage sons angry with teenage girls for posting naked pictures in Twitter/Facebook. It was referred to as a "slut shaming" piece. It was simply a woman hating piece.

YABU

Please cease your shame shaming.

I think that you will find it gaining more and more traction against the subject.

Well that article sounds both slut-shaming and women-hating. Do you mean the people who wrote the blog called it slut-shaming, not realising what they were saying?

Miley Cyrus looked a total mess, she knew she looked awful and she knew how much publicity she'd get.

So let's all shut up and leave her too it and talk about some one worth the effort.

No, other commentators referred to the piece as slut shaming. I think, used correctly, the term "slut shaming" is for when you are making a negative comment on the shamer. These pieces were not all making negative comments on the shamer, some were simply highlighting the blog post and others were supportive of this mothers views.

Yes, absolutely, it's a negative term about the "shamer". I've generally seen it used to refer to articles/attitudes rather than people though. But I'd say it was used correctly in your example, that post does sound like a classic example of slut shaming.

This is the first time I have even heard it! So, rather than banning it, you are promoting it!

Sorry, yes, I mean the blog post WAS "slut shaming", but the commentators were not correctly referencing it as such because they referred to it as a slut shaming article when in fact they were agreeing that the girls in question were sluts. They were using "slut shaming" as a literal (in their eyes) term.

Hand I think that is where the phrase will come a cropper if feminists are trying to claim it. Far too many people will think of it as "shaming a slut" in order for it to work as a way for feminists to shame the shamer.

Sadly, until the word slut is demonised, slut shaming will be on the same shelf as Fraping, so slightly unfortunate but basically ok.

P.S: I don't agree that all women who self-identify as "sluts" have esteem issues. There is a book called "The ethical slut" (I think it's a book) and a feminist movement surrounding it.

BratinghamPalace I find slut-shaming a useful term for explaining some mygonistic actions/language to others, who haven't really thought about why their opinion is anti-woman. I don't think woman-shaming does convey the same meaning. It is a useful piece of language, and I will continue to use it until someone comes up with a useful alternative that conveys exactly the same concept.

I do think people misuse the term, but that is all the more reason to explain it to people.

What would you think was a reasonable alternative?

OK maybe the word slut has not been reclaimed yet...

Jessie I know that there is a movement to reclaim it, I meant that a woman who refers to herself as a slut in the negative, widely socially accepted way :(

Bogeyface Ah, I see. I thought you might have seen an ethical slut using it without context.

Yes, accepting the standard meaning and applying it to oneself is really sad.

SLOW (ment to be bold and not a shout) I wish I had an alternative! I agree that we need something. Try an experiment; ask the next 20 people you meet if they have heard the expression and what it means. I just did on the school run (abroad in English speaking country). Everyone has heard of it and they ALL GOT IT WRONG. And they are an educated bunch. We need something for sure, but just not this. Funny though ( am rambling now) it is almost exactly what we don't need - more confusion about what misogyny is!

I agree that the term uses an abusive word to describe the victims of the action it addresses. One of those complex linguistic things. Nothing wrong with having the qualities sometimes described as "sluttish" in modern parlance. All power to your elbow if you do. Fair play if you want to call yourself a slut ( I havent met anyone who does, but great if the word is reclaimed). But, because of the context, a hideous thing to call others. Using it to describe the actions of woman haters just seems over complex and inviting misinterpretation.

Using it to describe the actions of woman haters just seems over complex and inviting misinterpretation.

After much reading here and Googling, I have to say that I agree with this. It is almost handing a new weapon to the mysoginists.

Neontetra- exactly.

Bogey- exactly.