in finding my chilldren a massive PITA this weekend?

[VelvetSpoon]

I've taken my 2 DS away for a long weekend.

They have done nothing but moan, gripe and whinge since we got here.

DS1 sulked for 2 hours on the first day because I made him walk from the station (I was carrying all the bags!)

They are both pissed off they don't have a football. There is nowhere nearby to get one. We could do the half hour walk into town and try there but as they both bellyache about walking to the clubhouse (5 mins walk) that isn't going to happen.

They each spent at least 30 mins yesterday procrastinating about having a shower, culminating in DS2 crying that the water was too cold (it wasn't). It has taken 20 mins to even get him in the room today. DS1 is still asleep so yet to have that battle with him, but I expect similar.

DS1 refuses to sleep in his bed because it is too small, so insists on sleeping on the sofa. Which means DS2 wants to sleep there as well, and means they just watch tv all night. Which is the only thing, absent the aforementioned football and their xbox that they want to do.

Yesterday getting them to go swimming involved several tantrums, and shouting matches. DS1 still refused. DS2 was bored after 10 mins.

They won't pick up, tidy up, clothes are everywhere (although all this is par for the course at home too) and frankly I have had enough.

They are 12 and 15 btw.

I think if my DS moaned about the way I was dressed I would get out my Lycra hot pants that I keep as a reminder of my clubbing days 25 years ago and wear them with badly applied make up

^ This .

I think you sound too nice, OP. Patient/Saint/Martyr! That said, we all have these days. p.s. Maybe they are too old now, and just need to be left at home.

Arses! My 8 year old is being 'testing' at the moment, I hoped it would get better

I'll brace myself for it to continue I feel like a UN flipping peace negociator at the moment. His Dad is next to useless as he's had enough of him. Threatening to film DS's outbursts really helps but I'm knackered with it all and helps not enough though

I do give then a bit lot of latitude because of the fact I am (when at work) out of the house 12 hours a day. So their lives aren't the easiest. Also they have no family on my side, and no interest from the family on their dad's side (partly because He's not DS1's dad - he has no contact with his real father). They see their dad once a week, rarely stay with him (because he lives at home with his parents and there isn't room for both DC to visit...). Their lives aren't like the childhood I had, or the ones their friends have. Hence I have a huge sense of guilt and try to do nice things for them, get them nice things, in a tiny attempt to make up for all the other crap I can't do much about.

So they probably are spoilt, and definitely ungrateful. But today I was surrounded by families, mums, dads, grandparents, and I felt sad that's something my DC have never experienced.

They have calmed down a bit now, and are going out to watch the football shortly leaving me to pack so at least they are finally going outside, and I should also get a little peace and quiet :)

Have you told them what you've just told us?

That I feel guilty? No, I haven't. I have talked to them about my parents (who died when I was in my early 20s) and how much I wish the DSs had known them - but that's probably as far as it goes.

Nickynacky I'm reading this feeling the same we've just spent £600 on a weekend in Manchester with our 10 & 8 year old girls and it was horrendous to the point were we were going to stop and do something on the way home but we didn't bother we just came back asap.

OH just keeps saying they're spoilt, I just think they're never kind or considerate of others , they're selfish and will be so difficult and have tantrums to try and get their own way. So then were stuck as by punishing them and making them go without usually means we all would have to do without which is going towards spoiling the trip

And the battling between the pair of them my god its a nightmare

It was awful by this morning I had tears in my eyes in the hotel restaurant I was close to breaking point

I just can't decide if they're the norm or if its bad parenting from us that's to blame. One things for sure were entering a time that seems far harder and its scary to think its going to last for years

Velvet I really sympathise with you. My DC 16 and 14 would not go away with me for the weekend unless they brought a friend each. The simple truth is they don't want to be seen with me in public. I get this by the way. Your DS 15 probably doesn't want to be seen with you in case other 15 year olds see him and he gets embarrassed. My DC can only bear being in public with me when I am spending money on them.

Your DS 12 is still a boy and it is not uncommon at his age to cry. They want a football and their XBox. I also think its pretty common to want to sleep on the sofa and watch tv through the night. I know none of these things are ideal but it looks like normal teenage behaviour to me. Every single day my DC and I have words about clothes on the floor. In calm moments they tell me they don't see the clothes lying about. I am not sure at their age I did either. I just accept that teenagers are not going to think like a 47 year old.

I work fulltime and my EXH is a waste of space so I understand that home life is tricky. Much as I would love to fool myself this does have an impact on my DCs. It would be a darn sight easier if I didn't have to work so much and we had more money and downtime. Your boys probably feel the stress too. My family are over 120 miles away and I know being closer to them would definitely ease the stress.

Try to lighten up a bit. Get a takeaway and tell them that next time they can bring a football and the XBox and maybe a friend. Have a laugh about it. I tried being nicer to them about the clothes and their attitude and this seems to work better than shouting at them all the time. I find getting them on my side is more effective in the long run. They still huff and puff about it, slam doors and fight. The only thing is we are closer and the recovery time is quicker and we tend to laugh about it afterwards.

Try not to feel so upset. You are a parent doing her best. Teenagers and pre-teens are a pain in the arse! It is not just you.

Velvet, most parents feel guilty about something. I feel guilty that I don't have enough money to take my dc to all the places that they want to go (we live in an area where lots of people are quite well off, so most of their friends will have been away this summer). I feel guilty that dh is up to eyes in dissertation and work and we have not had a lot of time to do nice stuff. Your dc are loved and wanted and have a mum who does her very best for them. You have nothing to feel guilty about. I understand it though, because I have felt the same. In the past I have allowed my kids to get away with a bit too much and have not asked them to help out when needed, out of a sense of wanting to make them happy. However, it does them no good in the long run and I have had to adjust how I think and what I expect from them.

It took my mum to remind me that actually my dc have plenty of stuff and are loved and well cared for and are not deprived in the least - that no one has everything in life and that it's okay to expect my kids to have good manners and show appreciation for all the wonderful things that they do have.

Maybe this thread will be like that for you - your dc may not have much in the way of extended family, but they do have a mum who works hard for them and gives them all that she can. They clearly have plenty, if they are at the stage where they are taking it all for granted!

This too shall pass. It's a phase. It won't be forever and then you will look back and remember it as happy times with your lads.

I do still feel they are missing out though. DS1 in particular is a real boy's boy. It makes me so sad he's never had a decent male influence in his life. I feel like I've failed him. My dad would have adored him, but died the year before DS was born. No idea where DS's dad is, the ex is a waste of space, and I've no chance of meeting anyone (because men aren't interested in a relationship with me) so he's never going to have a role model. I feel like I can try all I want but I won't be enough.

Amd I honestly do believe if they had some proper male involvement, if it wasn't just me all the time, they would be much, much better behaved. But there's nothing I can do about it, other than wish I could give them a better life!

It sounds as if you are overcompensating them for what they do not have, ie, close family relationships.
They do sound rather spoiled and ungrateful,to be honest.
Have you actually sat them down and told them how their behaviour makes you feel?
Sorry your break was spoiled.Next year,take your own holiday without them when they are at their Dad's,something you want to do,a place you want to go.

Velvet, you sound absolutely lovely, but I think you have to stop blaming yourself for everything.

Your ds1 is 15, nearly a man, it is high time you both recognised that he is responsible for his behaviour and nobody else. Thousands of boys grow up without a father, it's not something horrendously unheard-of that you have to apologise for every moment of his life. You've done a good job, you've brought them up. The next bit is their responsibility.

Maybe try to treat them a bit more like an adults. If there are heavy bags to be carried, are they not as big and strong as you? If a holiday is to be planned, are they involved in the planning? I find with this age group that speaking to them like adults and involving them in discussions in advance often get results. My ex-SIL (also a single mum) makes her 15yo do all the planning and look up the timetables: not a bad idea, it makes him take ownership of the holiday.

Next time make it clear in advance that they are responsible for finding out what entertainment is available and planning what they want to take with them. Don't carry any bags, certainly don't do their packing for them.

Film them on your phone when they are crying and throwing a tantrum and post the video on their FB page for all their friends to see (and laugh).

FGS, I also thought you would be talking about 5-7 year-olds!

I do feel a bit heartbroken (that may be too strong a word) about the stuff they don't have - a father, a big family, male influences. I know lots of boys grow up without fathers, but not one of my DS's peer group has (we live in what is very much a 2 parent family area) apart from him. DS has 2 friends whose parents are divorced, but those boys see their dads all the time, do activities together and are very close to them. I think my ex took the boys swimming once on holiday in 2006...and that was his last attempt at an activity with them.

I am probably making excuses for them, but I am hugely aware of what they don't have.

I do like the idea of getting them to plan stuff - I doubt they would be interested but they might surprise me :). They will definitely be carrying a bag each when we leave later (although I will do the packing). Last night DS2 said 'when we come here next year...' I asked why he wanted to come back, hadn't he hated it - and he said no he actually liked the swimming, and some other stuff, and if he brings his football next time it would be even better.

On the basis he will also be a teen next year I am not relying too much on this!

Velvet, life is a valley of tears or something like that.

Everybody has something bad in their lives. My dd has grown up with constant chronic pain and severe anxiety. Her db has been living with the fear of his sister committing suicide. Their friends lived through their mother's terminal illness and death. Their cousin grew up with his father working in another country and has just been through a messy break-up of the family. I can't think of many teens who haven't been through anything bad at all. Sooner or later, life throws shit at all of us.

The only thing that makes a difference is the resilience we show. And resilience is a skill that can partly be taught. Making excuses for our children doesn't help to teach them resilience.

We can't always change their circumstances. But we can help them with how they react to them. Of course I thought it was shit that my dd had to be in pain and sit in a wheelchair. But I did not think that was an excuse for her to be rude and unpleasant. Or, more to the point, I did not think it would make things better for her if she learnt that she was allowed to be rude and unpleasant.

I have DDs those ages and they simply aren't allowed to whinge like that. They carry their bags or they stay on the pavement.

However, I do make sure there are iPod and kindle chargers packed and whether or not they shower is their business.

Yes, I wouldn't exactly be supervising their showering either- or where they sleep.

It does sound a bit as if you are treating them as younger than they are, Velvet.

What happens when they are at home when you work? Are they alone in the house? Do they manage then? Do they take responsibility for preparing any meals or anything else for when you come home?

If I didn't make them shower, they wouldn't. Smelly teenage boy is something I would rather not have to suffer, hence making them wash.

They are alone in the house from 7-7 every day, sometimes less depending on work. There have been issues with them not getting up for school in the past so now I don't leave until I am sure they are both awake, if not up out of bed. They make themselves cereal or toast and (if I give them specific and detailed tasks) will tidy up, sort washing out etc. Which doesn't sound much, but is lots more than any of my friends DCs do.

Fair enough to make them shower for your benefit.

But the general attitude of guilt is somethign I think you have to give up on. It's not in their best interests. Appreciating you a bit more would be a better and happier thing for them.

I'm sure they'll have had their shower by now, and presumably several more, considering this was 4 YEARS AGO!!!!!!

























ZOMBIE THREAD

FFS I just read all that

Argh, piss off lazarus

I want to know if they improved!