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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think that carers for a person with dementia should not be allowed to accept gifts from that person?

50 replies

MrsSchadenfreude · 03/09/2013 22:45

A close relative of mine is receiving private care in his own home. His daughter, Z, left a meal she had cooked in the fridge, for both of them to eat when she came to visit him after work. The meal had gone when she got in, and he said that he had given it to his carer. Z then looked further, and a lot of the food in the freezer had gone as well (we are talking joints of meat, steak, lobster - not value fish fingers). My relative said he had given this to his carer too. Z called the woman, who confirmed that this was the case. Z is very upset about this, and does not think that the carer should be allowed to accept gifts from someone she is caring for, who has Alzheimers. OK, it is only food, but what if he has gifted her anything else, like the family jewels? Z said to me that she would like to complain, but then again, thinks "oh it's only food" and the care organisation might think she is causing a fuss unnecessarily, particularly as the family aren't short of cash. I think the carer is on dodgy ground, making herself vulnerable - what if my relative gives her something, then forgets, and accuses her of stealing it?

OP posts:
MammaTJ · 04/09/2013 18:33

Really Sock? So even from clients who have carers for physical needs - they can't accept a gift?

Yes, that is correct, because even people who only need physical care are vulnerable and to a degree 'in the power of the carer' and may feel they need to bribe them for good care. Accepting gifts reinforces that feeling and the feeling of vulnerablility.

LeoandBoosmum · 04/09/2013 18:40

Abuse. Those with dementia lack capacity.They can't make autonomous decisions, sadly. The carer must be aware of the wrongness of their actions.

IneedAsockamnesty · 04/09/2013 18:55

Really Sock? So even from clients who have carers for physical needs - they can't accept a gift?

Yep, at Christmas time things defined as tokens (actually have an acceptable list like pictures drawn by the child or a photo of the child and carer without a paid for photoframe) are just about acceptable but nothing of any monetary value even a small box a cheap chocs are acceptable

IneedAsockamnesty · 04/09/2013 18:55

Meant NOT acceptable

IneedAsockamnesty · 04/09/2013 18:56

Ahhhhhh the chocs are not acceptable

BrokenSunglasses · 04/09/2013 19:01

They definitely shouldn't be accepting gifts.

It's sad that it has to be that way though, for everyone involved.

Turniptwirl · 04/09/2013 19:09

Any agency should have a policy about gifts. And I suspect that it will be they're not allowed, certainly not anything of more than nominal value and anything should be declared. My work has a policy that we all undergo training on even though it never comes up for all but the senior managers. The only gifts I've heard of us "plebs" getting is a box of chocs or biscuits from a grateful client. An organisation responsible for caring for vulnerable people in their homes on a 1:1 basis has even more reason to have a strict policy.

SPBisResisting · 04/09/2013 19:12

yes that makes sense. If you don't get the right gift and annoy them then they'll take it out on you.
(Obviously I know the vast majority of carers wouldn't biut I can see the thought process when you are reliant on another)

MammaTJ · 04/09/2013 19:39

Yes! One of our ladies is terribly kind! When a carer takes her shopping she always constantly offers to buy gifts! She has not got dementia, knows what she is doing but I feel the motives are to 'protect' herself as she feels vulnerable relying on care!

SPBisResisting · 04/09/2013 19:42

so sad but totally understandable

McNewPants2013 · 04/09/2013 19:50

Can a gift be accepted if it's from the family and not the person who needs the care.

I think Z should complain, because there is a difference to a Thank-you card and a small box of cheap chocolate ( that even i think shouldn't be accepted due to how vulnerable these people are) to taking food out of the freezer.

JoinYourPlayfellows · 04/09/2013 19:59

I would really not be happy to have an old man with Alzheimer's being cared for alone in his home with the kind of person who would remove food from his freezer.

The lack of judgement necessary to accept that kind of "gift" from someone with dementia would really worry me.

I understand that the fact that he likes means you are kind of over a barrel, but I think he needs to be protected from this woman.

Listentomum · 04/09/2013 20:03

I would call the police TBF

neepsandtatties · 04/09/2013 20:37

Can a gift be accepted if it's from the family and not the person who needs the care.

In my experience, not easily! When my Grandma with dementia eventually went into a nursing home, my parents wanted to give a thank you cash gift (£200) to the fabulous carer who had looked after her in her home. They asked the agency how to go about it, and they said it would be against their policies, but came up with a solution where my parents gave the money to the agency's nominated charity (a dementia charity I think) and then the agency gave the carer a one-off 'bonus' to the same value, through their bonus scheme.

iliketea · 04/09/2013 22:54

To be fair re: gifts, it's reasonably common (IME) for family members or clients with mental capacity to give small gifts (like a box of biscuits for the team etc) when treatment is completed, or if a family member has died at home and the family want to say thanks for the care. In those cases, although the gifts are declared, normally the policy is that we get to keep them, especially if it's a one off. e.g a thank you card to thr care team plus chocolates, it would cause more offence to refuse something like that.

But that is in no way the case described, in fact that carer is stealing food out of a freezer.

MrsSchadenfreude · 04/09/2013 23:19

Thank you. Z went round there unannounced this morning and let herself in. She said the carer had made herself quite at home - sitting watching telly with her feet up on the sofa while Z's Dad was wandering about in the garden. Z asked the carer if she shouldn't be out there keeping an eye on him (the garden is large, and open to a busy main road at the front, and Z's Dad has been known to slip out and get on a bus into town on his own before, get lost and confused and has been brought home by the police). The carer said that the gardener was there, and would keep an eye on him, and carried on watching telly. Z went and brought her Dad in, and he made a cup of tea for them. The carer called through from the other room "Oh Dad, if you're making tea, I'll have a cup." Z said that did it for her. She went out and called the agency and told them what was going on, and said she didn't want this woman in the house again. She said they took it seriously, and said she should definitely not be accepting large gifts. Z didn't say anything to the carer - told the agency that she could see out her shift today, but that was it. She said she also took the opportunity while she was there, to lock all cash and small valuables in the safe and change the combination, because she was feeling so uneasy about this woman.

OP posts:
Listentomum · 04/09/2013 23:24

She needs to call the police the care quality commision and change agencies. Why on earth did she let her finish the shift.

iliketea · 04/09/2013 23:27

Shock definitely care quality commission and social services for safeguarding review. Bloody hell, she's get paid to providr care, not watch tv and let the gardener take responsibilty for her clients safety!!

shockers · 04/09/2013 23:38

When my Grandmother was in an assisted apartment (that she chose and paid for), she developed dementia, so we paid for nursing staff to come in daily and be there when we couldn't... although at least one family member visited daily.

When she was at her very worst and very close to the end, someone took a diamond pin from her drawer. She may well have told them to take it as a gift, but she didn't know any of the nurses very well. That pin was worth £3000 and even if they hadn't have known that, they shouldn't have taken it. I still have her diamond engagement ring, my sister has another ring... neither of us are interested in selling them (both worth approx the same as the pin), we love them because they were the symbols of an immensely long and happy marriage. The pin was supposed to go to my brother... he has always been very happy with Grandad's bench from his garden.

Just as well really, or there would have been big trouble for whoever took that pin.

RenterNomad · 05/09/2013 12:52

She didn't even take such a blatant hint?

fledtoscotland · 05/09/2013 14:04

Definitely no "gifts". I was allowed to keep a couple of bunches of flowers given by patients when I got married but never anything else. Certainly I would never have taken food out of a patients house. In the wards it's no personal gifts and anything like Chocs/biscuits gets shared between all staff

mirry2 · 05/09/2013 14:16

I've worked in public organisations where there is a 'no gift' policy. Sometimes we were given things like chocolates at Christmas which we had to donate to a company raffle.

pigletmania · 05/09/2013 14:53

Yanbu at all, this carer is behaving very unprofessionally, her client is a vulnerable adult. Definitely complain to the agency

DoubleLifeIsALifeHalved · 05/09/2013 15:48

The only time when I've really made an effort to give carers proper gifts was the first year I was disabled and enduring council provided care and their agencies. I gave gifts in a vain effort to humanise myself to them so they'd stop abusing me. It worked for that session that I gave them the gift, back to stealing my stuff and ill treating me after that...

I agree that present buying is a power dynamic thing and a blanket rule is much better.

bellasuewow · 05/09/2013 16:41

The must alert the agency who can suspend this person and stop them from stealing from vulnerable people this is not uncommon unfortunately this should then be alerted to the police and a safeguarding alert made to adult social services, you do not know what else this person is doing or taking. There is no middle ground here.

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