To wonder why social services have decided this?

[babybearsmummy]

Before I start, I know it's a little bit nosey of me, but I'm just trying to gain a better understanding so that I can support a friend and this has confused me a bit.

My NDN has been round to our house several times in the last year (since we moved in) saying she's been locked out by her partner or that he's hit her/ they've rowed etc. we've tried not to get too involved as she makes him out to be quite aggressive, so every time she's come over we've called the 2 police officers she regularly deals with so they can take her somewhere safe or get them both on a calmer level so she can go back home. (We don't like to let her stay as she's said her partner will go mad if he knows she's here and we have a 1y.o dd so don't want to put ourselves in danger if that's understandable)

She's told us the police are regularly over, which we've witnessed, to sort out their arguments etc and they also have SS involved as she has 3 children. The 2 elder children come from different fathers and regularly stay with their dads rather than with my NDN, the youngest is her current partners who she lives with next door.

I'm very concerned for the poor lad as he's always there when the police are called and there have been times she's been over here saying she's been attacked and the little boy is still in the house.

Now what is confusing me is that, on occasions when she's run round, she's told us things like he's punched her face or smashed up lots of stuff in the house and there have been no marks on her face and, as she's on quick response form our local police force, they sometimes only take 5 or 6 mins to get here and have found the little boy calm and happy in the house with his dad with no evidence of things being smashed. One time she said he'd thrown everything out of the kitchen cupboards and that there was glass and food everywhere, the police arrived a few minutes later, checked the house out and nothing was on the floor in the kitchen... With no way he could have cleaned up the amount of devastation she'd said in that time.

Secondly, she came out of the house alone yesterday quite upset saying that her partner and their son had gone away to look for a new house. I said 'oh that's nice, fresh start for you all?' And she started crying and saying that social services had said that her partner needs to move on account of the accusations, police and SS involvement etc and that he has to take the little boy away with him. I'm really confused as, if the dad's deemed the violent one, surely SS would keep him with his mum?

Does anyone know what grounds this would happen on? I know it really sounds like I'm being a nosey neighbour, but me and my dp have done so much this last year to help her and the kids... Giving them a place to come to, calling help and helping her to get into contact of places she could go to such as women's centres and hostels, but she refuses to leave him and I'm very concerned for this little lad, but on the other hand the stories just don't add up.

I think you might need to accept that there may be more going on behind the scenes than you have been privy to, and that maybe the SS and police have seen that. I doubt that they have made this decision lightly. I think she needs help whatever the situation really is, and I think you and your DH have done a brilliant job in giving the best support you can.

very difficult to day really. well done you for offering help. if it was me I would keep focusing on the child and if I thought he was being beaten/ abused i then would act.

No, the stories don't add up, nor do they seem to match the action of who has residency.

It seems you've never met her DP, and have her side of events only.

Stand clear. Support your neighbour in the ways you think best. But always be aware that you do not have the full picture.

You seem to be saying that maybe she has made up these accusations of abuse. Is it possible that that is indeed the case? Have you ever seen any actual evidence of abuse? It seems that you only have her word to go on. I would stay well out of it, she sounds a bit manipulative to be honest.

Sounds like possibly SHE is the violent one & a it of a fantasist?

She could be telling you & the police all sorts of porkies, who knows...and although I quite understand the nosey curiosity interest given you have been so involved maybe time to step back & let her get on with it?

Also enjoy having quieter NDN''s!!

Definitely the stories don't add up. However, how do you know the bits of information that have come from someone other DND? How do you know, for example, that there was no mess in the kitchen? Someone is passing on information that they should not be.

FWIW, I have seen cases where SS have allowed a child to go off with a violent partner because the basis of their involvement has been because of problems with the mother's behaviour, not because they were called in over allegations of abuse. This is most common when one parent is an alcoholic and the other has managed to convince the authorities that all the problems stem from that (which, in some cases may be true).

If you were being violently attacked and there was glass and food all over the floor would you leave your child behind? It is possible that he is stopping her bringing the child each time but she doesn't seem to have a problem coming over to your house. Things don't quite seem to match up with what she is saying.

I agree with PP continue to offer support but bear in mind you may not have the whole picture.

I had a neighbour who accused her ex of all sorts and made up bizarre stories on a regular basis. She did it to her 7yo son too, locked him out of the house accusing him of trying to kill her, rang the father (the supposed abusive ex!) to come get him as he was being violent. She claimed her baby was in hospital for weeks when really she was visiting her family.

Suffice to say SS gave the ex custody of his kids and took her baby and gave it to her parents and she's only allowed supervised contact now. She's a pathological liar who didn't care how much damage her lies did as long as it elicited sympathy for her.

It's so hard to imagine anyone building up that level of fantasy, I believed her for months as it was all very plausible. If I hadn't caught her out on several occasions and seen her own abusive behaviour first hand I would have continued believing it.

Tread very carefully OP, something doesn't sound right and I'd be wary of getting too involved if I were you.

Hmm..I Knew someone a little like this years ago. She has 3 kids all to the same guy but has never actually lived with him as he has 2 other families somewhere else in the country. Her eldest DD is 15, DS is 11 and youngest DD is 3. Inbetween times she never saw him and frequently accused him of violence and even rape, yet she went on to get pregnant to him with 3rd child after frequent rape accusations from years previously. It all seemed to be fabricated and attention seeking. When the erstwhile partner disappeared off the scene completely she started saying that her DS (who was about 9 at the time) was being violent towards her. It ended up with him being taken into care. She was devastated but it seemed that SS had finally called her bluff. She was a very clever, manipulative person and it took me years to see through her.

Just to answer a few questions:

I don't believe the little boy is being hurt, I'm worried for him in regards to his mental health, I get concerned that he's scared of what's going on, if he's scared things are going to kick off and if he's scared of the police. I'm also worried as they are a bit of a 'steer clear from' family, so I'm worried he's ostracised by the other children at his school. In short, I really worry for every aspect of his wellbeing.

For me the stories don't add up because she never has marks on her arms or face even when she's said he's hit her face or scratched her arm etc. but I'm not saying she's lying, I don't take abuse stories lightly and accuse people of lying as I've suffered abuse in the past and my family didn't believe me and turned their backs on me in favour of my ex.

I never hear any of the shouting/ throwing etc either. She said he's smashed the back door in with a hammer one night (a few mins ago now) something you'd think you'd hear as a NDN especially as the glass is double glazing so would have taken some effort. But we heard nothing. The back door has been changed, so I am inclined to believe her, but we didn't hear a thing and we were in that night.

She does drink a lot which we've seen, she's come over drunk asking if we can go get her fags and alcohol before, which we've refused. They had their paddling pool out last week and there was the top half of a smashed wine bottle in there, but again we heard no arguments/ smashes.

Really don't know what to make of it, but will always offer support as I do empathise with their situation, but as I said my family and their safety does come first so I don't want to pry too much or get to involved! Thanks for the responses and sorry for the long posts!

Also on the times she's said there have been things smashed in the house e.g the kitchen incident, the police came over to collect her and said there was nothing on the floor and said if this had happened, it wouldn't have been cleaned on there response time as they were here in a few minutes