Aibu to think it's high time some cyclist haters realised that for every cyclist on the road it means there is one less car.

[rottentomatoes]

On my bike this morning and as is so common a motorist shouted some abuse at me. Why? Because I held the driver up for about 20 secs until they could over take me when the road widened even though I was cycling absolutely legally.

AIBU to think it's high time motorists stopped this and thought about the fact that for every cyclist there is one less car or person squeezed on the overcrowded train system.

Oooh yippee the "road tax" argument. Road tax does not exist. It's a vehicle emissions tax. I pay exactly the same amount as any other zero emissions vehicle.

Aetae of course they pay for road use. Roads are paid for out of general taxation.

Or would you also argue that someone driving a Kia Rio 1.1 or a Yaris Hybrid doesn't have the right to use the road because they are zero-rated for road tax?

I pay £370 road tax a year - does that entitle me to cycle in your mind?

On the school run it's all country lanes and near the end there is a massive hill. I often sit behind cyclists stood up in the saddle, puffing and panting their way up. there's no room to pass safely even if they were in the gutter, so no choice but to pootle along at a safe distance behind them, and yet I still feel horrible about it, as if I am stressing them out by being behind them in first gear.

Is this one of the threads where the OP thinks cyclists are superior and anyone who doesn't will be name called. boooring (almost as boring as listening to the anti-car cycling mafia banging on and on and on and on...)

Sparkling - no it encourages us to pull out the stops :) Are you sure there is no room to pass? Obviously I don't know the road so can't say.

In my experience when I am driving, it is often not the cyclist/horse/agricultural vehicle that is the bottleneck, but the car sitting immediately behind who is too timid to overtake. Knock it down to second gear and foot flat on the floor until it hits the red line people! (ok, maybe not with horses...)

Elderly ditherers in Nissan Micras, I'm looking at you...

Better to take the lane, keep peddling and let cars pass when there's space for them to overtake.

Better for you doesn't mean better overall. It's actually not better for me just because it takes you longer to get back up to speed again. It would be better for me if you stopped and let me pass.

You are the one that has chosen the method of transport that will inconvenience other people, so you are the one who should take the extra time that you need to stop and get back up to speed. Why should anyone else be forced to take that for you?

theodora yes, when you buy a bike at Evans or Halfords, they give you a membership card for the anti-car cycling mafia. It's the rules. If they ever found out that I have 2 cars and 4 motorcycles in addition to the bikes, I'll be sleeping with the fishes.

" You are the one that has chosen the method of transport that will inconvenience other people"

Why the biscuit? Not that I don't love jammy dodgers, I happen to be a big fan, I just don't see the need when what I said was true.

Honestly I think some of you just prefer to fight than to think or engage constructively.

Clouds. as a car driver I KNOW that cycling inconveniences cars...and as a cyclist I know that cars massively inconvenience cyclists.

NO ONE CAN WIN THIS ARGUMENT.

I'm don't cycle on roads, only in country parks or on river routes, so I'd be interested to know how I as a motorist inconvenience cyclists. Being genuine btw.

I don't like cyclists who act like they own the road. That doesn't mean I hate all cyclists but some are so bloody rude. Same could be said for twatty van drivers as well. Some pram pushers are inconsiderate and dangerous as well. Anyone who is aggressive and threatening and dangerous is as bad as the other, whether wearing a thicko grin and a high viz vest, skin tight luminous lycra or a frothy silver cross, it's the ignorance and unreasonable behaviour not the mode of transport. Luckily I have never had to encounter 50 twatty thicko builders or aggressive parents stopping me from getting from A to B, unlike the cyclists, that's the only difference.

It's an utterly ridiculous generalisation.

I can see that in rural areas bikes can cause tailback.

But where I live, the only effect me and my family cycling has on drivers (and yes, like 99% of cyclists I also have a driving license) is a positive one. One less car, for a start, as the OP says.

Not everyone hates cars though. some of us rather like them and do not see them as a burden.

Motorists, in general, inconvenience cyclists by killing significant numbers of them every year. The low level abuse is mostly just unpleasant rather than dangerous but I'd rather my 2 year old hadn't leaned the sign for wanker (from a motorist who failed to read and/or understand the cycle contraflow signs) at quite such and early age.

Whether you love, hate or are indifferent to cars, one less of them means you get where you want to get to faster.

Clouds all road users inconvenience each other. Imagine how much easier life would be if you were the only person on the road? I wouldn't say that cars particularly inconvenience me on the bike, other than occasionally swerving out, or turning without indicating. In the car, I don't get particularly inconvenienced by bikes (or horses or tractors), it might be a 20 second hold up but it's not the end of the world. So perhaps we could all just learn to get along?

And on the motorbike, everyone else is basically a mobile bollard to be dispatched into the mirrors as quickly as possible anyway :)

I live in a rural county where there are many cyclists. Most car drivers and cyclists behave nicely towards one another, although there is the odd spat. I try to cycle on Sustrans tracks which are great, although we do share with pedestrians and cars some of the time. I remember when cycle lanes were put in a few years ago; there was money from the government if councils put them in, so you have this really odd situation of cycle lanes which are, literally, a few yards long. Insanity!

Like other people have said, though, I have learned (the hard way) not to cycle too close to the gutter as it encourages cars to overtake where there is not room because of cars coming in the opposite direction. My closest shave was when I was cycling up a country lane and there was a van waiting at a road junction to join my road. I could see him from a distance and there was nobody anywhere near him (think he might have been on the phone, though - not sure). Literally as I was going to go past the front of his van, he decided now was a good time to start off. I guess he had looked right and left and not seen any vehicles and just not noticed me on my bike!

Have to say as as cyclist, it does make me very careful when I am driving and I come across cyclists.

Clouds I wondered if you actually wanted an explanation.

To start with, cars are very fast and dangerous and they mean that I don't like to cycle on the road at all. Or let my children do so. So we end up using the car a lot which is sad (and perpetuates the problem for other cyclists or would-be cyclists). That is one way.

Cars also pump out huge amounts of noxious gas, which can give rise to breathing issues in cyclists and is very very unpleasant. That's another way.

Cars cause congestion on roads that would otherwise be safely passable

Cars cause pollution which affects the wider climate

Cars often don't see cyclists and cause accidents to them

Shall I go on?

The fact is a world with all cycles or all cars would be much easier, and the best we can do, is to segregate and be courteous to one another.

I avoid roads when cycling so as NOT to inconvenience my fellow car drivers.

You can't just demonise one form of transport and btw - the bikes were there first.

'And on the motorbike, everyone else is basically a mobile bollard to be dispatched into the mirrors as quickly as possible anyway'

Edwina - I know a lot of motorcyclists who do ride that way, but I never do - I'm not in it for speed. I don't see the point.

Motorists inconvenience me as a cyclist by pulling in close so I can't filter at traffic lights, not letting me out when I indicate to turn right, passing me too close in a dangerous way, belching fumes in my face... I'm a car driver too and I know it's annoying to get stuck behind a cyclist for a long time, but that's life innit. We're all entitled to use the road.

Actually cycling in London the biggest hazard by far is pedestrians - especially in zone 1. Most of my most terrifying moments on a bike have been as a result of a pedestrian walking out in front of me without looking. Second up - lorries, just so fucking huge and dangerous to share the road with (see: pretty much all London cycling fatalities). Third on my hit list would be black cabs, especially ones that suddenly pull over for a fare without indicating. So normal family cars are actually fairly far down my list of "inconveniences".

I think there's a difference between an inconvenience caused just by being there, and an inconvenience caused by not driving or cycling properly.

A driver that swerves or turns without indicating is actively doing something wrong, they aren't causing an inconvenience just by being there.

Lorries need a whole other thread. And a whole other system of roads just for them.