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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To find people say X public School is OK because

388 replies

NoComet · 03/09/2013 13:08

It gets DCs into Oxbridge and RG universities, a daft justification for choosing a school that costs £15,000 plus a year.

We have a local secondary (not even a true comp as there is some creaming off of bright DC by Grammar schools) that is in Special Measures that has just got two pupils in to Oxbridge.

And this is hardly news, bog standard state secondaries and sixform collages all over the country send DCs to Oxbridge and RG Universities every year.

My very ordinary Welsh Comp sent someone in the year above me to study medicine at Oxford, there were others at prestigious med schools and, now, RG uni's me included.

Yes, private schools are very nice, yes DC avoid some DCs with a bad attitude to education, Yes DC get good sports facilities and yes DC may study a wider range of subjects, esp. MFL.

But in the end your DC will, quite likely end up at exactly the same uni, doing the same course, just with poorer parents!

OP posts:
racmun · 04/09/2013 13:55

Sorry post should have said

Full of rough parents

Crowler · 04/09/2013 13:58

TheOriginalSteamingNit - if, despite your best (parental) efforts, you found your child's school to be totally inadequate - would you move? Homeschool?

And, what would you do if your local comp was seriously, seriously rough?

Apologies if this has already been asked/answered.

motherinferior · 04/09/2013 14:00

Do you mean 'rough' or do you mean 'poorly achieving'? Interesting that you've conflated the two...

There are some seriously rough kids at DD1's school. It's educating her well, though!

Crowler · 04/09/2013 14:02

How do you know she's conflated the two, motherinferior?

Crowler · 04/09/2013 14:05

I do find it interested that on mumsnet that if you go to your local comp school gates and see a preponderance of rough parents (i.e. smoking, swearing, etc) and decide to opt out this is viewed as snobbery.

Talkinpeace · 04/09/2013 14:05

racmum
How do you know they were "rough"?
What empirical evidence brought you to this description and decision?

Crowler
It has to be admitted that TOSN is able to hold onto her principles because they have not been tested to the limit.
And none of us can really imagine what we would do if things really changed ....
if those who are implacably against sending their kids to state suddenly found themselves bankrupt and living in a dire area ....
would they home educate?

Talkinpeace · 04/09/2013 14:06

Crowler
you need to go to more comps - very few parents either pick up or drop off - it is secondary school after all
those of us that do are normally on our way somewhere so do not get out of our cars

Crowler · 04/09/2013 14:07

Local primary then.

Crowler · 04/09/2013 14:10

I'm not philosophically opposed to state schools whatsoever. That said, if I had to choose between a dire state & home educating I'd home educate. That's an easy decision for me to make because I like doing that kind of work at home with my kids anyway.

TheOriginalSteamingNit · 04/09/2013 14:12

I have to say I do kind of find it wearing to be presented with these hypothetial absolute worst examples - most schools are pretty normal, you know! - as if to prove I don't mean what I say. But I suppose I do bring it on myself... Grin

Anyway - Well we're at secondary level now, so I don't see the parents anyway...

When you say 'seriously seriously rough', you mean I'd have genuine reason to be concerned for her physical safety?

I'm not sure what I could do - we couldn't afford fees for two children to go private, I'm almost sure. If I felt a child was in danger, I'd remove them first and ask questions later, I suppose, but none of the answers to those questions would be private school. At home in the short term while I fought tooth and nail for a place in another school and continued battling with the violent school, I guess.

Beastofburden · 04/09/2013 14:12

I would be interested to know who here has kids at secondary/GCSE/A level stage?

State schooling was an easy choice for us at primary- there's not a lot a primary school kid does that I cant do better, so it was easy to help out at home if I felt the academic side needed a boost.

I dont have the same ability to help with A level Maths, Physics, biology and Chemistry, which is what DS1 did. So despite the surprise at finding myself paying for school, we moved DS1 over to a fee paying ex-grammar school from 11. We were lucky he got in, given we didn't pay for tutoring and the like, but he did.

We didnt send DD or DS2 private, though, as they had entirely different needs.

Beastofburden · 04/09/2013 14:14

xposted with steaming Grin

TheOriginalSteamingNit · 04/09/2013 14:14

Talkin not to the limit, but they have been tested, actually. And just because I haven't been in any of the very extreme and unusual hypothetical situations posed doesn't mean that those situations are normal or that my principles would falter if I were.

Talkinpeace · 04/09/2013 14:16

beastofburden
One in year 9 one in year 11
I am not arrogant enough to think that I could home educate my kids despite DH and I both having science degrees and him being a qualified secondary teacher.

TOSN
"seriously rough" - year 6 kid taking a machete to school was enough to make me move DD and DS !

TheOriginalSteamingNit · 04/09/2013 14:17

yes Beast I have a year 8 and a year 12.

TheOriginalSteamingNit · 04/09/2013 14:18

yep, ok Talkin, I haven't had to deal with machetes and I wouldn't put up with that!

Crowler · 04/09/2013 14:20

TOSN - sure, I find extreme hypotheticals wearing as well. But your position itself is extreme, isn't it?

Most schools are normal, yes. Maybe the people sending their kids privately are dealing with not-normal alternatives.

Crowler · 04/09/2013 14:22

I don't think it's arrogant to think you could home-educate if you have a science degree. I'm intrigued by the whole idea, I toy with the idea of home-schooling for a term all the time just to get a better grasp of my kids' abilities. I can do anything for a term.

Beastofburden · 04/09/2013 14:22

I dont see the value of putting daft "whatifs" to Steaming. I am interested to hear from her as she takes a view from principle and she has confidence that the schooling will be effective and good, in social ways if not guaranteed academically (we cant know the risks around that as we dont know her DC's gifts or where they live).

I do see education as different from other public services. To me it is like health, iconic that it is free in this country.

I would personally pay some more in tax to support schools. But having been to a comp and having had one DC go through a modern comp (the other two were one private and one SEN school, having all been to the same state primary), I am increasingly a fan of very high quality vocational FE training and separate grammar schools, though I think 11 is much too early to separate the two.

I dont regret DS1's schooling as he has done very well and is set for a career in medical research. I will defend the fact that the quality of his actual scientific education was very much higher than he would have got at our local comp, he worked much harder when he was there, and he has gone on to do very well at Uni. But I do wish none of it had been necessary.

Beastofburden · 04/09/2013 14:23

Mine are 17,19 and 21 to complete the set, so one finished at Uni, one at FE doing NVQ, one safely in his SEN school Grin

Talkinpeace · 04/09/2013 14:24

Crowler
But private school is not a "normal" situation.
It is an incredibly minority opportunity and choice - more than 80% of the population could not even consider it.
Remember that half the adults in the country earn less than £18,000 a year ....
Therefore TOSN is only unusual in that she could even consider private, as am I and others on this thread

TheOriginalSteamingNit · 04/09/2013 14:25

I wouldn't say my position is extreme, exactly: quite a lot of people are opposed to private schools!

And I don't quite buy that the people sending their kids privately are all dealing with those extremes - surely not every child (or even the majority) are all there because their local state school is 20 miles away/full of knives/woefully underperforming? Because if that was the case for those 7%, that would be an awful lot of the 93% left who are still having to deal with those issues. And that's not really borne out by anything I've seen.

I don't know why people are bothered by the fact that I wouldn't do this, or refuse to believe it could be true! I'm sure I do all sorts of things you wouldn't ever do!

Beastofburden · 04/09/2013 14:26

gawd we couldnt afford it, it was our legacy-in-advance from the grandparents...

Crowler · 04/09/2013 14:31

Sure, a lot of people are philosophically opposed to private school. I'd wager that of those who could, most would go privately when confronted with a very bad state school as an alternative.

Beastofburden · 04/09/2013 14:32

true, steaming, not woefully underperforming in our case. But also not equipped to give a specialist education to a child who was at one extreme of the ability range.

not my private opinion- it was the school initially who took me quietly aside and told me to jump ship if I could afford it. It wasnt official advice from the Head, but from the teacher, old-school, long-experienced and dedicated to his school, who advised me that this was going to be very, very difficult. Aged 9, DS1 was reading A level chemistry text books. All our DC had to be tested for IQ by the Ed Psych; the disabled ones got the results you'd expect, while DS1 clocked in at 170 aged 10.

The way I see it, all three of my DC went to special schools post 11.