To think my former landlord is an utter arsehole?

[SmiteYouWithThunderbolts]

Cross-post (sort of) in Legal Matters, but I really need some advice.

Long story, short version: we had to move out of our old house because there was raw sewage and asbestos throughout the lounge. After two months of staying with family while we waited for it to be fixed, we gave up and accepted the letting agent's suggestion of immediate surrender of the tenancy.

The contractor who uncovered the asbestos said that because the tiles in question were broken up and disintegrating, we needed to stay out of the house because that's when asbestos is at its most dangerous. We had already taken most of our personal effects and furniture out anyway, but the two bedrooms my children had used needed repainting because there were scribbles and marks on the walls. Ordinarily we would have repainted that before moving out because it definitely isn't "fair wear and tear". The rest of the house was awful when we moved in - scuffed walls, hadn't been decorated in years, dirty carpets that stank of dog wee (the LL's dogs btw!) - and was in pretty much the same state, with maybe a few more scuffs on the hall and stairs wall as you'd expect in a high traffic area.

The landlord is trying to keep our entire deposit - over £1000 - and has listed a load of stuff alongside repainting the two bedrooms. Mostly they want US to cover the cost of painting the whole house (except the lounge, that's totally separate and covered by their insurance), making it new and shiny. It wasn't new and bloody shiny when we moved in!

We told them we were raising a dispute with the deposit protection scheme, and they've responded by threatening to take us to court. I don't know what they're thinking of taking us to court for, or if it's a ploy to freak us out and put us off raising the dispute. I just need some helpful advice.

Please be gentle with me on this, lovely vipers, as I'm all stressed out over it already.

There are more details on the thread in Legal Matters here: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/legal_matters/1771838-Disputing-deductions-from-deposit?msgid=39601188#39601188

They won't take you to court - it would cost them more than the £1000 they claim you owe - and I doubt they'd win if they did. The whole point of the protection schemes was to stop things like this clogging up the court system.

Did you have a proper inventory when you moved in? Did it mention any staining & scuffs on the walls?

Unless you have an inventory that says "Immaculate walls, brand new carpets" (which seems unlikely, since that would have been a lie), then your LL is unable to demonstrate to the scheme that you caused any damage - it would be your word against his. In such cases, the schemes tend to come down on the side of the tenant, since it is THEIR money they are protecting, not the LLs.

Write to the scheme, acknowledge the damaged paintwork in the bedrooms but be very, very clear that that is all you are responsible for, and it should be fine.

If the twat then takes you to court, then no judge is going to overturn the scheme decision, so he'll look stupid & will have wasted his time & money.

I'm wondering if there's anything you could potentially counter sue him for. Did he cover your costs when you had to move out of your home through no fault of your own? Has he harassed you in any way? Was the deposit protected within 30 days of your tenancy beginning and were you given the prescribed notice (a bundle of about 10 pages)? This last thing is really, really important.

Ah - I've just seen this on your other thread...

"The original inventory is pretty damning. It describes the house as being very dirty throughout, walls scuffed and marked everywhere, carpets in need of replacing, toilet seat cracked etc"

Then the tosser doesn't have a leg to stand on either in court or via the scheme.

He is trying it on....having been through the process fairly recently, he's bluffing. Our previous flat was filthy when we moved in and the landlord tried to keep our deposit for a 'deep clean' (as there was dust on top of the cooker hood) and the broken washing machine hadn't been cleaned.

We apealed through the Tenancy Deposit Scheme and got our deposit back as the Landlord didn't submit any evidence. It was, as we'd suspected all along a common con trick to help themselves to a nice 'bonus' from our deposit.

Take it to the TDS and ignore all the threats about court action, he is bluffing.

Thanks, Ellie. I hope you're right.

Did he cover your costs when you had to move out of your home through no fault of your own?

Not at all. We asked about alternative accommodation and were told they weren't legally obliged to offer this. We haven't been offered any recompense for the approximately £600 the whole ordeal has cost us in loss of earnings, travel between staying with family and school (40 mile round trip for the school run), storage for our stuff. We haven't factored in the cost of having to move home entirely, but I don't know if we reasonably could go after them for that anyway since it was our choice to leave rather than wait for that house to be fixed up.

Has he harassed you in any way?

Not really. This threat of court action is the most proactive thing we've had from her. We've had to chase up responses via the letting agent, and it took the LL 3 weeks just to get a builder to come in and strip out the sewage-soaked flooring after the drain had been unblocked!

Was the deposit protected within 30 days of your tenancy beginning and were you given the prescribed notice (a bundle of about 10 pages)?

I don't know. I have a deposit protection certificate but no idea if that was done within 30 days. I don't know what you mean by "prescribed notice".

Thanks, ComposHat. That is really reassuring.

He's trying it on

Take it to dispute and let the protection scheme sort it out

My friend's old landlord tried to keep her £1500 deposit to pay for broken glass in a patio door - glass that had cracked due to age - confirmed in a report by an engineer engaged by the Landlord.

The TDS found in friend's favour, deposit returned in full

Lots of threats by LL to take to court, but nothing ever came of it and he would never have won in the first place.

Is it the law now to have a deposit placed in a protection scheme? I'm having the same problem but my ll has the deposit in her bank so no outside body to hear both sides!

Sorry to hijack your thread

I don't have any idea, but what an utter, utter cunt.

freddiefrog - glad your friend got her deposit back. It's a bloody good thing these schemes exist.

Doubtfuldaphne - yes, it's a legal requirement to put deposits into a proper scheme. If this isn't done within 30 days of the tenancy beginning, the tenant can claim back 3 times the deposit amount. (see, I do know some things!)

Doubtful. Yes, it's the law. If a landlord doesn't comply, they can be made to pay back several times the amount

www.gov.uk/tenancy-deposit-protection/overview

I don't know. I have a deposit protection certificate but no idea if that was done within 30 days. I don't know what you mean by "prescribed notice"

OK - so this is really, really important.

When you pay the LL/agent the deposit they MUST, by law, place it in a scheme within 30 days & they also MUST, by law, give you the "prescribed" information.

If your certificate is just a single piece of paper, then that is not enough - it will be a small bundle. This is the statutory information the law says you must have. If there's more than one piece of paper, then this is probably it.

Check the dates that a) you gave them the money and b) it was deposited with the scheme.

If you were not given the correct information &/or your deposit was not protected within 30 days (even if it's 31 days) then, by law, you are entitled to sue for the value of up to 3 x the deposit.

Don't get excited, you might not get it - it's not guaranteed. But you're entitled to ask the court, and they'll consider it.

I should think that if having to move out of the property caused you any financial penalty that you wouldn't otherwise have had to pay (moving/accommodation costs etc), then you would have a case to counter sue him.

If nothing else, you should at least threaten to do that and it might get the git off your back.

Trying asking on HERE. Loads of superb advice from experts.

Good luck - and try not to worry. From what you've said I think it's extremely likely you'll get most of your deposit back and won't be sued.

Also, don't accept responsibility for reprinting the bedroom. You would have done it if you could safely have gone in to the flat to do so but the asbestos meant it wasn't safe. Ergo you can't be expected to pay for that.

Daphne

Your LL is an idiot. Not only can you sue for the cost of 3 x the deposit, they also can't evict you until they've protected it.

The courts don't take kindly to LLs who don't protect deposits.

I think, the LL has to give you the opportunity to put right any damage yourself before paying for professionals anyway

As far as I remember, they can't just go and get a painter to repaint the whole property and give you the bill without giving you the chance to redecorate, even if the property was immaculate when you moved in

can i just correct one thing, somebody up thread asked if the landlord must put the deposit in the scheme as they have it in their bank.

Their are two types of schemes in England - custodial and non-custodial. Both require the landlord to register the deposit with the scheme.

Non-custodial allows the landlord to keep the deposit in their bank and not held by the scheme. The actual workings of the scheme are the same. And the tenancy deposit schemes have the same rules. if the scheme tell the ll to return the deposit they must still do it.

in scotland there are only custodial schemes.

Sorry, yes - holiday is right.

If LL has put it in her own bank account, it must still be registered within 30 days & correct info given.

Has she told you which scheme it's registered with, Daphne? If not - she's in deep shit

Thanks, everyone. Ellie I'll look into that deposit stuff. The certificate doesn't have any other date on it than the date we paid the money, so I'll have to ask the scheme people what date it was lodged with them.

I spoke to Shelter about suing for damages and they gave me some great advice. I just need to look into how small claims court works and work up the courage to get the ball rolling.

I feel much, much better for the advice and information here. Thank you

ellie no worries im good at giving this advice as im a ll at times. Im just shit at taking it and having lots of problems with our own ll over this.

very confusing but rent our house out and rent elsewhere!