To think parents should teach their children how to behave round dogs

[Xihha]

There have been a few posts lately about people needing to control their dogs more (and I agree, if you cant control our dog and clean up after it then you shouldn't have a dog imo), but is it unreasonable to expect parents to teach children to be a bit more careful round dogs?

Whilst walking my dog (on his lead) a child who looked about 10 ran up and stuck his head in my dogs face to make a fuss of him whilst i was picking up doggys poo, without checking if it was ok, there have been other times kids have just walked up and started pulling doggy around, this sort of thing happens a lot, especially in the summer when there are more kids out playing and the parents rarely say anything about it.

It's not really an issue with my great soppy lump of a dog because he loves kids and will put up with anything for a bit of fuss but shouldn't these kids know that you should check with the owners before approaching strange dogs and that even a nice dog can get pissed of if you start pulling it around?

Just thought what about other animals that may bite your child?

You walk through a field of livestock. There is no owner keeping control of the livestock
You go to a petting zoo/farm. There is no staff member present when you feed some of the animals at the petting farm
You walk around a lake disturb some geese with goslings or swans with signets. The swans and geese are wild animals

There is a chance you child will be bitten/ seriously pecked are you more or less likely to keep a closer eye on them?

The thing is though, I like dogs, I think that the vast majority of dogs aren't going to bite...I still taught my children to be polite and kind when approaching them. Until they were old/responsible enough to do that they were supervised.

I don't let them climb in other people's gardens, I don't let them poke other children at the park, I wouldn't let them grab somebody's handbag or prod cats - because it's not nice behaviour, not because I'm scared they might be damaged. Why is it different for dogs?

Lazy et al. I know you say that dog owner should be aware that children are not easy to control ect

But have you thought that since you don't know a lot about dogs or their behaviour/body language that a dog owner might not know a lot about children?

They may not have them, they may not have any friends or family who have them or just not see them frequently so how, if you can't be expected to know about dogs, can you expect them to know about children. Especially if the ones they know are well behaved around dogs?

'I don't let them climb in other people's gardens, I don't let them poke other children at the park, I wouldn't let them grab somebody's handbag or prod cats - because it's not nice behaviour, not because I'm scared they might be damaged. Why is it different for dogs?'

tabula, who has said that it's different for dogs e.g. that it's OK for dogs to behave badly? All the dog owners on here have talked about being responsible for their dogs' 'nice behaviour' ? having their dogs on the lead, making sure that they're calm, under control and in a good position to be approached by children etc.

No one has said they happily let their dogs do the equivalent of trespassing or grabbing handbags. The issue is that dogs could always, potentially, jump up/paw/lick/bite. The point that owners are making is that, given warning and a polite request to approach and touch their dogs, they can almost (not entirely, as dogs act on instinct as well as training and are by definition not 100% predictable) almost guarantee that the dog will be safe for the child to touch.

I meant nearly the opposite of that, lol...why is it ok for children to act like that with dogs when parents stop them doing it with other things?

I would stop my child from running up to a dog and touching it as I have time to react. He is actually unlikely to do this as unless something is right in his path he is unlikely to notice it. In return I expect owners to not let their dog get close enough to my son for him to touch it (ie keeping it out of touching distance from him in the street, not tieing it up in shop doorways, calling it back if it runs directly towards my son in parks, woods, beaches etc) as I may not have time to react and my son may grab at it or kick it if he is in his sn buggy.

My brother has a particularly fluffy cute breed of dog that attracts kids. The poor thing was rescued from a puppy farm and is very nervous - he HATES being grabbed and kids running up to him scare him quite badly. My brother knows that kids like his dog - he tries to tell them they are scaring him, but there are always a few simply will not stop. Why is that okay? Why do their parents continue to allow this?

On one occasion I actually witnessed a toddler charge over, actually put his hand in the dog's mouth while tugging on his ear with the other. Poor doggie just whimpered, the mother of said toddler proudly told us 'oh he's just so comfortable with dogs'. How stupid is that? How would it have been the fault of the dog or my brother if he'd actually snapped in fear?

Yeah kinda overdid it on the actually. Actually.

Katiepoes - according to some people on this thread it would indeed be your brother's fault.

I don't have a little fluffy dog, children still like him, that's fine. I also have children and relatives with children and friends and neighbours with children - it was important to me that he gets on well with children so I socialized and trained him with children right from the day I got him and in fact he was born in a house with children.

Apparently having a child friendly dog and having him walking to heel on a lead, being willing to talk to children about how he prefers to be stroked and wanting him to sit still while they do so isn't enough...I should be walking him at midnight to ensure that children aren't doing something that's blatantly not nice to him.

Poor puppy. I agree Katie, parents need to realize people don't choose to have dogs to please strangers!

Not just people on this thread.

A fluffy dog? Too nervous to be out around children whom the owner has experience of yet taken out among children? Who is being unreasonable here, and putting his own dog in an uncomfortable position? Not just unreasonable, downright irrational.

If you're a responsible owner you do not take a nervous and attractive dog out when there are likely to be children out, and not just for the sake of the dog - a nervous dog is more likely to nip or bite and of course you would put the safety of children first.

If you're a responsible owner who worries about her dog being discombobulated by children then yes, take your dog out after 7 pm when a lot of the usual offenders are safely tucked in bed. No need to wait until after midnight.

"If you're a responsible owner who worries about her dog being discombobulated by children then yes, take your dog out after 7 pm when a lot of the usual offenders are safely tucked in bed. No need to wait until after midnight."

After 7? hahahahahah...like I said, it's been too hot for my dog recently to walk that early, try adding a couple of hours on and I'm still being approached by children.

How do you avoid children? As I said earlier my friend tried for years to avoid children because her autistic child hated babies & toddlers & would shout about how ugly they were and how much she hated then if she saw them. It was incredibly difficult to find anywhere without children.

And still no-one is responding to my question about whose fault it is if my son gets run over because I've left him to run up & stand behind a car he saw was going to move (in order to see the handbrake). Presumably in the eyes of the law it would be the driver's fault. But am I blame free if I just leave him & tell myself that it's okay it's up to the driver to see him because after all drivers should know autistic kids like handbrakes

Difficult. The driver shouldn't need to know that autistic children like handbrakes. But he sure as hell ought to check, check and check again before he reverses. Because children, whether or not they are autistic, forget.

And that is a specific extra danger for your son, so you have an extra duty of care for him. The driver has the normal duty of care that anyone in charge of a car has to look out for small, thoughtless people.

But if I know my child likes dogs (as I did with ds3 when he was 2 years old) I had no duty of care over him? I know that's not your argument curlew bit it is lazy's and math's

He's not small he's 14 - I still have had to drag him away & still manage it while looking after a dog & 2 other children. Not sure why parents of NT kids are deemed to be so incapable of supervising their children and preventing then approaching dogs.

If you have a child who likes dogs a lot (like my ds) and can't be trusted not to run up to one, then you have an extra duty of care. Apart from the normal duty of care that you have when your children are around potential dangerous things.

Wow, this discussion is still going on!

As has been said many times now no one is suggesting that teaching children to be careful replaces a dog owners responsibilities, just that it would help if kids didn't go climbing all over dogs and asked before touching a dog they don't know.

All of you teach your children how to check for cars before crossing the road, not to talk to strangers, to ask before touching other people's stuff, and not to stick their fingers in the plug socket, right? and presumably you tell your children off if you catch them hitting/kicking/pinching another child?

So why would any parent not tell their child that dogs don't always want to play with them and that its not nice to hit/kick/poke/pinch/pull their hair?

I know some children will forget but that's when you expect whoever is supervising to tell them to stop, not just ignore it and if your child isn't old enough to understand that something is dangerous then you shouldn't be letting them out on their own.

Okay I agree with you curlew.

Saintlyjimjams, sorry to be thick but what does NT mean?

DD always asks the dogs 'mummy or daddy' if the dog is ok to stroke, one woman seemed really really impressed that she asked first. She also knows not to distract working dogs, or go anywhere near a muzzled dog. She is 3, it's not rocket science it's common sense. Don't approach dogs you don't know.

NT is neurotypical, as in a child without any SN

Ah, thank you.