Oh bless George Osborne is giving up his child benefit

[PolkadotCircus]

......soo all us very squeezed middle parents should feel a whole lot better.

He's written to The Daily Fail to let us all know of his sacrifice and how it is the "fair and right decision".

George would just like to ask how exactly is it fair and right that amongst the other 85 % of families who will still get child benefit there are many earning far,far more as a family than many losing it?You know those on 80,90 and even 100k.

Also if you come from another European country you'll keep it regardless of what you earn,again how is this fair or right?

You waffled on proclaiming the need for your other cuts but frankly I didn't bother reading any further as being part of a party with such blatant disregard for fairness or common sense I felt it was a waste of my time reading anything else.

Oh and being worth£4 million with a nice wallpaper million £ trust fund on top doesn't really qualify you to lecture those of us hard working families at the other end of the food chain on making sacrifices.You know those of us that have always worked hard, with zero trust fund,private education or Oxbridge network to get us on in life.Those of us that you keep clobbering time and time again.

The fact you seem to think we're all coffee drinking yummy mummies who could go without a months worth of manicures to cover our loss of CB just shows how ridiculously out of touch you really are.

Now if you'll excuse me I'm just going to put another jumper on(central heating isn't often on these days and we don't have a WFA to fall back on like many wealthy pensioners).Need to get Dp up so he can sort out his bike for work Monday.That would be the push bike he cycles many miles on each day after a demanding day of work as we've been priced out of public transport.Also need to try and eek out 3 times packed lunches for Monday from the meagre offerings in my Lidle filled cupboards as currently on day 4 of our no spend January and can't afford school dinners.

Anytime you want to give me tips on stretching our meagre budget even further in order to cover our loss of Child Benefit feel free!

One can hope and pray, Orwellian

Orwellian- I think you're mistaken; I think conservatives will win again next time because pensioners will vote for them- none of the cuts have affected pensioners, most have hit the young. (And before anyone says 'well day centres have closed down' etc, the stock response to that is 'but the government havemt closed any day centres, local councils have closed them')
Pensions have been protected , always at the cost of the young.

re, welfare bill, landofsoap is correct that the bulk of it goes to pensioners. IIRC only a fraction goes on unemployment benefits. And the Tories knew full well that screwing the economy with self-defeating 'cuts' would create more unemployment and underemployment, businesses struggling and collapsing, and tax receipts shrinking - it's a stupid way to act if you actually want to balance the books.

Captain you're right(I think),tis to do with clawing back it in tax and I confused it with the CB paid out to European children not living in the UK but whose parents are working here.

www.money.aol.co.uk/2012/10/30/are-child-benefit-cuts-illegal

Apologies!

Re pensioners how many actually are there?They didn't vote enough last time to get the Tories complete power so I don't see how they will next time even with said Tories pandering to them.Also a lot of pensioners with young families are getting hacked off(mine are) too.

Also I assumed it was all child benefits European nationals were protected from paying back not just those from their own country which that article indicates is the case.

Pensioners with young families?
Do you mean pensioners with children who have young families?

Cameron promised not to touch the WFA or free TV licence for 75yo+ during this parliament, so presumably up till 2015.

There is an interesting article in the FT from 26/09/12 by Chris Giles
title is "Tories vulnerable to ?grey vote? anger", so I don't know how it will go. Fewer young people as a percentage vote though. Pensioners - 9.2 million people, around 18% of populace, and there are around 15m under age of 19.

captain nancy> pensioners with young families. I know a 65 year old whose gf is just about to give birth

I can't stand the tosser, I really can't

I meant pensioners with children who have young families,apologies again. My parents are getting mighty hacked off with us (their grandchildren)being constantly clobbered.The CB has really hacked them off particularly as they have 2 dc- 1 of which is keeping it(the wealthier one) and one which is losing it(the less wealthy).

pensioners will turn out to vote which is why they are being protected at the expense of the young and families. Even my dad who is sitting on a good pension says winter fuel payments are a joke - he gives his to us because we're so hard up mostly thanks to this government!

God, do we really have to put up with this government until 2015. I don't think I can cope with another two years of really crap policies. Help!!!!!!!!!!!

Love your name ihategeorgeosbourne

I do too, the fucking that that he is

I am fuming!

Im with you test bunny, labour need to maximise the general feeling expressed here about the unfairness of the benefit changes, particularly the child benefit changes. I do hope this is the condems poll tax, and does for them. Always winter and never christmas when the tories are in power

The man is an asshole. The fact that he can stand there and say the changes are fair is astounding.

They won't be getting my vote that's for sure.

''Dreaming "I can't get my head round the fact that one person earning 60k takes home around £3400 per month. A couple who earn 30k each take home £3800 per month between them. How can it possibly be fair that the couple who take home more money still receive child benefit yet the other doesn't"

£30K x 2 couple has astronomic childcare costs which should be taken into consideration if you really want to compare incomes fairly''

Yup. I have 3 children 6, 5 and 2. The 5 year old started school in Sept. So i have one still on full days and 2 on wrap around childcare. Most months my childcare is around £1500, meaning that we have to earn c£27,000 untaxed salary to cover cc costs. My youngest will start school in a little under 3 years, when cc costs will reduce but not go away. (FWI i work a 4 day FT week and we use a CM rather than nursery, so our costs are not as great as some people's). i'm not bleating about having to pay for cc, we chose to have 3 children, but am challenging the overly simplistic way that many people are prepared to look at the new CB rules. The fact is that in the example used by 'Dreaming', if the cc costs involved in allowing those 2 £30k earners to go to work are anything like mine, then one salary is effectively negated, when travel costs, holiday cc costs (3 children on full days x 4 days pw) etc. are factored in and the family are actually living on one £30k salary, in which case, i'd expect losing CB to have a fair impact on HH budget.

We will not lose CB but do fall into the category that everyone seems happy to identify as 'winners' in this new carve up, when in truth a great deal of our hh income is taken up with actually making it possible for both of us to go out to work in the first place. Presume the Cameron/Osborne are happy enough for everyone to continue to squabble amongst themselves as it prevents any sort of consistent, organised challenge of the policy itself not to mention backtracking on pre-election promises not to come after CB.

It's probably grossly politically incorrect to say so but George Osborne has the kind of self-satisfied, smug, stupid face I'd want to punch even if I didn't know what he was like. The fact he's an arrogant, hypocritical, unfeeling, inhumane absolute tosser just makes me want to hit him even more. What he's doing - the way he's going about it - attacking the most vulnerable in society - and then "justifying" that with the most intelligence insulting excuses imaginable makes me quite literally want to be sick. This latest display of completely-missing-the-point over him - or Mrs O - giving up their CB is absolutely typical ..... so that's alright then, that'll make everyone feel better.

As other posters have pointed out already yet another worrying aspect of the whole CB fiasco is the impact upon women (usually, though technically this might also apply to men) in financially (or otherwise) abusive relationships. It matters not a jot if your household is in the top 15% or whatever if you are a SAHP and your partner controls the purse strings. CB was often the only income women (usually) didn't have to ask for, justify and/or beg for (in some cases) from someone who begrudges every last £. Quite how this is all going to pan out I don't know because only the recipient of CB can actually cancel it - the higher earner can't actually do that - and arguably the recipient could deny receiving it to their partner, and/or the higher earner could claim to know nothing about it on their Self Assesssmnet form .... whether HMRC link recipients of CB with higher earners at the same address via computer records is yet to be seen (which brings into play issues of financial privacy) ...... but undoubtedly, at least some abusive higher earners will be aware of these changes and will have received a letter from HMRC already. It doesn't take a lot of imagination to realise that some women (usually) will have been ordered to stop the CB as their partner won't want to pay it back via SA. If those women protest at the loss of £xx a month, their partners will be shrugging their shoulders and telling them it's "their" problem and not his, or, telling the woman to "get a job" (easy of course when there are so many jobs around, and childcare is free (not)), or, saying to her that she "only has to ask him if she needs to" - when the woman knows full well that every £ is handed over with huge reluctance, resentment etc and that one way or another she'll pay for it. The net result for women - and children - in those situations will be a reduction in their standard of living and possibly health too if food has to be cut or compromised on (even more than it may be already). The removal of this money will also make it harder for women scrimping and saving a pittance in an effort to raise enough to be able to leave a financially and/or emotionally and/or physically abusive relationship .....

.... all that might sound far fetched to people who are in normal respectful relationships but many women are controlled by financially abusive men and regardless of the argument for women retaining financial independence, not giving up jobs etc., there are many who have little choice in the matter. Maybe they have children with SN and can't work, maybe they can't find a job or their earning capacity is low (whole host of reasons for that, doesn't mean they're lazy, feckless or thick), maybe they were "promised" they'd be "looked after". I've read many threads on here (and elsewhere) about women living in fabulous expensive homes who literally don't have a penny to their name. Women - and kids - who scrape by, go without meals, eat poor quality food and so on, not because the household income is low but because they're stuck with an abuser. The changes to CB take absolutely no account of this ..... I've not seen a single official statement, or any form of advice, for women in that particular situation. There is no acknowledgement of the fact that some women and children do live like that even if their partner earns £90k. To my mind, the complete failure - as far as I know - to recognise the position of abused women (in particular) is as good as saying "tough shit - we don't give a fuck".

The letter from HMRC amongst all its blurb states that you and your partner should "jointly decide" what to do about the proposed changes if your household is affected. Again, even if you do leave aside the principle of personal and private finances and taxation - which that suggestion tramples all over - what it doesn't recognise is that in some households the idea of an equal, non-pressured and civilised conversation in which two people look at all the pros and cons, as well as agreeing how best to absorb the loss of an not insubtantial sum (will be at least £81 pcm) from the household budget is NOT going to happen. Rather - the abusive partner will decide what to do and will TELL the abused partner what's happening end of. Or, in homes where somehow this news has totally escaped the abuser altogether, some women might decide to keep receiving CB anyway but live in fear that when and if their partner finds out there'll be big trouble - as he'll have to pay it back.

I know I've gone on about this and maybe most people don't actually care about the sort of situation I've described - I suspect some would simply say any women affected thus should simply LTB - but as soon as these changes were first mooted, I could see how it would make the lot of financially abused women that much harder. And what's struck me since is just how little many people seem to care about that - and quite obviously the government doesn't care one iota! It makes my blood run cold thinking about how some women must be feeling right now.

Brian but you'll have CB for years and your child care bill will plummet before disappearing completely.You also get vouchers and more and more families are using grandparents(and other creative methods) which has been widely reported thus have no bill at all.

Child care bills just aren't an excuse for blatant unfairness.

Just seen Boris Johnson's bit in the Telegraph omg it was hysterical apparently having CB is akin to several"decent" ski-ing holidays(no idea what a non decent ski-ing holiday is as we couldn't afford to take the dc to our local ski slope for an afternoon let alone a proper ski-ing holiday) or filling the cellar with wine( that wouldn't be the weekly bottle of Sainsbos savers vinegar wine Dp and I share then Boris).

Honestly they have absolutely no idea of reality- if you want a laugh read it.

I'm also a relatively high earning single parent, losing CB and only having one tax allowance in my household, not two, but paying all childcare costs myself. To add insult to injury I'm not entitled to childcare vouchers because my job status is self-employed. I really do not understand this - why does my childcare not count as deductible whereas the childcare of the people I employ does?

The only thing that could add to my rage would be if they brought back some sort of tax allowance for marriage. So I could then be the single parent who doesn't get CB, childcare vouchers or a bonus for being married and who meets every single household cost on one salary.

Dr I'm waiting for that-Dp and I are 22 years happily unmarried here-seriously I'll combust when it happens.

I think I'd take him a bit more seriously if he didn't have a rent free home, thousands in expenses on top of his 6 figure salary and a trust fund. The wanker has no idea what it is like in the real world.

Yes we are loosing it because DH's company benefits push us over the limit (how fucking dare he have a car which is essential for work) whilst our neighbours who's joint income is 20k more than us keep it.

Oh and labour aren't doing anything because they are just as bad as this shower of shits. They are all in this for themselves.

I wish I could add something intelligent and insightful, but all I can say is what a cunt.

And, and, and, he and his miserable wife were unutterably rude to my mum who was a gamesmaker at the olympics. Incredibly snooty and completely looked down their noses at her.

Also, I remember someone refering to the fact that tax was private but people were being compelled to share this information (yes, I know couples are supposed to share this stuff but don't actually have to). Why should my DH have to share his private tax information? Surely this goes completely against the principle and possibly the legality of the system?

Well, of course Boris is another one. Though arguably rather more of a dangerous character because at least he makes a bit of an effort to come across as this lovable buffoon type character, always willing to get stuck in and have a laugh, I love London, I love the Olympics ra ra ra and all that ... presumably hoping to get votes on the basis of his personality rather than his politics. But he's cut from exactly the same cloth .... I'm picturing that picture of him and various other priviliged Tory boys in that Bullingdon club photo where every single one of them seems to be sneering at the camera.

Quite obviously everyone in receipt of CB has been spending it on decent skiing holidays or filling their cellars with wine. Because all parents have cellars don't you know. That's what CB's for. I'm sure everyone can forego those little pleasures without any real suffering - but I pity Winter holiday operators and specialist wine suppliers because clearly their profits are now going to take a massive hit.

Ignorant pigs the lot of them.

Oh yes catsmother, I loathe that photograph too. Just wants me to slap their smug faces.