to get really annoyed by middle lane drivers?

[cherryade8]

Drove to visit relatives today on the motorway. As usual, there were a few middle lane drivers on the motorway, who were overtaking no one other than an empty lane to the left of them. They cause tailbacks and prevent other drivers overtaking, especially when the second overtaking lane is full of cars trying to get past. Aibu to get really angry with these people?!

The middle lane is for overtaking ffs, not poodling along in whilst the lane to your left is empty sometimes I want to undertake them to demonstrate the lane they are not using in other countries, such as Australia, the police fine you if you're caught in the middle lane whilst not overtaking another vehicle, why don't the police do that here?

PearlyWhites (and others) you're getting too hung up on the speed limit, rather than safety.

Middle-lane-hogging is dangerous as well as being something you can be prosecuted for.

Speeding can also be dangerous but it's not as simple as 70mph = safe, 80mph = dangerous.

What's safer, 70mph on a rainy, dark Monday night in the rush hour or 80mph on a bright, dry Sunday morning on a deserted motorway?

Also, why do you think it's up to you to try to stop other people going faster than you think they should?

I'd advise you check how accurate your speedo is before you get all 'road captain' about other peopple's speed. OH downloaded a GPS speed checking app' for his phone and got me to read it for him while he was driving on the motorway recently.

When his speedo was reading exactly 70mph, the GPS showed we were actually doing about 63mph. He had to speed up until the speedo showed 78mph before we were doing a true 70mph.

I assume everyone knows that speedos are inaccurate and they are allowed to read higher than actual speed, but maybe not?

...coz of all the idiots driving at the frigging speed limit in the middle lane. Even though there are no gaps in the left lane. Am guessing the consensus would be yanbu they are all twats.

Where has anyone said that you shouldn't be in the middle lane if there are no gaps in the left-hand lane?

HabbaDabba
"The consensus here seems to be that I am hogging the middle lane. Even if I am doing the national speed limit?"

That would be because you are.

Spotty so you think it is acceptable to speed but not ok to do the speed limit in the middle lane

See, I hate this Speed Kills mentality, the blind acceptance that adhering to the speed limit is a magical shield that will prevent anything bad happening to you. Its perpetration has left us with the current crop of drivers who cannot actually make judgements for themselves. If drivers could actively assess the situation they were in all the time they are driving then we would have much safer roads.

Inappropriate speed is bad, no question. It is for the driver to assess and decide what is suitable. 90mph up someone's chuff is bad, but then again so is 40mph - I've seen that plenty on a motorway, a driver behind me so close I can't see their headlights in my rear view.

Then again, 90mph on an empty motorway is not a danger, if car and driver are capable. 90mph on a busy motorway if all vehicles are doing the same speed and maintaining an appropriate gap is still not a significant problem.

Germany and the IoM manage OK with no demands for 50mph limits to be imposed. I wonder what they do differently.

WMittens, well, having driven in Germany I beg to differ. Not only would you NOT be in the mdidle lane without overtaking (and immediately back in the inner lane), you would find yourself with cars pulling out in front of you without any warning at all. It's YOUR job, in the overtaking lane to watch out for THEM. Different in the UK, perhaps, but you don't generally see massive traffic problems on the Autobahns and that's because everybody follows that rule.

PearlyWhites... I'd find your driving exceedingly selfish - and dangerous. If somebody wants to come out of the left lane, you make it difficult for them to do that for no reason, not being in ownership of the middle lane and all... follow the code or get off the road and nevermind about the speeders, they will get pulled over (or not) but at least they're generally aware of the traffic around them and not impeding the progress of others.

WMittens, cross-posted with you, mine was to your earlier post. Looks like we share a similar view really.

Good post ShellyBoobs, said more reasonable than I can.

On the subject of speedometers, they are allowed to read up to 10% over, but not read under the actual speed you're doing at all. Speedos are not checked as part of an MOT (or any service, to my knowledge) so they could change over the life of the car and not be noticed.

Putting different-sized wheels (or incorrect size of tyres) on can skew the reading as well.

WM you've hit the nail on the head. Too many drivers these days say things like " I don't speed so I'm a good driver" when they are in fact terrible drivers. The "Speed kills" nonsense is to blame. Its inappropriate use of speed that kills. I'd much rather be travelling slightly above the limit in good conditions whilst totally aware of my surroundings and using correct observation and positioning than be some vacuous blonde pottering along at the limit completely oblivious to everything going on around and thinking about last night's episode of TOWIE

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe Looks like we share a similar view really.

I think we do; I think from what you say we could learn quite a few lessons from the Continent.

Driving slowly along the motorway is also dangerous. Those people that drive oblivious at 60mph are not safe either.

If there are no gaps in the left hand lane, because of lorries or whatever, then you are still overtaking. When there's a gap you pull in.

It's the people that sit in the middle lane of an empty motorway that I just fail to understand.

Putting different-sized wheels (or incorrect size of tyres) on can skew the reading as well.

That's a really good point, Mittens.

Also, when your tyres wear from new (about 8mm) to the legal limit, your speedo will be reading over by another 2.5%, or so.

I am scared by the number of people here who drive on the motorway but don't understand that the middle lane is for overtaking , and as for the poster who asked why you can't undertake..how did you pass your driving test??!
learn the rules people! Ignorance is what causes accidents.

HabbaDabba
"The consensus here seems to be that I am hogging the middle lane. Even if I am doing the national speed limit?"

Yes, you bloody well are!

What worries me is how many think speeding is ok...

So, how was the 70mph limit arrived at?

Do you think that 70mph is perfectly safe and 71mph isn't?

So, how was the 70mph limit arrived at?

That's really interesting subject as well (for a geek like me, it is).

"The 70 mph National Speed Limit was introduced as a temporary measure in December 1965. It is often blamed on Barbara Castle, but at the time the Minister of Transport was Tom Fraser.

The reason given was a spate of serious accidents in foggy conditions, but it is often claimed that the MoT had been alarmed by AC Cars testing their latest Cobra on the M1 at speeds up to 180 mph.

It was confirmed as a permanent limit in 1967, by which time Barbara Castle (a non-driver) had become Minister of Transport.There was surprisingly little debate at the time: the fact that the average family car of the time could only just exceed 70 mph perhaps had something to do with this."

And from Wiki:
"In 1966, at the end of the four-month trial of a blanket 70 mph (113 km/h) speed limit on previously unrestricted roads and motorways, speed checks on the M6 in Cheshire suggested that although cars were actually being driven about 10 mph (16 km/h) faster, they were still usually travelling at speeds below the new limit. The crash rate was lower on the M6 in Staffordshire (the better weather was noted too) and continued to fall on the M5 in Worcestershire as it had before the new limit was imposed, and there was no change in the crash rate on the M6 in Cheshire or on the M1 in Northamptonshire."

I am amazed by the amount of people on here who don't know the rules of the road

As has been said by many many others, keep to the left unless you are overtaking... That is all!

I'm amazed by the number of people on here who get genuinely upset by how other people drive on the motorway. Given how the majority of people drive on motorways in my observation, ie doing at least one thing wrong (too fast, too slow, don't indicate when changing lanes, weave in and out of lanes, cut right in front of lorries, use the emergency slip when there's bumper to bumper traffic, tailgate, don't leave enough gap to car in front, don't know how to merge properly when there is a bleed lane, don't move into the outside lane when there is a bleed lane etc etc etc) I find it very hard to believe that you're all saints yourselves.

People who get so angry about middle lane hogging worry me, I'm sure that it leads to some of the dangerous tailgating in the middle lane that I see all the time.

Sometimes it's necessary to stay in the middle lane for a while, e.g. when there are a lot of slip-roads coming up with traffic wanting to get onto the motorway, it would be more dangerous and slow everybody down to stay in the left-hand lane.

I remember a journey coming down the M1 and some racer-boy idiot who took umbrage at me going 75 down the middle lane, and kept flashing his lights, eventually after about 3 seconds he swerved across three lanes to undertake me on the left, only to nearly crash into a car which was just joining the motorway. Impatience and lack of awareness of your surroundings really is the most scary thing on the roads.

Really OP the Police in Australia fine you? You have to be kidding, not here on WA because everybody bastardsPolice included joins the freeway and goes into the outside lane straight away, drives me nuts. Then they all sit there until they forget their exit junction and drive straight over 3 bloody lanes. I on the other hand sit in the left lane all lonely and pass them all by quietly. WA drivers are taught by monkeys and that's a fact

I've been on the M1 this afternoon taking dd on a god-forsaken shopping trip and by sheer coincidence, some of the overhead warning signs were displaying the message "KEEP LEFT UNLESS OVERTAKING".

I'd actually forgotten that they put that message up sometimes when there's no other information to show.

I think some people on this thread will still probably disagree and believe that the traffic police and highways agency don't know as much as them about which lane to use.

I was on the m1 yesterday and saw that too Shelley. There was also another one that said DON'T HOG THE MIDDLE LANE. Not that it seemed to help, a Skoda with a trailer sat in the middle lane for a good 10 miles ignoring the various large gaps on the left.

As this thread shows middle lane morons all appear to have an excuse for their driving so pointing it out doesn't make any difference.

As this thread shows middle lane morons all appear to have an excuse for their driving so pointing it out doesn't make any difference

Worse, they piously believe they are in the right because they are not speeding

What exactly are we talking here? If I have several cars in the left hand lane that are going slower than I am and I am moving past them am I lane hogging? I mean I may have the opportunity to indicate and move in left once or twice, only for a few seconds later to have to indicate to pull out again to the middle lane to overtake later, only if some asshole is speeding past I have to wait, and slow down to match the car in front of me before attempting a lane change as well, I often just overtake the traffic on the left until I can pull into the left lane at my desired speed.

I can totally understand people being wound up if I were to sit in the middle lane the whole time (which I don't I will always try to have the left lane for preference at the speed limit) but if I am travelling to the speed limit (and obeying the law), then no other road user who is also obeying the law is ever going to be annoyed with me. I also use an app that displays my actual speed so I'm often doing 75 plus on my car speedo.

Sometimes if I am running late I will speed, but in that case as its on me to make that choice I will never flash other road users, if I am breaking the law I have kind of lost the right to get prissy over other road users habits. That said if someone flashes me I will always endeavour to pull over to the left ASAP, because I do not wish to add to the frustrations and the likelihood of other road users making compromised decisions. Unless they are also tailgating me in which case I will slow down and find the nearest convenient place to pull left, not to irritate mind you but to render the situation safer in the event that I do have to slow rapidly I can give the car behind as much of a chance of avoiding going into the back of me. Though this usually only happens in the fast lane when I'm overtaking middle lane traffic, only not at a speed to the liking of the car behind me.

I also never seem to get flashed in the middle lane, so I was not aware there was much of a problem. The one thing that bugs me in this thread is both sides don't seem cognisant of the fact we all have to share the roads, and I'm not particularly bothered with being in the "right" merely beings as safe as I can, after all I am at the helm of a tonne of metal hurtling at speed. Comparing the situation in other countries is not always helpful, as we have a population density that dwarfs that of a lot of other nations, and our roads have to cater to much more use than in a lot of places.

Bottom line is not everyone will drive the same way as you do, and whilst if you can conjure in your mind how yours is the right way more power to you, me I'll wait to see if anyone corrects me on my assessments and factor that in how I drive from then on. I urge you all to do the same and attempt to muster a modicum of patience with other road users.

Dervel

What you're describing sounds perfectly correct and is exactly what I would do, too.

If there's a long stream in lane 1 with gaps which you could only pull into for a few seconds, then yes, of course you should continue in lane 2 (or lane 3 if you're passing a stream in lane 2).

No one should be flashing anyone to pull in, or tailgating them, but I don't think that's the type of behaviour people on this thread are talking about.