AIBU or completely niave to think that you if you have children you will alway be better off working?

[tittytittyhanghang]

Will try to keep it short, but essentially dsis and her dp are unemployed with 2 children. She is in a private let, at a reasonable price (£450/month), which is all paid for her at the moment. Her and her dp are trying to find work (theres not much going tbh but good luck to them both anyway). She is worried basically that if one or both of them get jobs (most likely mw and part time) that they will be worse off. Am i niave/unreasonable to think that even taking into account of the higher private rent that she will not be financially worse off working as surely child/work credits and maybe some housing benefit will ensure she is better off?

Four pounds a week might not mean much, but it can be a loaf of bread, some cheap ham, a tub of margerine and a bottle of squash. That's lunches for half a week...

Maybe he should try sorting out the cost of effing childcare then?!

I know LOTS of people who have been left on their own (DV or OW's, mostly) with 3/4 DC's. They ALL want to work, but the childcare costs are prohibitive.

In one of my friend's cases, she can only earn NMW. She has 3 pre-school DC and one school-age. (Pre-school twins last pg).

Her childcare for a 3-day a week job would be an eye-watering £552 a week. Tax Credits will pay £210 of that, and her earnings would pay another £138 of it.

So with her TC's for childcare AND her wages combined, she would STILL owe £204 a week on childcare. Her CTC would be £217 a week, so she would be left with just £13 a week to pay all her bills, food for a family of 5, and her travel to Nursery, School-age childcare and work.

And no, she doesn't get any maintenance, her bastard ex has gone SE and is fudging the figures, paying it all to his OW.

THESE are the people that are going to be hurt in the Welfare reforms - those who have 3+ DC's, have been left as Lone Parents, and are getting no maintenance because their exes are cunts. People that actively WANT to work, but equally actively want to feed their DC's...

HOLY SHIT child care costs that much. OMFG.

Sorry, Im speechless,I knew it cost more over there but HOLY SHIT, how does anyone afford that kinda money?

I paid $240 a MONTH at nursery for my youngest and now shes in school, the extended morning program,Im assuming similar to breakfast club,costs me $175 a month. You get a 10-20% discount if you have more than 1 in too

Seems to be localised to SE commuter towns, where lots of people work in London, these bloody ridiculous childcare costs. Doesn't help people working locally for two peanuts and a cobweb though...

It is madness when you are better off not working.

Universal credit will sort this problem out for families like ours. 4 kids. Under universal credit we will face a cut of £55 per WEEK! Partner has just started part-time as there are no full time jobs at the moment, we are getting less than benefits when we take travel costs into consideration. Under universal credits we would still lose the £55 if we work or don't but we are praying his hours go up, or I can find a few hours, so we can make ends meet. We have taken a gamble, we have to. We know so many people going under financially right now, it's scary. We have been living off CTC for 2.5 weeks now, wages won't come in for another 3 weeks as the end of month happened a week after he started work. We are hoping a grant comes in or we can't pay for the fuel to get him to work. Work does not always pay..

It's not just London commuter towns, Couthy. I'm in East Anglia, and my costings were for local nursery cost compared then to now. Not commuting to London at all .

And my childcare costs are cheap compared to what people are paying in Cambridge. It's insane.

unfortunately OP you are being naive.
A lot depends on how much their extra costs would be. Ie, travel and extra in rent and council tax. A lot of the time it is area dependant. In places where rents are generally lower it can be quite easy to cover the extra £100 or so. Where we live the average rent for a 3-bed property is £1000 - £1200. The benefit is the same regardless of where you live... you see the problem?
So, we would need to find more like £700/month just for the rent. Not easy when you would only be working part time.

The nursery where I work would cost you £800 for a full week....

But yes CM is right, 3 dcs and your averaging out the same as signing on/IS 4 dc your better off on benefits. But good luck finding a job once your dc have left home if you've not been working for years and years.

1 or 2 dcs you are better off working. Again I have 2 dc and I'm better off working after rent council tax and CC (mine are in school so it's only breakfast club and holiday club for me) by £78 PW not sure what that is a month.

It's better for us to have me at home. Otherwise I'd have to earn twice my wage just to pay for full time childcare. Unfortunately our relatives aren't in a position - age/own commitments - to have the twins as well as the other children. I can stay home, keep house and bargain hunt to save us money. Win win here.

I think it depends on their personal situation and what job/s they get.

I will not be going back to work after DC2 is born in January as the childcare costs for 2 children + commuting costs will be more than my take-home pay. It's shit, I like my job & I like having a job, but I simply can't afford to work!

I'm too scared to work out the difference between what I earn for working full time and what I would get for being unemployed.

I suspect it's between £50 to £100 a month, but it would make me feel very sick to know the actual figure.

I have a job though, and it's one I don't mind doing so I just think of that. But I miss my son.

People always ask for cheaper childcare but how would that be funded? Nurseries must have huge overheads, staff, heat, food, milk, equipment, some give out nappies, The nursery staff get paid v little as it is. If we want our children to be cared for in a nice environment with safe outside space motivated trained staff, decent toys, decent food surely we have to be prepared to pay for it. There's no public money available. Maybe Surestart / LA nurseries could be expanded? I don't know the answer but it's a question that always vexes me.

I wish. I figured out when pg with DS1 that I couldn't afford to return to work after ML. Even with work having a childcare voucher scheme, because I had only just started my 'career' so we had to make do on one salary and tax credits/ child benefit. I haven't any experience of nurseries, but the preschool my children went to cost £1000 per term (12 weeks, 3 hours a day Mon-Fri) prior to their funded hours kicking in. The cost of childcare is prohibitive so unless you earn more than the average wage or have family willing to look after your DC for nothing then you will really really struggle.