to be sad that my DD has now passed gender discrimination 101?

[ICBINEG]

My DD can now accurately pick out the boys and girls in her peer group (age 1-2). Presumably she has successfully identified that boys and girls are dressed differently/have their hair cut differently.

This is entirely due to adult imposed gender discrimination, as she a) isn't looking at them naked, b) can't possibly be detecting the very subtle actual differences in behaviour/appearance.

So lets hurry onto the next lesson:

Society expects girls and boys to behave differently and have different interests, strengths and weaknesses.

Before I could at least wonder if, when she saw in books that all the girls are doing different things to the boys, she might not realise which was which and specifically which group she was 'supposed' to be in. Now I know she will be learning exactly what is expected of her every time a tired old stereotype is rolled out.

YABU and even more so for wasting everyone's time asking the question when you are so convinced that you are not, I suspect that your DD might hate the family photo albums when's she is older.

juggling - no, of course society doesn't just have an unpleasant attitude towards girls. And of course being a girl isn't all negative.

I guess I just read it thinking ... here is a baby who has learned to do something. And it's amazing and you think wow, aren't our minds fascinating?

But then you think about, maybe, when you were 6 and you realized someone thought boys were the ones who got to play football and you didn't - or your little son realized that boys who played with dolls would be called names.

Obviously there would also be good times - lots of them - but lots of those moments where you recognize a difference between one gender and the other, you're doing it because you're realizing that society treats the two genders differently, and that can hurt.

Maybe I am reading this totally wrong, I don't know ...

I don't think it amazing they can tell. I do think it sad that people don't think that children can work it out - they pick up all sorts of subtle cues.
My friend's DS, at 8yrs old had big blue eyes, long blonde hair that he wore in a pony tail and liked to wear a white shirt, with a red tartan kilt. All children just knew he was a boy. (Adults got it wrong)
He is now 18yrs old and has a very nice girlfriend. People talk such nonsense - he chose to look like that when he was 8yrs because he liked it.
So many people think children are so dim and that parents can engineer what they like.

I would think she'll love looking back at everything she got up to and how cute she looked when she was little just like most of us do. My DD was looking at pictures the other day and said "you know that place we went to .... well, I didn't realise I was so small when we went there. I look tiny !"
I doubt she'll be so superficial to care about the clothes she wore or her haircut at 2 !

But, exotic, they are very subtle cues, right? I mean, there is no physical difference other than genitals, which they wouldn't get to see ... not all parents do the pink/blue thing, and even names aren't that reliable. How is it not amazing?

I would think she'll love looking back at everything she got up to and how cute she looked when she was little just like most of us do......I doubt she'll be so superficial to care about the clothes she wore or her haircut at 2

Are you really sure about that?

Btw, I thought most people who went on about gender stereotyping did do what you say people should, juggling. Seems logical to me, but I'm only seeing what people do/say they do!

Kids are pretty amazing. They suss out way more about people than just their gender

I think all the stages can seem sad if you look at them in a certain way. The loss of innocence at each level always seems such a shame. But that's life isn't it, sadly we all grow up. The innocence of youth is fleeting.

I think you have to turn it round and make sure you don't miss the positives in every stage too. There's nothing sadder than someone who spends their time pining for the innocent child they had and misses the interesting child they have iyswim.

I also worry about getting the balance between sharing our beliefs, experiences and knowledge, and letting them make choices for themselves. As much as we want to protect our children from the negative things we've experienced it's important not to shield them too much because they need the tools to cope with what life will throw at them.

However hard it is we have to let them form their own opinions, we mustn't do more than gently guide them. That's why being a parent is the hardest job in the world!

I agree with journey - just leave well alone. My DSs loved a toy kitchen - it was no big deal- it wasn't especially put their way. The huge message I get is that boys things are superior - a girl gets applauded if she wants to be out playing football- but woe betide her if she wants to dress up as a princess. Maybe she likes dressing up and hates football - why not?

I know that people on MN won't have it LRD but there are differences between boys and girls and they pick up on it- despite parents not understanding it. And it is nothing to do with pink.

Yeah, that makes sense randall.

exotic - sure, I expect there are differences, but not physical ones ... that's why I was so fascinated that they'd pick up on the social conditioning so early on, is all.

Sorry to come into the thread and do the whole 'wow, babies!' thing!

As you were.

My DS is 19mo and I still do it regularly

Aww, she is nearly the same age as my niece.

He came out with a 7 word sentence the other day, I couldn't grin wide enough!

It's all pretty amazing when you think about it.

It is!

And wow, bright too.

Darn, you've got me all broody now and I only clicked on the OP cos it looked like a feministy debate.

OP, you have won the award for the Most Absurd Notion of the year.
Do stop the gender hysteria, it's simply daft.

Don't be broody, he has a ridiculously snotty cold. It's been a trying week to put it mildly. It's a good job he's cute that's all I'll say.

And the sentence was only "oh grandma, what you doin, silly billy" he's really not Socrates!

Ha! Love it.

Hope he's better soon.

Because they are not picking up on the social conditioning - they are picking up on the differences.

The problem is that parents are bringing all their knowledge of social conditioning to it. The DC has no knowledge or experience so they just 'know'.

I'd love to meet a 1YO who can tell girls' names from boys' names.

exoticfruits, which differences specifically do you think they're picking up on?

gah now my thread has gotten away without me....

thebody this IS a hobby...this and folding origami flowers....

ICBINEG YOU Have all the answers, so ....

How do you make sure a daughter realises that her body doesn't need improving, from her hair to her toenails?
HOw do you make sure your daughter studies and works hard and understands the importance of these thngs without becoming a perfectionist?
How do you make sure your daughter doesn't go through life needing male approval?
How do you make sure that your daughter can draw a really clear and distinct line between what she wants and what other people want her to be/want?
How do you make sure that your daughter understands that women in the media are portrayed through the eyes of (often) sexist and misogynist men?
How do you explain sexism and misogyny ?
How do you get your daughter to take even a passing momentary interest in feminism when she wants to watch josh and drake?
HOw do you persuade your daughter that she is funny, clever, sporty and an individual with or without that Hollister Hoodie?

Fwiw, my son paints his nails, wears his hair long. NO genderstereotyping in my house. But the no genderstereotyping that 's the easy part. Wait until they're 10-12

AM i SCARING the life out of you? I hope so. pink SHMINK

But surely Elegant, if you join the dots, this whole pink overload in toddlerhood is part of the foundation that all the problems you outline is built upon?