to be disappointed that my 4 year old doesn't want piano lessons

[evalluna]

Both my partner and I are musical, I played in orchestras throughout school and university and a bit beyond, though have let it slide since having children. My partner plays several instruments and has played in loads of different ensembles. We have a piano which we both (again mainly pre-kids) enjoyed playing though not to a great standard. We have always been keen for our kids to learn though (I have always regretted not having piano lessons as we didn't have a piano when I was growing up.) My partner was keen for them to learn by the suzuki method, so yesterday we took our daughter to meet a suzuki teacher, who was lovely (and our daughter actually went to sit next to when asked which is unusual as she is usually shy with unknown adults). However, when the teacher tried to do a few clapping games with her she wasn't interested and started being silly, and when she asked her if she wanted to learn to play the piano she said no. Understandably the teacher didn't want to take on a young child who didn't want to learn and suggester we leave it a while.

I am a bit disappointed, partly as I am probably projecting my own wish to have learned young on to her and feel it is wasting an opportunity. Also, I think she does have a fair bit of musical ability - she has always loved music and has had a very in-tune singing voice from an early age. My partner feels we have somehow failed not to have instigated in her a desperate desire to learn the piano. However, personality wise she has always been a mixture of extremely stubborn and quite anxious in new situations and has never been one for doing something she doesn't want to do. I wonder if she is just not ready - similarly for a long time she refused to write her name when asked even though she could but now is happy to do so. And although she has known her letters for a long time she has only recently wanted to attempt to put them together to read (she is about to start reception) and it was pointless trying to get her to do this before.

We have got a book called Lulus piano lesson which we have been reading with her and she likes, and my partner has done a bit with her, teaching her where the notes are, which she knows. When i ask why she doesn't want to learn she says 'because I already know' (ie can bash about a bit!)

I don't want to push it, but want to try to develop things so she might be ready for lessons at some point. Has anyone had similar experience/ got any advice? Thanks.

[evalluna]

Also tabliope you misread my post about the tutoring it was not just tennis lessons it was academic tutoring for a reception kid after school.

I came on here for advice which some posters have been kind enough to give in a non judgemental manner.A lot of which I have taken on board. You do not know how I interact witj my daughter but appear to have made a lot of assumptions about me being pushy, which I do not appreciate. I think you have made your point misinformed as it is. I genuinely did think 4 was a reasonable age to learn piano using a fun, interactive, not too serious method - it has been helpful to read various reasons why starting older can be better.

[evalluna]

Hobnobs I don't see what I have said that is judgy? Unless it was about the reception after school tutoring which was an example of what I would consider pushy.

[morethanpotatoprints]

evalluna

I hope I didn't sound as if I was giving you a hard time because I think you must really care for your dd to ask others opinions and not just go ahead regardless.

I do know a child, well 2 actually who started very young, I'm sure their mother instigated them playing so young. They are grade 7 and 5 and aged 8 and 5. They are a Chinese family and at first I was guilty of thinking Tiger mom, but the dc are well balanced and happy, but their mum believes they should always be occupied with something even if it is free play. They are lovely kids and seem well rounded to me.

[evalluna]

Thanks - of course I really care for her, she's my daughter! That is, ironically, why I was worried about her missing the opportunity to learn at the best possible age - am feeling reassured now that this is not 4 so will relax about it a bit.
Being grade 5 standard age 5 is really amazing!

[morethanpotatoprints]

The little boy is 5 and his sister just turned 8, she is in my dds other choir. The mum brings the son to the rehearsal and he does homework or a theory book whilst his sister rehearses.
They are both amazing musically, but I have spoken about them on other threads, they are quite robotic as it is difficult to play with much expression at that age. The girl had these springy stands, like pogo sticks to reach the pedals, until recently.
I'm not sure we would have started so young, but it really hasn't obviously affected them, to out siders anyway.
I wish you luck OP, and maybe leaving it a while will save you some expense and running around after your dd. It can be a curse sometimes.

[Mumoftwoyoungkids]

Dh and I met playing a sport. He is an ex junior international, I played at district level, BIL is a commonwealth medalist, my db used to be England top 20, FIL is an international coach, my df is on the national council......

We agreed pre kids that our children will only play if they are absolutely desperate to.

They are both far too young ATM (3 and 3 months) although dd has found some of dh's equipment and quite likes playing with it. (Serves him right for not putting it away properly!)

There are so many activities that kids can do. No point in wasting time on one that they don't love when they could be looking for something they do love.

[MrRected]

She needs to be able to read music - or at least that's what our piano teacher prefers. Min age 7.

In the nicest possible way I think you are being pushy on this one. Of course she doesn't want learn to play the piano at her age. Don't be disheartened - just come back to it in 2/3 years time.

[exoticfruits]

I remember a thread in here where posters were extremely bitter about parents who had expectations that they would follow in their footsteps.

[Cooroo]

Can't wade through all these pages! No it's ok that you were disappointed. But you'll have to accept it for now and let her have other opportunities to get intro music. My DD rejected early violin lessons, went to banging and shaking type group, then sang in children's choir, then started violin against 9 or 10. Never took to piano. But she's nearly 17 now and still has lessons. Not especially talented but loves playing. We do orchestra together which is really special.

Just let her be exposed to music. If she has any inclination she'll find her own way. I agree it's a wonderful thing to learn and stands you in good stead for a lifetime. Good luck!

[thebody]

you know what op the most amazing thing me and dh found about our 4 kids was how bloody unlike we are in so many ways and how individual each one was.

we are a house of 6 very different and very individual people.

your little dd might fucking hate the piano but love rugby.

life's like that, unexpected.

let her introduce you to her world. not her to yours. //😀

[evalluna]

That is an interesting way of putting it, the body - maybe I will do that!"

Just as a point, the suzuki method does not place emphasis on reading music which is why we liked that idea.

I think I have maybe got a bit carried away with the idea she will be musical partly because she has a strikingly tuneful singing voice and has done since 18 months - but maybe I have confused (what I see as) aptitude with desire to learn.

[Hissy]

Look up the Kodaly method.

My son's been going to classes. In a music school near here (Hampshire/Surrey) since he was 3, not pushy, seems slow actually, but every open session I go to i'm stunned at their progress!

If you're near me, PM and i'll give you the details.

[Tittybangbang]

Feel for you OP.

I took all three of my dc's for piano lessons. They were 5, 7 and 11. The teacher gave the 5 year old the flick after 5 months because he couldn't focus and kept trying to do things like play the piano with his stomach . dd(11) packed it in after a few months too - wouldn't practice and kept moaning. Only ds1 (now 10) is still going and is doing well. They are all musical but dd and ds2 don't have the other qualities needed to do well at a hard instrument like the piano.

DS2 is doing percussion now and is GREAT. He works hard, practices without nagging, and enjoys it. Dd sadly isn't doing any music - I'm gutted. She has a beautiful singing voice and is incredibly musical. She just won't commit herself to anything that requires consistent effort. :-(. Oh well, you can't win them all.....

[Lazyjaney]

4????

[evalluna]

Hissy, a few others have mentioned thr kodaly method. It looks good but we are not near you unfortunately. Don't think there is anything similar near us!


(To all the posters who have typed 4 in an aghast manner, in mitigation she is nearly 5 and in a lot of ways eg vocabulary/ conversational level quite bright - perhaps I have been guilty of allowing this ro distract me from the fact she us still v young).

[SilverApples]

'because he couldn't focus and kept trying to do things like play the piano with his stomach'

That line will make me smile all day!

[chocoluvva]

Formal, weekly 30 min lessons for 5YOs - not usually advisable IME.

3 or 4 10-15 min sessions every week would give her the opportunity to get off to a flying start with more traditional lessons when she's 6. You would have to do this yourself or sit in on a short lesson with a teacher who is happy to have a very young pupil and give supplementary sessions yourself.

It's not her age that's the problem - provided she is not subjected to the same type of lessons that older children get, whether Suzuki method or not - she could have lots of fun while she makes slow progress and gets a good foundation for later.

[friday16]

My daughter's gone through the system at the usual rate (starting playing at around 8, Grade VIII in a couple of instruments by about 16). She plays in a couple of decent standard youth orchestras. Her observation of people who starter younger and therefore end up in those orchestras younger is that they miss out: they're not ready for the experience and don't get much from it other than playing the notes on the page. There are safeguarding issues which mean that they often can't take full part in trips and tours, they're not emotionally mature enough for some of the music and, of course, the 16,17,18 majority in the ensemble have no interest in making room for twelve year olds.

So at a rehearsal last night where most of the players were doing their A Levels, there were a cluster of teeny-tiny Chinese violinists, with their protective mothers hovering, getting virtually nothing out of the experience.

You can push kids from a younger age, but what's the benefit?

[Bakingtins]

Can you find a less pressured music class she does enjoy at the moment if you think she is musical? My DS who is nearly 7 has been going to "Crotchet Factory" group classes since he started school. One hour a week with about 10 kids in the class, they start with "karate recorder" percussion and singing, then progress to ukelele and keyboard. The classes have three stages for 4-8 yr olds then they are encouraged to start learning an instrument individually. He is probably learning much less than if he had individual lessons and we enforced daily practice, but he's having fun and learning a little about reading music and the basics of playing several different instruments. I think at 8 he'll have the maturity to choose an instrument and practise which will justify the cost of individual lessons, or to decide he wants to try something else.

[chocoluvva]

I agree friday16 - although piano isn't usually an orchestral instrument so not an issue in this case.

[UptoapointLordCopper]

How do you know the teeny-tiny Chinese violinists with their hovering protective mothers get nothing out of the experience?

[MummytoMog]

I played in an orchestra from the age of seven. I got a lot out of the experience thankyouverymuch.

[UptoapointLordCopper]

What is a parent to do if his/her child is young and talented?? Dump them at the ochestra and leave so as not to appear protective? Stop them from progressing too fast so as not to appear pushy? What is a person to do if he/she was Chinese? Don't do anything so as not to conform to stereotype? Come. Be reasonable.

[friday16]

"I played in an orchestra from the age of seven."

An orchestra of seventeen year olds? My kids have played in orchestras since they were in primary school, but usually amongst people of their own age, plus or minus.

"How do you know the teeny-tiny Chinese violinists with their hovering protective mothers get nothing out of the experience?"

You don't have to spend a lot of time waiting outside rehearsal rooms to have seen more than your fair share of weeping small children. They also rarely last more than a term.

[chocoluvva]

My DD played in a primary schools orchestra when she was 9 - pushed by her teacher, not by me. It was a very long, tearful week for her.
Again when she was 10.
When she was 11 and would have been at the first desk and would probably have had a whale of a time she'd had enough and refused to go.

No such issues with piano though.