Full fat vs Low fat

[upndown]

Hi
Clearly not an AIBU post, but, I posted a thread on here a few weeks back regarding my overweight daughter (6) (and can't find original thread) and was given some great advice.

I have cut down on too much fruit, smoothies and swapped refined carbs for unrefined - all with success and minimal fuss from my daughter.

I was given advice that I should avoid low fat products and opt for small amounts of full fat. This seemed crazy but I understood the concept behind it and have been allowing my daughter a glass of FF milk to drink and some with her weetabix too. Also, FF cream cheese for a sandwich.

She seems less puffy, still no significant weight loss though. I am trying to make changes a little at the time but she definitely could do with being more active..

Other changes I have made is giving her more protein.

The problem I have, is my daughter received a leaflet from school with advice from change 4 life, advising parents to switch to skimmed milk, low fat yoghurt's and products, up the fruit intake and switch to rice cakes for a healthy alternative. Now, all these things were what I was doing previously!!!

So I am completely baffled now. The guidelines for healthy eating for children are so misleading! I hear all the time that the 5 fruits/veg a day was a marketing campaign, yet the guidelines insist that you have it. I read on one particular website that children of all ages NEED full fat milk, and that fat is not the enemy, sugar is. Yet again, this leaflet insists that fat IS the enemy!

I'm trying desperately to do the right thing for my little girl, but now I am questioning myself again with regards to the full fat vs low fat!

Can anyone enlighten me, or direct me to a trustworthy website!

Many thanks - if you got this far!

And all these low fat bars are a con too. "90%" fat free eh? Well that ten percent is still quite high and when u munch ur way thru the dry cardboardy slices that taste like crap, it turns out you coulda had three squares of dark chocolate or a biscuit or two Jaffa cakes and still have consumed less fat and sugar!!

Lots of processed low fat foods have simply had the fat taken out and lots of sugar added in! If you think about it, a slice of toast with a small amount of butter tastes so much better than several pieces of toast with margarine on it.

I would not be mega concerned if she is not losing weight (as long as she is not gaining) as she should grow taller.

Maybe you could get her a trampoline or sign her up for a dance class (or some other fun activity) so she could burn off some calories?

Changing milk makes such a tiny difference it is hardly worth it full fat milk 3.9% semi skimmed 1.7% it makes virtually no difference per glass. However, using naturally low fat yoghurt which is often only 3% fat and then adding fresh fruit instead of say a thick creamy yoghurt at 17% fat is a huge difference.

Not read the whole thread, so sorry if this is a repeat - but there is a difference between skimmed / semi milk (where they just take the fat out) and low fat yoghurt/snack food, where they take out the fat, and then need to pile in the sugar to make it taste acceptable. Its these that really need avoiding.
Artificial sweetener is also problematic!
I'd avoid low fat (other than maybe milk), and "no added sugar" things.

Would vegetable sticks meet the "fruit and veg" requirement from the school leaflet without the associated sugar high?

Sounds like your doing a great job. have you actually been adviced to get her to loose weight, or just maintain her current weight, and let her grow into it?

The guidelines are wrong - simple as that.

I have a type I diabetic mother who was told to ear lots of weetavix type cereal and toast with marge. So that's what she raised us on. She lost her sight, my dad had IBS and my sister and I battle out weight.

"Conventional" wisdom is so ingrained people cannot see the woods for the trees - even when the evidence is staring them in the face they'll quote low- fat chemical crap.

Nuts and seeds are high in fat but the good fat. They are a great source of protein and contain nutrients great for skin and hair and the brain. They r also slow release. So whereas after a rice cake she would probably want a snack shortly after as its air and cardboard a nutrient dense snack if nuts and seeds would tie her over longer. All these low Dat high sugar snacks cause a sugar crash meaning u need to eat more shortly after to compensate.

my point about calories in fruit was that 5 portions of fruit would have many more calories than 5 portions of vegetables and is not as good for you as veg (because of sugar) but also because of the idea that fruit is somehow a calorie free snack (obviously in relation to packet of crisps/ cakes etc it is much better)
but if fruit was eaten as meal instead of as an extra over and above the meal it would be better still

I do not think the recent trend for grazing lots of snacks is good children I think were generally healthier weights etc when had 3 meals a day with only 1 small snack I am excluding babies and toddlers but I try and give DD 3 deals and 1 snack not always succeeding though

very cynical here but is the 'healthy eating' leaflet sponsored by anyone??

to add to the chorus - low fat=high sugar. Huge con.

lots of complex carbs, minimal sugar. Nothing marketed for kids, nothing marked 'diet'. No cereal bars (solid sugar). Five a day needs to be mostly veg. Obviously sweets, biscuits, cakes are treats without making a big deal of it.
oh, and no smoothies - ghastly waste of good fruit by mashing it up, and the processed ones are stuffed with sugar.

you point out the major thing is that she needs to be more active. With that and the new good diet, she should grow up without growing out.

change4life is from the nhs is it not?

I think it's pretty obvious that there are lots of equally valid pictures of healthy balanced diets, that don't always look much like each other.

You may need to experiment to find what works for you, OP.

I am more worried about hidden sugars than hidden fats, though I would probably offer skim milk with her cereals if I were OP.

Yes, change4life is from the NHS.

I think the problem with it is that while its intentions are good (and I like the aspects such as changing one small thing at a time to make it more achievable), it seems to assume that all parents feed their DCs nothing but takeaways and freezer food, and have never seen an apple or carrot and therefore they all need to be told to eat fruit etc.

OP, if you're interested in reading more about cutting out sugar (why and how to do it), I'd really recommend The Sweet Poison Quit Plan by David Gillespie.

The book recommends full fat rather than low fat products for all the reasons already given on this thread, and although it's written for adults looking to kick the sugar habit completely you might find some useful stuff in there.

I agree with the other posters about 'fat free' often meaning 'stuffed with sugar' - very true...

When it comes to portion size, something I remember from somewhere is that a 'portion' is the amount you can fit comfortably on the palm of your hand, a really good way of working it out, especially for primary school-age children. Doesn't apply to veg though, heap it up!

A big yes also, to exercise, swimming, walking to school, etc etc. Loads of fresh air really helps them get a good night's sleep too.

Something that's often missed with all the talk of diets/eating plans etc is that it is NORMAL TO FEEL HUNGRY and have to WAIT FOR YOUR DINNER!!!

I think definitely full fat in smaller quantities. Full fat milk and yoghurt (as long as it's not Greek Yoghurt) are both still low fat products. Even low fat yoghurt that is not full of sugar may be bulked out with low nutrition additives. It's just pointless food.

And bear in mind at your daughter's age, she is less likely to lose weight than an adult. It is more likely that her weight will plateau and she will slim down as she grows taller, if you see what I mean.

You've had lots of good advice here OP, be confident in the changes you've made. Change4Life has very good intentions but they have to work on the lowest common denominator and so are assuming a very bad diet.
Don't be afraid of fruit either - it has sugar, yes, but the sugar is combined with fibre in the way Nature meant it to be. Cut down on fruit juices and smoothies where the fibre has been destroyed. Of course vegetables are better than fruit, and if your DD loves vegetables then great, but let's face it lots of us don't.
I'm pretty sure that the 'low fat' government messages will eventually be seen as appalling misinformation which caused an obesity epidemic.

Another one advocating full fat. Sugar is the big problem and many "experts" are now beginning to agree.

Skimmed milk tastes like liquid cardboard - I wouldn't inflict the stuff on anyone, let alone my DC. As has already been said by others full fat milk is 4% fat which is below the traditional 5% threshhold for things to be considered low fat anyway

There's an interesting American study about half fat milk. In America the guidelines are from 2 years switch to half fat milk, however the toddlers who move to half fat are more overweight than toddlers on full fat milk. Researchers believe this is because full fat milk is more filling and satisfying and therefore less is consumed.

So I would stick to full fat until 8 years and then move to half fat.

I was also brought up to believe kids needed 7 small portions of veg (which also includes pulses and legumes) and 2 small portions of fruit. But the key is to have small portions and include as much colour as possible.

Apparently a dinner portion for a child should be fist sized, and added to on request. And snacks should be given but only if asked for and a flat tablespoon in size.

I did a course when my dd was small about food and portion sizes it was meant to be an allergy course run by the dietician at our local hospital but it covered a lot more and was really interesting. I hope some of this can help.

Interesting blog post here about US milk production/skimmed milk myths.

Low fat usually has more sugar in- check the values per 100g on the back. Research as I understand it has been supressed for a long time about the dangers of XS sugar- largely to keep the big sugar businesses happy. With the explosion of type 2 diabetes in this country ,the truth will soon come out.

You could read In Defense of Food by Michael Pollan. I think he does a good job of explaining why this is actually really hard: we just don't know the underlying science and we may never know some of it. We don't know why carrots are better for you than the various things we find in the carrots, the beta-carotene, the fiber, the carrotty sugars vs other sugars, the thousands of complex things we don't know about yet, or some special combinations of them. He describes some of the history behind the food guidelines and theories, and it's very interesting. His conclusion is that some people think the fat is the problem, or particular fats, some think it's the carbs, some think it's the refined carbs/sugars, some thing it's the omega 3s that hold the key, and we don't really know. His advice? Eat food (ie real food, not processed), not too much, mostly plants.

I'm sure you'll still do pretty much what you're doing now, which sounds very good. But maybe it would be some consolation to know that there are reasons why so many of the guidelines and leaflets out there are such crap!

I don;t know if anyone has mentioned this yet as the thread quite long already but you shouldn't expect her to lose weight. You need her to keep growing taller without putting on weight.

Just to manage your expectations.

Excellent point about eating different coloured veg. OP, this could be a really good way of increasing veg consumption if DD isn't keen. They say "eat a rainbow" :) - in general, different coloured veg has a different balance of nutrients, so to really get the best from your food it is good to eat a varied range of colours. You could make a game or challenge out of it! Have fun finding new different colour veg each week, and compare taste etc. :)

Also a very good point above about it being ok to go hungry! I have been guilty of giving snacks to my DCs too often because I don't want them to be hungry. DH is even worse for this as he was neglected as a child so hunger has a vastly different meaning to him. But I am trying to cut back on this now, and make it clear that dinner will be in an hour or whatever and it won't do them any harm to wait.