to be disappointed that my 4 year old doesn't want piano lessons

[evalluna]

Both my partner and I are musical, I played in orchestras throughout school and university and a bit beyond, though have let it slide since having children. My partner plays several instruments and has played in loads of different ensembles. We have a piano which we both (again mainly pre-kids) enjoyed playing though not to a great standard. We have always been keen for our kids to learn though (I have always regretted not having piano lessons as we didn't have a piano when I was growing up.) My partner was keen for them to learn by the suzuki method, so yesterday we took our daughter to meet a suzuki teacher, who was lovely (and our daughter actually went to sit next to when asked which is unusual as she is usually shy with unknown adults). However, when the teacher tried to do a few clapping games with her she wasn't interested and started being silly, and when she asked her if she wanted to learn to play the piano she said no. Understandably the teacher didn't want to take on a young child who didn't want to learn and suggester we leave it a while.

I am a bit disappointed, partly as I am probably projecting my own wish to have learned young on to her and feel it is wasting an opportunity. Also, I think she does have a fair bit of musical ability - she has always loved music and has had a very in-tune singing voice from an early age. My partner feels we have somehow failed not to have instigated in her a desperate desire to learn the piano. However, personality wise she has always been a mixture of extremely stubborn and quite anxious in new situations and has never been one for doing something she doesn't want to do. I wonder if she is just not ready - similarly for a long time she refused to write her name when asked even though she could but now is happy to do so. And although she has known her letters for a long time she has only recently wanted to attempt to put them together to read (she is about to start reception) and it was pointless trying to get her to do this before.

We have got a book called Lulus piano lesson which we have been reading with her and she likes, and my partner has done a bit with her, teaching her where the notes are, which she knows. When i ask why she doesn't want to learn she says 'because I already know' (ie can bash about a bit!)

I don't want to push it, but want to try to develop things so she might be ready for lessons at some point. Has anyone had similar experience/ got any advice? Thanks.

[Parmarella]

What Lemon said.

My DSs play violin, started when they were about 6.

However, oldest DS asked to have lessons after her was inspired by visit from music teachers at school sent in from the local county ( nice initiative).

Youngest DS wanted to learn too, but I said he would only be allowed if he could wait a bit and would be still keen next term. So we waited a term, he begged for lessons and soilet him.

It seems that reverse psychology can work ( "playing an instrument is ver difficult, why don't you wait until you are a bit older?").

4 is young IMO, mine started at 6 like I said, so they will never be child prodigees, but they enjoy it so it works for us.

[Viviennemary]

I'm amazed that you are both musicians but seem to think it's appropriate for a four year old to start piano lessons. I'd say that was far too young. Perhaps she will prefer another instrument or be talented at something completely different. Clear way to put them off is to force lessons.

[exoticfruits]

I agree with Lemon. You give birth to a unique human being, the fact that you have a talent or great interest in something does not mean that they will be the same.
Support the child you have not the one you want. The more you push the more likely they will be to dig their heels in. There is no point whatsoever in music lessons if they don't want them.

[froken]

I think maybe you have made her feel like it is the same as reading, you said she was reluctant to write her name for a while but your dp has started teaching her notes, I thought the idea of suzuki learning was that you lerant the instrument in the same way that you learn to talk so you don't start by going over the notes you start by listening over and over and over again to a cd of the book one music.

My little sister started suzuki piano at the age of 3 and she is a fantastic piano player now at the age of 9. I learnt in a more traditional way from 6 and I would say my sister plays more beutifully than me although I can play harder things.

[SilverApples]

I wanted a Shakespearean scholar and a poet.
I got a TechnoNerd.
Such is life!

[AllThatGlistens]

You having your own interests is great, I'm glad you have a passion for your music, it's a lovely thing.

Please, please let your little girl develop her own interests, don't project your passions onto her. If she isn't interested it will only lead to resentment.

She's an individual, treat her as such

[pianodoodle]

I think it's a bit much to say it's projecting and being pushy etc...

No pushing has happened.

There's a reason why some families all seem to be musical though if you've grown up with musical parents and instruments in the house it's common enough for the children to take it up.

Nothing wrong with encouraging a love of music without forcing anything :)

[AllThatGlistens]

Really? She's admitted feeling disappointed in her 4 year old because she doesn't want piano lessons.

At 4 years old?

[UptoapointLordCopper]

It's fine to feel disappointed as long as you don't convey that! How can you help your feeling?

I started lessons around 4yo. I still play 40 years later. One of the best things ever, playing the piano. >

[baddriver]

I don't think 4 is too young but then I started violin at 4.

Both my dc were raring to go at 4, the first literally begged for piano lessons and the second for guitar.

I looked into the Suzuki mthod but wasn't sure it was for us.

In the end I enrolled them in a general music class where they sang, danced, learned keyboard and theory. The first one moved on to piano at 6 and the other (5) is doing ukulele.

I can understand why you want to share your passion for music. There are many parents who would persist - and succeed. But generally this is not the way in our culture.

Can you keep encouraging her interests - musical and other - and see where it takes her?

[HoldMeCloserTonyDanza]

I don't think you sound pushy OP but I was pushy/helicopter parented myself and am in fact very grateful for the amazing opportunities my parents gave me and my siblings as a result .

[AllThatGlistens]

But that's the point, it's the OP's passion, not her DD's!

I love music, I think it's a wonderful wonderful passion to have, but you just can't make a little one love the same things that you do, and have such expectations, it's unrealistic and unfair.

If she develops a love for music then fantastic, if she doesn't and wants to play builder or train driver all day, then that's fantastic too

She's her own person, not an extension of her parents and will want to develop her own interests, be that music or anything else.

[HoldMeCloserTonyDanza]

I think the thing about Suzuki (and you are supposed to start Suzuki between the ages of 3-5 and you can start at 6, so you have plenty of time OP) is that while you can do it and be normal and not-pushy, if you are a Tiger Mother it will bring out the absolute worst in you.

So that's just something to be aware of.

It's also very very Marmite in that lots of families cannot or would not enjoy the level of parental involvement required. Which is fine, it's really really not for everyone.

[PiratePanda]

Erstwhile professional musician here, and one who started with Suzuki and switched to mainstream:

4 is too young. It doesn't mean she's not musical, or won't enjoy playing later, but children just don't have the motor skills at 4 for piano or violin. They learn much faster a little older.

How about a children's choir or fun group music classes - or even better investigate the children's music appreciation classes Colour Strings do (based on Kodaly method).

[dandydorset]

amazed at the amount of dc's that have music lessons etc

this is when i feel "the poor relation" on MN

round here its all football and karate lessons

intresting thread may i add

[WowOoo]

Yanbu.

With you two as parents, I think she'll show a keen interest in attempting to play an instrument sooner or later.

Keep playing and get her to sing along or clap or whatever.

[Parmarella]

Dandy my kids do karate AND violin... What will become of them...

[evalluna]

I don't feel disappointed in her, more in myself that I may have done something wrong and put her off or not encouraged her enough/ played to her myself enough.

Fair enough to say don't force my interests on her but surely every parent does to some degree by osmosis if nothing else - the reason you get whole families into football! For what it is worth she has been to swimming/ socatots (didn't like! ) ballet, tap and a little music group as well as lots of museums/ theatre things so a wide range of options have been offered.

If I was certain she really didn't want ti fine, but she has tended to approach most things witb a not wanting to attitude including the tap bit of the dance class when I first took her. She sat it out for a few weeks then joined in and now likes it. So I agree witj the poster who said sometimes you have to encourage them a bit at first and gave example of tennis lessons
It is easier where the activities are group things I think as they can see their peers joining in. So in that sense she probably doesn't really understand what she is being asked or what it will involve so has naturally decided she's not keen

I like the idea of the children's music groups do will look into. Not in London though so maybe none near us. The one we did go to is a bit young for her now but she did enjoy it (on a related note my younger child did not so we did not make him go - but loves to play daddy's guitar! ) also will look into these concerts near manchester as we are nearish there.

[PaperSeagull]

I can understand feeling a bit disappointed, especially as this is an interest that you were looking forward to sharing with your child. But she clearly isn't ready yet, so I think it's fine to leave the lessons for a year or two.

I have some friends who are professional musicians. Their older son was fascinated with music and musical instruments from the time he could crawl. He showed such a clear passion for music from an early age that it would have been impossible to keep him from learning to play. He didn't have formal lessons until about age 6, but he learned to play numerous instruments by ear much earlier. Over the years, he has often accompanied his parents in their concerts. Now, as a teenager, he is quite an accomplished musician and he still loves to play.

OTOH, their younger son didn't display that same passionate drive and interest. The musical environment in the house hadn't changed at all, but this boy simply wasn't as interested as his elder brother, and the parents didn't push it. Last year, when the younger boy was 6, he asked to learn a particular instrument and the parents happily obliged (no formal lessons yet, his parents taught him and will continue to do so for a while before offering him the option of formal lessons). He will probably never have the passion for music that the rest of the family has, but he enjoys playing for now and I think his parents handled the situation just exactly right.

[ReallyTired]

The Hertfordshire music service has saturday morning classes for nursery/ reception children. They do lots of singing and play percussion instruments.

I have found a link and it looks like there is something similar in Manchester.

www.oneeducation.co.uk/index.php?category_id=59

My four year old is desperate to play the piano. She has a toy keyboard from the early learing centre that was never intended for industrial use. She can play twinkle twinkle little star and row row your boat. Even so I feel she is too young and lessons too soon would put her off.

[exoticfruits]

I think that you just need to be more relaxed. Let her see you playing music and that you enjoy it. Children are very astute at picking up what you don't say and seeing hidden agendas, even though it is all done unconsciously. It isn't just a question of lessons, you will be expecting progress and her to do well and quite probably she isn't ready for it. It can be much easier for some children to take up something the parent knows nothing about.

[coco27]

my dd started violin at 4 (not Suzuki just school music service)she was too young really and I feared for the safety of the rented violin!
I can understand palying vilin at 3 or 4 because there are scaled down violins.BUt surely an average sized 4 yr olds hands are too small for a keyboard.
I think starting her at 7 she would very soon catch up to the 4 yr old starters

[mrsjay]

I think in the nicest possible way you need to get over it she is 4 years old dont be so dramatic about it if she is interested she will play if not then wait until she is older she isn't going to be some child prodigy who is going to master the piano by the time she is 5 let her tinker away at it and then see,

[evalluna]

Thanks for the replies everyone. She seems quite happy just to sit with us and tinker away so will leave it at that for the moment - I probably need to play a bit more myself (difficult as she won't let me, if she is around she wants to play). Also it is a goid point that she needs to settle into school as well which will all be new.

I don't want to be pushy I just want her to have opportunities - if she develops a completely different interest later I would obviously encourage that (as long as it's not drugs!) However I think at this age children are inevitably exposed to things their parents happen tobe interested in or have some knowledge of.

[MCos]

My DDs started Suzuki violin late - 6 & 8. DD1 begged for 2 years before I made it happen. I am sorry I waited so long, she loves it.

Our teacher recommends we listen to as much music as possible. Just keeping music on in background at home, in the car, etc. And listen to a variety of music. It helps develop an ear.
So that is something to consider. And since she enjoys ballet, perhaps she would enjoy dancing around to a variety of music.