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AIBU?

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Original poster

"New" car (demo model....)

23 replies

bumperella · 23/01/2013 14:12

I bought a "new" car at end of Dec, apparanrly a demonstrator model. I'd double checked with him becuase online it had been listed as having had 2 owners. He said (repeatedly) that he'd checked and it defintiely had only 1 owner. Got the registration cert today, and (you guessed it) it had had 2 owners. Called dealership today and said I would return the car and have a full refund (more because I was mad as hell). They will "phone me back later this afternoon".
I'm actually happy enough with the car. And I think I got an OK price on it. But am sure this isn't an honest mistake (the dealership is a big chain but hasn't got a good reputation), and I really object to someone telling me bare-faced lies.

So, would I be unreasonable to ask for some of the purchase price to be returned (and if so, how much?), or should I stick with my demand a refund and buy the same type of car elsewhere? I'm surely within my legal rights to return car following their dishonesty?

OP posts:
ahusband · 23/01/2013 14:17

Unless you have written proof it is your word against the car salesman's. I doubt therefore that you are entitled to anything.

valiumredhead · 23/01/2013 14:21

I am confused

ActionLiposomes · 23/01/2013 14:23

Tricky one. He might argue that he was referring to what would have been only 1 previous owner, before you bought it.

If you're otherwise happy with the car and price paid, I would probably not bother returning it but I might push them to provide e.g. free servicing for a year or 2, to make up. That will actually cost them very little, and might make you feel better about it.

Original poster
bumperella · 23/01/2013 14:29

Exactly - a demonstrator model would have one owner (the dealership) as it would have to be taxed to go on teh road. It had about 500 miles on it, so effectively nothing. But clearly it's not only a demo model at all, as it's been owned by the garage plus a private individual.

The car salesman told me and my husband it had one owner (the dealership). And when I called today he claimed that it had only one owner (the dealreship) despite me having the cert in my hand at the time. I guess he could now deny he'd ever said any such thing. But I don't feel that their lying means that I'm in the wrong - it's not like they said "it's a nice car" and I disagree, it's a hard fact that they have been dishonest about, repeatedly.

OP posts:
ActionLiposomes · 23/01/2013 14:31

Owners are not the same as keepers. It's the number of keepers that are listed on the document. It might have been owned by the dealership all along, but looked after by 2 staff members, hence 2 keepers.

ahusband · 23/01/2013 14:36

I don't think anyone has said that you are in the wrong because you aren't. Unfortunately car salesman are prone to lying in my experience and unless you have written evidence that they have done so, there is very little you can do.

ActionLiposomes · 23/01/2013 14:41

Just to be clear I wasn't trying to defend them, just trying to pre-empt excuses from them. I don't doubt you were misled.

Original poster
bumperella · 23/01/2013 14:44

I think am going to see what they come back with. I'mpretty sure that legally a spouse can count as a witness, and either way sales guy did say on the phone that he had genuinely thought the car had had one keeper (the dealership) when I bought it - so hopefull it'll not simply come down to my word against salesman....

If the garage are unhelpful I'll maybe see what Trading Standards say. I jsut can't stomache the idea of letting them away with lying to me.

OP posts:
DrGoogleWillSeeYouNow · 23/01/2013 14:49

...Online it had been listed as having two owners.

I don't think you have a leg to stand on tbh.

Original poster
bumperella · 23/01/2013 16:37

Even though I specifically questioned this and they told me the web-site listing was an error?
I agree if I hadn't asked it would be my own problem, but I did, and he very clearly told me the only owner was the dealership. Then he told DH the same. Then he told us again when we were together.

OP posts:
ShatnersBassoon · 23/01/2013 16:47

Would you have bought the car had you known there'd been an additional owner? Would it have been a dealbreaker?

mum11970 · 23/01/2013 16:52

It could possibly have had log books in the dealership name and the owner of the dealership's name, technically two owners but both are the same person.

memphis83 · 23/01/2013 16:59

I think the way they will get around it is you should have checked the logbook when you signed it as it would have said how many owners were on it.
We had this with a motorbike, something wasn't highlighted when we bought i so I queried it, we got a few extras added on to it as a good will gesture.

NotADragonOfSoup · 23/01/2013 17:07

It could have been transferred from another dealership.

Original poster
bumperella · 23/01/2013 18:13

The address of "last keeper" is A Bloggs, Flat 1, 2 Avenue Drive, ABC Town. ...i.e clearly a personal address, not a business. The form whatever-it-is from DVLA shows 2 previous owners, which I only got today - the dealership told me it was held at a larger branch who would send it to DVLA ec. The warranty/service record shows one owner (the dealership). I don't know why the last owner wasn't listed on the warranty docs.

I wouldn't have bought the car with 2 previous owners. The extra owner suggests that it COULD be a "friday afternoon" car - i.e. one that's had recurrent faults after every few hundred miles, and t been sold on/returned to the dealership after a few repairs. Also if I decide to sell the car after x years then the extra owner might out off potential buyers.
Neither sounds like a big reason, but whislt the car was a fair price am sure I could find the same make/model as ex-demo or pre-registered for the same price elsewhere, with only one previous owner.

OP posts:
DrGoogleWillSeeYouNow · 23/01/2013 18:36

Have asked DH, he says if the car is a true 'demo model' then there would actually be NO previous owners, you would be the first. Even the dealership would not be listed as a previous owner.

What exactly did the ad say... Word for word?

Original poster
bumperella · 23/01/2013 18:46

No idea what the ad said now - I saw the car at the dealership first, then looked on internet that evening for similar - one of which is the one that I'd seen that day already. So I've forgotten the wording now (useful...! not). But it was one of those brief one-line type things, showing make model, mileage, number of owners, reg number, a tiny picture, and that was it.
I thought that it was pretty normal for dealerships to pre-register new cars (to fudge their sales figures) and some of those may well then be used as demonstrators? I'm not that bothered if it was a demo model or if it had been used as courtesy car or whatever else. just that it should've had only 1 owner (obv I know the age and mileage are right).

OP posts:
DrGoogleWillSeeYouNow · 23/01/2013 18:56

I think in that case it's 'buyer beware' and up to you to check you were happy with everything before you handed over any money.

The only thing you and the dealer have in writing in terms of the number of registered owners is the advert, which does state 2 previous owners.

Try posting in Legal and see if anyone there could help?

ZenNudist · 23/01/2013 19:03

It could have been a car supplied for fleet use but then returned fairly quickly if employee left, this happens with flexible lease agreements I was told when I got a new car recently. That way there could be two owners.

I think car value goes on age (plate), mileage and condition. Number of owners doesn't really come into it. The idea to try and wangle free servicing is a good one if you want to stick at complaining. Try the line that if the dealership mid advised about this important point what's to say this isn't in some way a dodgy car, cut and shut or clocked, say you expected you'd be able to trust large dealership brand but you are very dissatisfied, wouldn't have wanted the car if it was pre-owned (as you were expecting only pre-registered) as you now have no way of guaranteeing that the car was well looked after in it's first x thousand miles.

Incidentally how many miles were on it when you got it? A dealership car would have been low miles.

Perhaps for your own peace of mind ask them to give you whatever the true story is about the car so you aren't left wondering g if you've been sold a dud or enquire about taking out an extended warranty.

Original poster
bumperella · 23/01/2013 19:51

I did check I was happy with everything before paying - but part of that checking was verbal confirmation. I remeber saying to the sales guy something like "well, when I get the reg docs if it has more than 1 owner I'll be bringing the car back /firebombing yr offices" (a lame joke).

I'm 99% sure that under Scots law (where I am) such verbal assurances stand regardless of what an ad might say, especially as I was specifically told that the ad was wrong. I take the point that prooving it might be tricky though!

OP posts:
Original poster
bumperella · 28/01/2013 22:41

UPDATE: I got a full refund, without any raised voices/threats of Trading Standards/whatever....
I just explained the situation, they acknowledged they had made a mistake which was misleading, and so gave me a full refund, and a voucher for free servicing as a goodwill gesture (I didn't ask fo the voucher - they just offered it). Simple.

OP posts:
valiumredhead · 29/01/2013 09:21

Oh great that's good! :)

YesIamYourSisterInLaw · 29/01/2013 21:36

That's a good update, glad you got your money back

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